Zimmerman's Own Words

POSTED BY: BYTEMITE
UPDATED: Saturday, July 20, 2013 04:28
VIEWED: 7543
PAGE 3 of 10

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Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
An armed man invited himself into the personal space of an innocent doing nothing wrong. This was the first aggressive move that started the whole thing. TM had every right to stand his ground and defend himself against GZ.

Perhaps the self-defense isn't thought to apply to TM since he never prepared himself properly by pitching into the industry that loves Stand Your Ground? Or perhaps there's another reason... ?

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Thing is Zimmerman following Martin and asking him, even aggressively, is not against the law. It comes down to who started the physical confrontation. Zimmerman said Martin did. The prosecution will have to show that Zimmerman started the physical confrontation or shot Martin without any physical confrontation.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Quote:

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Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
An armed man invited himself into the personal space of an innocent doing nothing wrong. This was the first aggressive move that started the whole thing. TM had every right to stand his ground and defend himself against GZ.

Perhaps the self-defense isn't thought to apply to TM since he never prepared himself properly by pitching into the industry that loves Stand Your Ground? Or perhaps there's another reason... ?

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Thing is Zimmerman following Martin and asking him, even aggressively, is not against the law. It comes down to who started the physical confrontation. Zimmerman said Martin did. The prosecution will have to show that Zimmerman started the physical confrontation or shot Martin without any physical confrontation.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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I read something else. From the trial:

They called as a witness Alexis Francisco Carter, the military attorney who taught the class. Carter described Zimmerman as one of his better students and said the neighborhood watch volunteer got an "A" in his class.

Under cross-examination, Carter gave two definitions of legal concepts that seemed to bolster the defense's case. He explained that a person can make a self-defense argument if the person has a "reasonable apprehension" of death or great bodily harm.

"It's imminent fear. The fact alone that there isn't an injury doesn't necessarily mean that the person didn't have a reasonable apprehension or fear," Carter said. "The fact that there are injuries might support there was reasonable apprehension and fear."


I'm a teenager, walking alone in the dark, when a grown man approaches me making demands in a belligerent voice. Oh, and the man has a GUN while all I have is a bag of skittles.

So, can I defend myself now?

Or should I just bow down to my "master", which is what many folks seems to think TM was obliged to do?

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MAL4- indeed. Thank you.

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Again.

I stand by my initial assessment - Second Degree Murder.

ETA: Took a while to dig up - original assessment is HERE, about 2/3rds of the way down through the first page.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=51371&p=1

Summary from a later thread for those interested, but not wanting to read the whole mess.

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*shaking head*

You try to pull a gun on me, TRUST me, you'd wind up in far worse shape than Zimmerman did. How it is that even people who know better chug down a spoon fed narrative so obviously manufactured ?

I stand by my assessment, still. Zimmerman approached an already suspicious Martin, got in his personal space aggressively, and Martin reacted in a hostile fashion, a scuffle ensued and wound up with Martin getting shot - my OPINION of that unknowable moment is that Zimmerman laid hands on him, and Martin reacted by pounding the crap out of him, but backed off once Zimmerman was incapable of aggressing on him, THEN Zimmerman shot him as he was backing away, out of a combination of fear, humiliation and ego involvement.

Which is in fact second degree murder, acceptable on plea to manslaughter.

But the spin on this, the blatancy of what appears to be something between institutional racism, and general ass-covering, also shows up the immense imbalance of power which makes our court systems something of a joke when the prosecutor, police, and court collude on something, whether it be railroading someone innocent, protecting someone guilty, or bending the hell out of the rules to shield their own incompetence - if a public defender started strategically leaking information he'd damn near be lynched for it and WOULD be disbarred, not to mention the various procedural and other violations prosecutors get a free pass for, not the least of which is violation of discovery, which is ALSO a factor here, since the leaked information being held back WAS in fact a violation of the discovery process, you understand.

The thing that's grinding my gears right now is the complicity of the media shovelling a narrative in such a way as to intentionally try to influence a trial, that's obstruction of a sort, but let that go, what REALLY annoys me about it, is this... "On noes, the person being chased by a suspicious, aggressive creep physically beat him when that suspicious, aggressive creep tried to pull a gun on him, oh how horrible..." And I say to that, Fuck You.

When an ARMED, suspicious and threatening individual approaches and confronts you, maybe lays hands on you, you really think it's beyond the pale to respond violently in an effort to prevent them from deploying that armament against you ? Mind you, we do not know whether Martin was aware that Zimmerman was armed, but I highly suspect that reaching for that armament is what set the conflict from push and shove to serious violence - one of my own well known tactics is preventing someone from deploying a weapon in much the same storm-rush fashion, but I don't stop till said weapon is in my possession.

Oh and FYI, tactical/procedural screwup I maybe didn't mention before, in addition to all the other ones... Zimmerman also screwed the pooch by getting in arms reach during that confrontation, probably in an effort to intimidate - there's a REASON I talk to people out there in the darkness from fifteen feet away, folks.

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And I remain standing by that original assessment, I know exactly the dynamic, I've thrown fifty and more "zimmermans" out of my damn office via the interview process, believe it....

-F

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Frem, I remember your post well. It fit everything I knew about the case then, and even more so now.

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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:

But... him saying this actually makes him seem like a really terrible person. And he can't go to jail for that. But I can dislike him a lot.

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Maybe he and Casey Anthony can start a club of some kind. A support group for really rotten folks who escaped jail time ? Naww... he'll likely be found guilty.

Will there be riots, by those who think he should be acquitted ? ( yeah, right )

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

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" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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