Another Unarmed Black Teen Killed

POSTED BY: SHINYGOODGUY
UPDATED: Tuesday, August 25, 2026 18:50
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NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 5:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Also, there was a guy caught on a cell phone video, after the shooting, saying that M.B. actually came BACK and was charging the officer. It was a casual conversation, caught on audio, shortly after the shooting, but before all the ruckus had taken place.

And I'm sure you can provide a link to that item of "anecdotal evidence."

SECOND

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 5:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Man, talk about being a total conspiracy nutjob !

Do you agree with the following? (It's a trick question.)

"We know that America is exceptional in one key respect—we came to democracy without much bloodshed. Around the world, from Hungary and Russia to Iraq and Nigeria, we see the dream of peaceful democratization dragged again and again to what the philosopher Hegel called the slaughter-bench of history. Racial strife and murderous governments, not liberty and democracy, are the rule in history, the established pattern. We know that, mercifully, democratization scourged us only once in ferociously modern style: during the Civil War."

The trick is that the last sentence here nullifies the first. Some 600,000 Americans--2.5 percent of the American population--died in the Civil War. What came before this was a long bloody war--enslavement--against black families, black communities and black bodies. What came after was a terrorist regime which ruled an entire swath of this country by fire and rope. That regime was not overthrown until an era well within the living memory of many Americans. Taken all together, the body count that led us to our present tenuous democratic moment does not elevate us above the community of nations, but installs us uncomfortably within its ranks. And that is terrifying because it shows us to be neither providential nor exceptional, and only special in the subjective sense that our families are special--because they are ours. www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/08/Reparations-For-Ferguson/
376098/

I just want to note that Ferguson Missouri was in the Confederacy. The Confederacy recognized the pro-Confederate claimants in both Kentucky and Missouri and laid claim to those states, granting them Congressional representation and adding two stars to the Confederate flag.

Not so bad as Georgia and Mississippi, but lynchings happened in Missouri, too. http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/shipp/lynchstats.html

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 5:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Were any cigars found?

OMG ! Nancy Drew, you've done it ! You've cracked the case !!!

Never mind that lawyer for the accomplice has already identified both males as being the ones who were in the store, and robbed ( he corrected himself and said - TOOK ) the cigars.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2014/08/15/Lawyer-Confirms-Brown
-Took-Cigars-From-Store

Good grief.

Well, I asked for a link. You did provide one. Thank you.

Now, about the question of Breibart's credibility...

And of course, the actual quote in the Breibart piece is of someone saying, "the guy on CNN said..." That's actually called hearsay, and normally inadmissable in any criminal case, I'd REALLY like to see the source video, where the CNN guy actually says that.

Also in the Breibart piece, a claim that the other thug (pardon me, member of the black community.) said that Brown took a "pack" of cigars. A "pack" of Swishers in usually a 5 pack, isn't it? That's what I see in MY local 7-11's. But the reports have Brown stealing a $50 "box" of cigars.

Kinda like the difference between a 6 pack of beer, and a case of beer, isn't it?

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 5:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

I heard one girl swear that Brown wasn't wearing the same clothes as he was in the video, and that the cops had " photo shopped " the video.

Now hold up a sec. Why would the cops go to all the trouble of photo shopping a security cam video ( I guess they have Industrial Light and Magic talent down at the Ferguson P.D., huh ?) and not have him wearing the same clothes as when he was shot, just a few minutes later. Even though the lawyer for the accomplice admits that the 2 in the video cam were in fact his client and the deceased.

I saw a video, supposedly of the liquor store incident, but it was totally crap quality. I couldn't make out enough detail to identify the person in it. Wanted it to be of adequate quality for me to try, or at least get enough detail to evaluate his clothes. And there wasn't enough. So I dismissed it, as valueless. 'Course, I didn't try REAL hard. And I haven't seen a worthwhile picture of what Brown looked like, or what he was wearing when shot, to compare against.

One thing I was able to see: whoever the person was, he DID have a package of Swisher Sweets tucked, like, under his arm or in his back pocket. (That's what I saw, from memory. It was several days ago. I ain't testifying to this in court. If I was, I'd go review the tape, verify what there is to see, and analyze my thought process and impressions.) Those I have seen, those I did recognize. And what I thought I saw was a flat pack, a six pack, not a "box" like a "big box" that would be worth 50 bucks. Ain't sayin' I'm not wrong, but that's the impression I got, a very strong impression. If I had to prove it, I'd have to go back and work it over.

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 6:10 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Up until that point, all of the cigars are visibly accounted for and behind the counter.

Wondered about that one also. In every 7-11 I've been in out here in CAlifornia, ALL tobacco products are kept behind the counter. BECAUSE they're a target of shoplifting. And because the clerk is supposed to not sell them to minors, to check ID if in doubt. In really bad areas, all of the candy is kept right in front of the cash register, 'cause even the kids will shoplift it. And that's packs of Camels, and 6-packs of Swishers, never mind the $ 50 boxes of 'em. If I had an easily shopliftable item worth 50 bucks in MY liquor store, it wouldn't be out on the floor somewhere, it would be behind the counter.

And that's another good question--Is it legal for a liquor store in Missouri to sell tobacco products to minors? Do they have those "If you look like you're under 30, we'll ask for ID." signs back there? If so, didn't the clerk ask? If he did, wouldn't he check the birth date, name and picture? Just to make sure the ID isn't from "I. M. Whitey," when presented by a 6-4 black dude? Maybe he'd remember, especially right after a shoplifting and assault incident?

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 6:29 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

quote somebody else, Maybe FREM? NOBC added this, it's not quoted from RAP.
E-T-A Not Frem. Shiny GG. Sorry, Frem. BAck to the quote...

E-T-A some more. found the ORIGINAL post again. It was FREM. NOBC sez: "Hey, last time I was wrong was when I thought I made a mistake...."
Gonna keep correcting myself until I get it RIGHT. Sorry if my errors offend anyone.

Quote:

And apparently you missed EC's relevant post earlier, with cite from CCNews.

You dismiss Breitbart, but then go on to cite CCN ? ROFLMAO !!!!

Who the hell is CCN ? One of PN's rivals ?

And then you dismiss CCN with "ROLFMAO", only to come back a couple of lines later to ask " who the hell is CCN?" Either you're too busy snarking at CNN and only caught the typo later, or you got no business ROFLing at them without knowing who they are. If you don't know who they are, how can you know that they aren't THE authoritative source on the matter?

Your logic is flawed.

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 6:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Also, there was a guy caught on a cell phone video, after the shooting, saying that M.B. actually came BACK and was charging the officer. It was a casual conversation, caught on audio, shortly after the shooting, but before all the ruckus had taken place.

And I'm sure you can provide a link to that item of "anecdotal evidence."

Heard the audio of it on the radio, but I'll try to track it down as time permits.

Frem's Counter current News ( CCN ) isn't a typo for CNN.

Try to keep up.

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 7:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Tox results still have to come in too

Just saw a reference to that. (Oops, better provide a link.) He is reported to have had marijuana in his system.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/USA-Update/2014/0818/After-autopsy-Mike-B
rown-s-parents-call-for-officer-s-arrest-video

Quote:

The retired examiner also emphasized that he would need a toxicology report to comment on a claim, made by a police source quoted in The Washington Post on Monday, that the county police's autopsy found marijuana in Brown's system.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/08/18/county-in
vestigation-michael-brown-was-shot-from-the-front-had-marijuana-in-his-system/

just the header and by-line from the Washington Post:

County investigation: Michael Brown was shot from the front, had marijuana in his system
By Emily Wax-Thibodeaux, Wesley Lowery and Mark Berman August 18 at 12:34 PM ?

****************************************************************************
Te "retired medical examiner" is Dr. Baden, who conducted the second autopsy.

CSM is highly regarded as reliable and objective.

It appears that the original source was within the Police Dept.

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 7:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:

Also saw a (conservative) website (Damn, I'm gonna have to go back and FIND the site again, and provide a link. YA know how some people just hate "anecdotal evidence". But I did see it. ) that reported several things I hadn't seen anywhere else: Brown wanted to be, or was, a rapper. We all know that EVERY SINGLE ONE of THEM is a criminal; there's video of him flashing "gang signs". That one might be true, actually; and, (same site) a motivation for stealing the box of cigars, worth almost $50-- that's 80 to 100 of 'em. Turns out drug dealers hollow out those Swisher Sweets and refill them with MJ. (I hadn't known that.) So he was, "really", a "drug dealer", not a good kid going off to college. High level, too, probably a wholesaler.

Now, I don't know. Are those true, relevant facts about his real character, or just more character assassination? And is any of it relevant to the police officer's original action, stopping these 2 guys for walking down the middle of a street? Did he, or the police chief, know about any of those things? Back later with links.

OK, this ain't what I saw, but a report about it. I think what I saw was the original pieces referred to here.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/michael-brown-rap-lyrics-ferguso
n-shooting

TPM LIVEWIRE

Far Right Says Michael Brown's Raps Show He Was 'A Criminal And A Thug'

ByDYLAN SCOTTPublishedAUGUST 18, 2014, 10:31 AM EDT 14446 Views

Quote:

Michael Brown, the unarmed black teenager who was shot on Aug. 9 by a Ferguson, Mo., police officer, was an aspiring hip-hop artist. The Los Angeles Times reported Sunday on Brown's SoundCloud page, a collection of amateur rap songs that Brown had posted before his death.

They contained much of the imagery and language common to so-called gangster rap. Pictures of Brown flashing alleged gang signs have also circulated in the conservative blogosphere.

FrontPage magazine, the online home of David Horowitz, whose self-described mission is to battle the radical left, labeled Brown "a criminal and a thug" in its summary of his character, which featured the rap lyrics.

"The fact that Brown liked performing thug music obviously doesn’t by itself make him a thug, but it does provide insight into his state of mind," the site said. "The same can be said for the photographs that have surfaced of Brown posing like a tough guy, making gestures with his hands that some say are gang signs."

FrontPage magazine, and others, connected Brown's rap lyrics with the police report released Friday that said he was the "primary suspect" in a convenience store robbery that occurred minutes before he was shot. That report's release, which was reportedly opposed by the Justice Department, has been criticized by Brown's family and public officials as an attempt to paint a negative public image of Brown.

"Well, this kind of destroys the ‘gentle giant’ narrative spun in the media," ClashDaily, the website of Doug Giles, who occasionally writes for the more well-known TownHall.com, said in its summary of Brown's songs.

The conspiratorial website World Net Daily connected Brown's professed marijuana smoking in the songs with his alleged robbery of some cigarillos -- which are "widely known to be used by marijuana smokers, who roll their own blunts by replacing the cigarillos’ tobacco with pot" -- on the day of the shooting.

"I didn’t go through the entire catalogue, but it’s pretty obscene, though standard rap fare these days," conservative blogger SooperMexican said in his own post. "Of course, none of this means he is guilty of what the police claim he did, but it adds another dimension to the character of Mike Brown."

"Draw your own conclusions."

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Tuesday, August 19, 2014 7:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Man, talk about being a total conspiracy nutjob !
Do you agree with the following? (It's a trick question.)

"We know that America is exceptional in one key respect—we came to democracy without much bloodshed. Around the world, from Hungary and Russia to Iraq and Nigeria, we see the dream of peaceful democratization dragged again and again to what the philosopher Hegel called the slaughter-bench of history. Racial strife and murderous governments, not liberty and democracy, are the rule in history, the established pattern. We know that, mercifully, democratization scourged us only once in ferociously modern style: during the Civil War."

The trick is that the last sentence here nullifies the first. Some 600,000 Americans--2.5 percent of the American population--died in the Civil War. What came before this was a long bloody war--enslavement--against black families, black communities and black bodies. What came after was a terrorist regime which ruled an entire swath of this country by fire and rope. That regime was not overthrown until an era well within the living memory of many Americans. Taken all together, the body count that led us to our present tenuous democratic moment does not elevate us above the community of nations, but installs us uncomfortably within its ranks. And that is terrifying because it shows us to be neither providential nor exceptional, and only special in the subjective sense that our families are special--because they are ours. www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/08/Reparations-For-Ferguson/
376098/

I just want to note that Ferguson Missouri was in the Confederacy. The Confederacy recognized the pro-Confederate claimants in both Kentucky and Missouri and laid claim to those states, granting them Congressional representation and adding two stars to the Confederate flag.

Not so bad as Georgia and Mississippi, but lynchings happened in Missouri, too. http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/shipp/lynchstats.html

2 points, not necessarily arguin' with you :

"We know that America is exceptional in one key respect—we came to democracy without much bloodshed."

Ah, yepper. After that first Tea Party, the one in Boston Harbor, there was the Boston Massacre, and this little thing called the American Revolution. No bloodshed there.

" I just want to note that Ferguson Missouri was in the Confederacy. The Confederacy recognized the pro-Confederate claimants in both Kentucky and Missouri and laid claim to those states, granting them Congressional representation and adding two stars to the Confederate flag."

If I remember my history courses correctly, Missouri was officially a "border state," divided in its loyalty. There were a LOT of Confederate supporters there, including Sam Clemens, who went off to attempt to join the Confederate Army, but got lost on the way and went back home. Not sure exactly where Ferguson stood then, if it did, politically or geographically, but it, and a lot of the state certainly lines up with the "Old South" attitude today.

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