Am I the only One?
POSTED BY: Chewie
UPDATED: Thursday, October 5, 2006 02:46
VIEWED: 15226
PAGE 2 of 11
LOL! "anti-evil"? Is there such a thing? But I do agree with you. Its really sad that come election day we shall be forced to choose between the lesser of two evils, instead of the right or just person.
I wish we had a candidate that was "anti-evil".
Chewie
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Fascism is a powerful meme. It's amazing how these tendencies seem built into society. Is it something about democracy? Human nature? Religion?
SergeantX
"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock
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I just watched my local news and was VERY surprised to see that to days vote in congress about these issues were NOT reported AT ALL!! They talked briefly about Congress voting for Bush's wire tap bill, but not ONE WORD about the (what I've come to call) Bush Torture Bill.
WHAT THE HECK!! Why isn't this being screamed about from the hills? Why aren't these people pissed off??? Why aren't others fighting this? Has this administration paid everyone off??? I turned between three local stations and NOT A ONE Reported a thing!
Did anyone else hear anything on their local news?
Chewie
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chewie:
I just watched my local news and was VERY surprised to see that to days vote in congress about these issues were NOT reported AT ALL!! They talked briefly about Congress voting for Bush's wire tap bill, but not ONE WORD about the (what I've come to call) Bush Torture Bill.
WHAT THE HECK!! Why isn't this being screamed about from the hills? Why aren't these people pissed off??? Why aren't others fighting this? Has this administration paid everyone off??? I turned between three local stations and NOT A ONE Reported a thing!
Did anyone else hear anything on their local news?
So, anyone going to start rambling about the 'liberal media' NOW?
Media outlets are only as liberal as the conservatives who own them.
Wish I had cable. Anyone know if the Daily Show reported it? If anyone would, my money is on them.
I am frankly terrified right now.
I have to shout about a few things, though:
Can we PLEASE not talk about 'the lesser of two evils'? I talked to so many people who voted for Nader because they didn't want to vote for the lesser of two evils. So the greater of two evils got it. Twice. Let's drop that attitude, shall we? It only does us harm. If more people had been willing to vote for the 'lesser of two evils' eight years ago, we likely wouldn't be in such a mess right now. If it means the greater evil won't get in, please vote for the lesser. I'm begging you.
Ok, rant over. I'm going to go hide under my bed.
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Thousands of candles can be lit from a single candle, and the life of the candle will not be shortened. Happiness never decreases by being shared. - Gautama Siddharta
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Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Anyone know if the Daily Show reported it? If anyone would, my money is on them.
lol! I love Jon Stewart . So please don't take this wrong, but its really sad that I have to turn to 'Comedy Central' to get important news! The only other place I've been able to find any real information is 'Countdown with Keith Olbermann', who is quickly becoming a personal hero.
I also see what you mean about the 'lesser of two evils'. You have a very good point.
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A copy of the letter that I hand wrote on really nice 50# paper using a fountain pen to my Federal Representative to the House, and both Senators:
----- begin letter -----
Please oppose the President’s request to expand his power to have people tortured and otherwise violate the Geneva Conventions.
If the ‘cruel and unusual’ limits established by the Judiciary of the United States of America are exceeded, a prisoner is being tortured. If the Geneva Conventions are defined or interpreted to offer less protection for prisoners, the Conventions are being violated. You will not convince me otherwise.
‘Cruel and unusual’ represents a higher standard than the Geneva Conventions require; but America has always held itself to higher standards than the rest of the world, and has encouraged others to follow as best they can. If the Legislature grants the Executive the power to torture foreign nationals, use coerced testimony, use secret evidence, make them disappear, hold them without charge, hold them indefinitely, or in any other way violate the Geneva Conventions; the world will follow our lead, “The Americans did it. Why shouldn’t we?”
There are already many laws that would greatly improve our security that are not enforced for want of resources. Information gained through torture and other violations of the Geneva Convention is not worth the cost. No American should be ordered to torture prisoners, and those that volunteer to do so should never be allowed near prisoners. At the Nuremberg trials following World War II, German torturers claimed they were following orders. They were convicted, as were the officers appointed over them.
----- End Letter -----
The faults with our Republic lie not with the politicians. The fault lies with the people.
Good people who would do a much better job of governing do not want the job. They are uncomfortable drawing unto themselves the attention needed to be elected, and with excercising Power. Good people fear having too much Power, hesitate to use it, and would rarely seek to increase it.
Because good people do not seek office, the weak minded and power hungry are the only candidates left. They are happy to run for office, collect hangers-on, and make themselves the center of attention. They will never hesitate to excercise and seek ever greater Power.
Until We The People realize that anyone who WANTS Power has defined themself as unfit to weild Power, and collectively write in the name of a qualified person who DOESN'T want the job; we will have to decide wich steaming pile of goh-se we want to deal with.
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Do you know what your sin is Captain?
Awww hell; I'm a big fan of all seven.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chewie:
Am I the only one disturbed by the fact that Congress has voted to allow the President of the United States of America to throw out the Geneva Convention? He can now accuse anyone of being a terrorist. Hold them indefinitely, TORTURE them, and NEVER has to prove that they are in fact terrorists?
Am I the only one scared by this?
You are the only one...except for the terrorists and the people who love them. But they don't count.
I also reject your characterization of the nature and scope of the legislation in question. For the liberals out there, that means I don't think it do what he say it do.
H
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Why is it when ever this President tries to do something which helps protect this country from a very real threat of ISLAMIC terrorism, a specific group of whiners tries to portray it as a fate worse than getting your head cut off ? Whether it's disrupting the financial transactions of terrorist groups, intercepting their phone calls or trying to get relevent information out of those who have sworn to murder as many innocent men/women and children as possible, some still see it as a violation of OUR rights that this Gov't should take steps to protect its citizens
Tell me, just what the HELL are we suppose to do? Act nice to the terrorist and hope they'll go away ? They attacked us LONG before this President came into office, and we did virtually nothing. They kept killing, and this President has finally tried to fight back. Why the HELL is that so god damn wrong ? And spare me the crap about torture. We do NOT torture, not by a long shot. We probably should, in some rare instances, but we don't.
When the 1st innocent citizen gets caught up in this so called threat to our rights, THEN I'll give notice. Not before. This is a war that far too many are denying even exists. This is a war that we did NOT start, and has already come to our shore. Some still refuse to see what is really going on, and instead are putting petty partisan politics ahead of the security of our nation, even the rreservation of civilization itself.
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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because AURAPTOR- today they are "merely" backsliding on the rights of "terrorists"(defined by the Patriot act as 'anyone who violates ANY state or federal Law), but once this legistlation becomes accepted, common practice, say GOODBYE to the America you think you understand..because their is NO GOING BACK. you NEVER EVER EVER EVER give ANY government that level of control, because this war may never end, and even if iby some miracle it does, they would NEVER willingly relinguish the mechanisms of control that they have established.
today it is Islamic terrorists being detained and tortured in concentration camps... next it will be Americas citizens being detained in Fema camps; and every procedure you condoned to interrogate "terrorists" will be used on US- THE CITIZENS. "do unto others as you would have them do to you", this is a profound concept, but understand... as it is fundemental to peace
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Chewie_ I was going to post on the same topic "Like the goddamn Roman Senate"
HAIL Caesar!
Hero- It also gets rid of habeas corpus. Look into it. The reason why the Senate Republicans voted for it wsa because they hope it will get shot down by SCOTUS. They know- clearly- that it's unconstitutional. You as a lawyer (you ARE a lawyer, right?) should be able to smell that from 3000 ft.
Auraptor- Do you think this will REALLY keep us safer? You keep posing this as an "either-or" problem: Either we tolerate internal fascism OR we're all killed/ enslaved by Islamofascists You have NEVER made the case for your agrument. Try it, I dare you: Show us all how this bill is necessary to keep us "safe".
EDITED TO ADD: I find it appalling that I have to quote Benjamin Franklin to people who are supposed patriots. Do you think that the Founding Fathers faced FEWER challenges than we do now? Think about it: they were fighting not only a recognized government... one which still commanded the loyalty of a great number of colonists, and which would have them hung as traitors should they lose... they wre trying an breathtaking experiment in creating a republic.
And they did not hide behind religion or fascism or convention to achieve their goals. You people who claim to be patriots are sniveling, ass-crapping cowards unfit for freedom.
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Those who would give up essential liberty for temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.- Benjamin Franklin
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