Insanity or Genius - Fortune-teller or Deadly Killer ?

POSTED BY: JaynezTown
UPDATED: Friday, December 10, 2004 09:11
VIEWED: 6911
PAGE 3 of 4

PREV PAGE 1 2 3 4 NEXT PAGE

LTNOWIS

Monday, August 9, 2004 7:25 PM

Well even if she was immune, they could kill Jayne and Simon and drag her back to the academy. So I don't think her fear means anything. That said, they might not have finished immunizing her before Simon rescued her, and they might not have intended to anyways. We don't really know their intentions, so it's hard to discuss.

KNIBBLET

Monday, August 9, 2004 7:33 PM

Ahhhh, but what of her reacting to Book being shot in "Safe"?

Interesting thing for me is: She didn't scream when Book was shot, rather, she screamed when Mal saw that Book had been shot. hmmmmmmmmmm

"Just keep walkin, preacher man."

THEREALME

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:37 AM

Here are events during the Firefly series that I believe demonstrate that River has some kind of psychic powers, an ability to sense things that others cannot, or even to read minds. It seems clear to me that River has no control over these abilities, as things seem to come to her unbidden and she does not seem able to call upon them reliably. Also, there is the problem that her confused mental state makes it difficult for her to interpret her data correctly. In any case, I agree that some of these events can be ascribed to high intelligence or heightened senses, but not all of them.

I will go episode by episode. Most of these are from memory, some from research. I might add to this or clarify things after re-watching the episodes in the future.

SERENITY
Nothing that I remember.

THE TRAIN JOB
Nothing that I remember.

BUSHWACKED
River heard screams (in the past) from the ship. She “followed the voices” and came aboard the derelict to find the dead bodies. When the survivor wakes up in the Serenity infirmary, laughing, River in Inara’s shuttle wakes up screaming.

SHINDIG
When River talks to Badger using his accent, she seems to know a lot about him. That he’s from Dyton Colony might be revealed by the accent. But she comes up with other information about Badger. He left home early, doing grift jobs. He spent time in the lockdown, but less than he claims. He’s a sad little king of a sad little hill. Badger seems impressed with River. If she just fed him a bunch of made-up nonsense, I would expect him to comment. On the other hand, if she hit dead on, I would expect Badger to be more surprised than he was, so I’m not sure about this one.

SAFE
River is startled around the time that Book is shot, even though Book is out of sight and a long distance away. When she and Simon are with the hill people, River knows the tale of Ruby, the little mute girl. About her mother going crazy and killing her other daughter, Ruby’s sister, right before Ruby’s eyes. The nurse is so happy when she thinks Ruby has finally talked, but River confirms that she did not talk. Unless River is lying about Ruby talking, “voice got scared away”, how could she get the details of the story out of the mute girl? It has been argued that any psychologist could pull such a terrible story out of a child, but I remain skeptical. I have no doubt that many people could tell that the child had been traumatized, but could River get the specific details about the crazy mother by carefully observing exactly what sort of blank stare was on the child’s face? I don’t think so. Later, when the town wants to burn River as a witch, the town’s leader was trying to be reasonable at first. But when River says things that imply she knows about the current leader doing away with the previous leader, this current leader gets a strong reaction of confusion and alarm on his face, then hits her and goes along with the witch-burning plan with gusto. She clearly struck a sore point with him, and he wanted her dead. “He was sick. But he was getting better.
You were alone in the room with him.”

OUR MRS REYNOLDS
This is in the deleted scene, but the intro said that it was deleted due to time considerations, implying that the content was okay. River says of Saffron: “She’s a thief.” Saffron produces a small food packet, and says, “Didn’t know she saw me.” To which River replies, “Didn’t.” I think that this has nothing to do with the food packet. I think that River senses that Saffron is a thief, a con artist.

JAYNESTOWN
Nothing that I remember.

OUT OF GAS
Just before the blast of flame hits Zoe, River whispers, “Fire.” Precognition? Maybe only heightened senses.

ARIEL
At the end of the diagnostic brain scan, River screams. “They come out of the Black. They come when you call.” Is this a reference to the Blue Hands coming due to Jayne’s betrayal, Jayne’s “call”? River knows that a patient is about to be in danger of death from poor treatment, and that Simon can save him. Whe

THEREALME

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:39 AM

OBJECTS IN SPACE

There are quite a few clues in this episode.

Near the beginning, River is lying in bed with voices going through her head. Then one voice startles her awake. It says, “We’re all just floating.” It is Early’s voice. If River is NOT psychic, how could she know Early’s voice before he even gets aboard Serenity? I think that River had been picking up the thoughts of people around her, and was startled by an unfamiliar mind. In fact, I think that she feels so threatened by Early’s mind that she goes looking for a gun. She does this in the half-dazed way that she does most things.

Next, we see River wandering among the crew. In all cases, they seem to ignore her, except for making jarring statements that are unrelated to the conversations or activities that just precedes and just follows the statements. That is, a pair of the crew might be joking or laughing, there is a jarring discontinuity where they each deliver their “Inner Thought” to River, then the pair go back to laughing AS IF THE INNER THOUGHT STATEMENT NEVER HAPPENED. This happens with the Book/Jayne pair and the Simon/Kaylee pair. I am convinced that River is reading their minds during this time, learning some bit of inner turmoil of each character. Some have commented that each Inner Thought might be the person’s deepest regret. Kaylee does not say anything, but the expression on her face when she looks at River is very odd for her. I think Kaylee’s expression reveals her uneasy thoughts about River since the events in War Stories. Okay, Zoe and Wash are too busy to have any Inner Thoughts at that time, but it is clear that River really gets into THAT experience, as well.

As I mentioned, in all cases, the crew members seem to ignore River. There are some characters, Simon and Book for instance, that I believe would at least acknowledge her and say hello. And Mal and Inara would be unlikely to miss seeing River, and equally unlikely to continue their conversation about Inara’s departure in River’s presence. I believe one of two things is happening. Either River is somehow clouding their minds so that they cannot see her, or River’s mind or mental perception is wandering among the crew, but her body is elsewhere. It seems that River herself does not understand what is going on.

EDITED 8-21-2004: Also, Simon is so self-conscious that I cannot believe that he would sit with Kaylee's legs on him while ANYONE, even River, walked by. He would get all flustered, push Kaylee's legs away, and get her upset again. No, I don't think that he perceived River at all.

I suppose that all of the “Inner Thought” time can be dismissed as a simple hallucination on River’s part, but then I would have to question why Joss went to so much trouble to get the characters to say everything they said. That is, these scenes seem too loaded with information to be dismissed as merely River’s wacky imagination. If there was nothing substantial to the Inner Thought scenes, River’s madness might better be done through a disjointed and bizarre River-in-Wonderland scene that clearly had no point. The Inner Thoughts seemed to have a point.

Anyway, soon after (though the passage of time seems odd around this time in the show), we see River in the cargo bay picking up a stick which “turns into” River holding a gun. This alarms the crew, who suddenly seem to be around her.

Earlier, I suggested that the threat of Early prompted her to seek a weapon. On a different thread, someone else suggested that River was tuning into Early’s violent thoughts and was beginning to think like him. In either case, she wanted a gun.

With everyone so freaked out about River having a gun, and Mal taking the gun away, River gets so upset and confused that she did not remember why she wanted the gun at all. In fact, “wanting the gun” in such a situation might have been part of her subconscious programming from the Academy. “It’s crowded in here!” from River as she runs off. I take this to be referring to her own mind.

But anyway, how did she

KNIBBLET

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 2:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by TheRealMe:
HEART OF GOLD Nothing that I remember.

What about, "It's starting." 3 seconds before Petaleen realizes the baby has decided it's time to check out of the womb with a view?

"Just keep walkin, preacher man."

JAYNEZTOWN

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:07 PM

There are many points that might hint at River being psychic such as knowing Jayne was going to betray, and so forth..so maybe she can read minds

but was she a trained Assassin ? it's hard to say

AZIRAPHALE

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 8:33 PM

"time to check out of the womb with a view."

Bwahahahahahahaha!

SHINYSEVEN

Wednesday, August 11, 2004 8:39 PM

To me, it sounds like Mal says that River is a Reader--i.e., it's a job title, like CPA--he isn't happy about having a telepath around, but he doesn't have any trouble accepting telepathy as a phenomenon.

THEREALME

Thursday, August 12, 2004 2:17 PM

Thanks, Knibblet,

You are right. I forgot the baby scene in HOG.

The Real Me

GRIMLAKIN

Thursday, August 12, 2004 5:28 PM

River is the next level. Blue sun created the men with hands of blue. They are trained to serve and use tools that kill the mind. River is the next model. The next best thing to replace them. She is the ultimate information gathering agent that needs no tools of attack. For she is her own tool.

PREV PAGE 1 2 3 4 NEXT PAGE