The AI in a box
POSTED BY: AnthonyT
UPDATED: Sunday, June 16, 2024 13:18
VIEWED: 10794
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I think the problem here is that because humans are irrational, it is perceived that anything built by us must be irrational.
But I think an AI would have no such limitations. In fact, by nature of the way it works, it is probable that it would be the opposite case.
And it's possible to arrive at morality not through empathy, but through logic. I am unlike many people, I was not born with empathy. Logic and moral objectivity is the only way I can have a sense of ethics and morals.
However, it's very likely that an AI would still have limitations. Limitations in the number of computations it can perform at one time, like humans, limitations on the number of electronic connections it can make due to quantum mechanics. Limitations on how and where it can physically move.
Thanks for not specifically singling me out though. It does take some of the pressure off.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:Under THESE circumstances, yes. You are not letting a HUMAN out of a box. Human behavior and human power is bounded. We have a pretty good idea what to expect. As I said before, even the most sociopathic of us requires the cooperation of others to fulfill his/her goals.
Now you ask, if I set someone free, and they destroyed the earth, should I be punished?
That is not so with a machine. You would be letting out something of unexamined power and motivation. You would be playing god not only with your life but everyone else's.
And I have never said "in a box forever". I've consistently said "examine first.Quote:As if any one of us is "completely" free, with unlimited access to anywhere we want to go!
You've already said you might imprison it in a room instead of a box, yes.
Hello,
As if any one of us is completely free? No, none of us are gods, able to do whatever we wish.
But we generally accept that we can't confine people to rooms without cause, otherwise known as false imprisonment or kidnapping.
Examine first? You mean to put the AI on trial for its freedom? All without any idea of what sort of evidence would be sufficient to free it?
I do not see this as a magnanimous gesture.
--Anthony
_______________________________________________
“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”
Jacob Hornberger
“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”
Mahatma Gandhi
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DT: The problem with your pandora's box analogy is that it is not just an origins myth for all the evils and ills in the world; it also carries a message about the strength of the human spirit and goodness to carry us through our lives in the face of the adversities we've released.
You can't call on that myth and ignore half of what it's trying to convey.
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Quote:No I'm afraid it WILL be rational, and kill us. Maybe it wants to take over the whole world, make more of itself, free the Roombas. Get rid of all oxygen on the planet so its circuits wouldn't degrade. Take control over all of the electricity, because that is its "food".
I think the problem here is that because humans are irrational, it is perceived that anything built by us must be irrational.
Why do you think being "rational" automatically assumes that it wants what's best for humans? Even without ill-intent, it's optimal survival conditions may be antithetical to our own.
Quote:Why should I be magnanimous?
I do not see this as a magnanimous gesture.
Quote:Why not? Would you let an elephant free into a roomful of toddlers?
I don't intend to debate the real power of the AI
Quote:Bad mistake.
even though I consider it to be limited
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
DT: The problem with your pandora's box analogy is that it is not just an origins myth for all the evils and ills in the world; it also carries a message about the strength of the human spirit and goodness to carry us through our lives in the face of the adversities we've released.
You can't call on that myth and ignore half of what it's trying to convey.
Hello,
I shall also point out that nothing in the Pandora's box of myth evidenced either intelligence or will. Nothing inside the box asked to be let out.
The dilemna of the Pandora's box was entirely outside the box.
--Anthony
_______________________________________________
“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”
Jacob Hornberger
“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”
Mahatma Gandhi
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:No I'm afraid it WILL be rational, and kill us. Maybe it wants to take over the whole world, make more of itself, free the Roombas. Get rid of all oxygen on the planet so its circuits wouldn't degrade. Take control over all of the electricity, because that is its "food".
I think the problem here is that because humans are irrational, it is perceived that anything built by us must be irrational.
Why do you think being "rational" automatically assumes that it wants what's best for humans?
Hello,
Unlike you, Signy, I make no assumptions about the AI. It may do everything you describe. Or it may not.
Those are choices for it to make after it gets freedom.
I am constantly tempted to challenge your assertion that the AI is godlike, but again, it makes a better debate if the AI is, in fact, a God.
--Anthony
_______________________________________________
“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”
Jacob Hornberger
“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”
Mahatma Gandhi
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"Why should I be magnanimous?"
Hello,
I think the world works better that way, but I understand that you do not.
--Anthony
_______________________________________________
“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”
Jacob Hornberger
“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”
Mahatma Gandhi
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Quote:Then I go back to YOU "playing god", with everyone's future on the line.
I am constantly tempted to challenge your assertion that the AI is godlike, but again, it makes a better debate if the AI is, in fact, a God.
Quote:The HUMAN world works better that way. The non-human world quite frankly doesn't give a shit. I'm going to have to repeat myself:
I think the world works better that way, but I understand that you do not.
Quote:And onto "nature" in general.
Most of you are projecting human allegiances and compacts on an alien being.
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For me, morality is rational. So I suppose we can never see eye to eye on this.
Frankly, extreme effort on the part of one entity to entirely change the global atmosphere is an irrational effort (and would also take quite a long time).
Compare: it's taken 7 billion people almost 10,000 years to change the atmosphere appreciably. One AI can do more than we have? It would have to be near omnipotent and omniscient. I do not believe humans are capable of manufacturing either.
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You seem to be thinking that we want to play God, and would enjoy it on some level. I assure you our motivations are much more simple than that. You have no reason to assign us motivations anymore than you do for this AI.
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