Meanwhile, back in Libya

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Saturday, January 3, 2026 23:15
VIEWED: 9457
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SIGNYM

Monday, July 28, 2014 1:21 AM

Quote:
Let's not drift from the main point as you like to do when challenged. You still have not provided proof that the United States was responsible for overthrowing 40 democracies.

Yanno what? I've been down this road before. I posted background on all of this several years ago for GEEZER, when even the liberals were begging me to stop. It took me many hours of looking, posting over three days. In the end, of course, none of the information... declassified memos, leaked briefings, historic records... was ever good enough. GEEZER kept on believing what he wanted to believe.

At some future time, I will see if I can find those posts.

THGRRI

Monday, July 28, 2014 1:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Libyans had significantly more freedom than Saudis, and Libyan women's freedom was incomparably better than Saudis. Now, they have significantly less.

If history has taught us anything it has taught us nothing is forever. I don't quite see where you have the right to deny Libyans the right to chose for themselves or decide if they would have been better off if they had not risen up against a dictator. They did chose to do so without any prodding from us.

THGRRI

Monday, July 28, 2014 1:29 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:
Let's not drift from the main point as you like to do when challenged. You still have not provided proof that the United States was responsible for overthrowing 40 democracies.
Yanno what? I've been down this road before. I posted background on all of this several years ago for GEEZER, when even the liberals were begging me to stop. It took me many hours of looking, posting over three days. In the end, of course, none of the information... declassified memos, leaked briefings, historic records... was ever good enough. GEEZER kept on believing what he wanted to believe.

At some future time, I will see if I can find those posts.

Not to worry. I am just establishing with you what is necessary to debate with me. Subjective posting along with hear say and biases won't cut it with me.

Take Libya for example. Nothing to do with us except minimal support after they started a revolution themselves yet you blame us. When I see how low you set the bar for it to meet with your standards of being able to blame us, I tend not to take your cries of outrage to seriously.

SIGNYM

Monday, July 28, 2014 1:36 AM

AND FINALLY, G.

G, I know there's very little you or I can do individually about US foreign policy. However, you have never even acknowledged exactly what is is that we've done, and are continuing to do, to other nations. All you've engaged in is character assassination and ridicule, you've never engaged in the issue.

I wasn't on this board for the invasion of Afghanistan, I was on another board, doing the same thing: pointing and shouting that we were about to visit tragedy on a hapless nation. We did. We screwed it up just as badly as I said we would.

I was here for Iraq, pointing out the same thing. And we screwed it up, too. Same with Libya. Same with Syria. And now, Ukraine.

Have we established democracy? Uh, no.
Have we lifted women out of slavery? No, not that either.
Brought peace? NOPE!
Saved lives? hahahaha!
Developed infrastructure and encouraged prosperity??? NO THAT EITHER.
Have we at least acquired foreign resources???
BWAHAHAHAHA!

So ALL we've done... the ONLY things we've done... is institute tyranny, put women back into slavery, destroy infrastructure, kill hundreds of thousands (no mean feat!), impoverish millions, and in general leave great smoking clusterfucked landscapes wherever we went.

How do I make that message "comfortable"?

SIGNYM

Monday, July 28, 2014 1:51 AM

Quote:
I don't quite see where you have the right to deny Libyans the right to chose for themselves or decide if they would have been better off if they had not risen up against a dictator. They did chose to do so without any prodding from us.

Horse puckies.

VERY early on, I heard a glancing reference on NPR that this whole thing was somewhat tribal, that people in the Qaddafi clan and region received somewhat more favorable treatment than elsewhere. That this group represented approximately 30-40% of the population of Libya, a minority, but a significant one. This would be like Ukraine, where 30% of the population could be thought of as being anti-Kiev.

Despite the fact that the fighting went on for quite some time, indicating that not ALL Libyans wanted the future that the EU, USA, and the jihadists had mapped out for Libya ... as far as the US press was concerned, there was only one side... the jihadist side. Even so-called leftist news (specifically Amy Goodman and Juan Cole) only reported breathlessly with the so-called rebels. Nobody ever reported from the other side, and nobody ever reported what would happen to the women of that nation.

I don't think you can claim to know what "the Libyans" wanted, since they weren't a unified group... as you can now see from all of the fighting going on.

THGRRI

Monday, July 28, 2014 4:03 AM

Quote:
…Sig

Horse puckies. VERY early on, I heard a glancing reference on NPR that this whole thing was somewhat tribal, that people in the Qaddafi clan and region received somewhat more favorable treatment than elsewhere. That this group represented approximately 30-40% of the population of Libya, a minority, but a significant one. This would be like Ukraine, where 30% of the population could be thought of as being anti-Kiev.

Horse puckys indeed. “Very early on I heard something on NPR”. Really Sig, and then you bring up the Ukraine as though they are connected through a conspiracy of numbers somehow. Let’s try and not confuse the two shall we. The Libyans got tired of being ruled by a dictator which was the case with much of the Middle East at that time. They followed the way of other Middle Eastern counties and revolted. They called for our help. We make enemies of some Libyans if we do and others if we do not. We played our cards in a fashion to try and be seen as allies of freedom, rather than as a country that allowed a dictator to stay in place against the wishes of its people. We have had enough of that. Either way we lose.

Quote:
…Sig
Despite the fact that the fighting went on for quite some time, indicating that not ALL Libyans wanted the future that the EU, USA, and the jihadists had mapped out for Libya ... as far as the US press was concerned, there was only one side... the jihadist side. Even so-called leftist news (specifically Amy Goodman and Juan Cole) only reported breathlessly with the so-called rebels. Nobody ever reported from the other side, and nobody ever reported what would happen to the women of that nation.

I see your delusion remains intact that the United States, the EU and our Jihadists are responsible for pulling the strings of everything that goes on, on this planet. Do you read what you post after you post it? It suggests a detachment from reality on a grand scale. It appears you can no longer (if you ever could) put things into their proper context. When I say this, it is out of concern because some of your friends here are noticing a marked difference in your behavior.

Quote:
…Sig
I don't think you can claim to know what "the Libyans" wanted, since they weren't a unified group... as you can now see from all of the fighting going on.

I only know what I heard them say Sig, and you’re right they are divided. There are those who made out well under Kaddafi fighting to keep what they have, against those who got nothing. They don’t know how to share and get alone and will have to learn.

1KIKI

Monday, July 28, 2014 4:58 AM

So, you have no intention of addressing the topic. Yeah, you're right. Not worth talking to you.

SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.

JONGSSTRAW

Monday, July 28, 2014 5:08 AM

1KIKI

Monday, July 28, 2014 5:14 AM

Because nothing quite says I'm a crazy bitch like posting crazy-bitch postcards.

SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.

THGRRI

Monday, July 28, 2014 5:28 AM

Yeah ok, that's funny. To shay

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