Debtor Nation
POSTED BY: dreamtrove
UPDATED: Monday, April 18, 2011 14:27
VIEWED: 2030
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Taking a tax day to think this over.
Anyone stop and think about their personal economics and where their money and effort is going?
Here's some stuff I'm gnawing over on this April 15th.
ETA: Sorry, it got sort of longish, the store doesn't open until noon today, so I'm killing time.
The typical Mortgage is 30 years. You buy a house under our glorious economic model, and you will be paying for it for 30 years. It's going to sap your income, we all know that.
I know several people who said "Yes, but I want this mortgage over quickly." They had reasonably high incomes, and so they could get the short term loan, which is seven years.
Now, after 7 years of working, with every penny going to the house, you have a house.
But what if you built a house? Would it really take you seven years? How about 30?
Now, backtrack to the 17th c. If you signed a contract of indenture that would typically be for seven years, all your labor, allegedly to pay your transportation costs, but ultimately, for land.
As a lawyer friend recently put it "The only difference between a mortgage and an indenture contract is that the latter is easier to get out of."
No one in business ever makes a deal to lose money, but sometimes profit margins are absurd. If 14 men worked from spring to fall they could certainly build you a house. You could probably do it with a crew of 4.
But how did we get to 30?
Taxes. Among other things. And what are taxes but your agreement to accept paying someone else's debt, in particular, the American War Debt. That's what it is, where it comes from, we all know this. Our ruling elite serves some international banking cartel which likes to fight wars so it can expand the sphere of influence of its currency, hence, its power, and the size of its economy, and we are the hired grunt nation du jour, but if you sign up for a system where you get a salary to pay for your house, you are also signing up to pay for the war debt, which, frankly, is not your responsibility.
So as you work your indentured servitude, you are not just working for your house, but slaving to fund the war machine, or rather, to pay the unfathomable debt that it has accrued since it was unleashed unto the world like Morgoth's orcs a century ago.
So, we all sent off our homage to Saruman, giving thanks for his work in the raping and pillaging of the planet, so that the debt to his Nazgul advisors and financiers could be paid, or at least, the interest on it, all praise Sauron, moving on...
Now what of education. When I was in school, the student loan term was 10 years, now that is called the "short term" and the longer terms are 15, 20 and 25.
We accept that a debt is a payment for land, and that we are indentured servants if we take the seven year contract, but are we simply slaves if we don't? Quote:
he interest portion of your mortgage payment is usually tax deductible
WTF? Only the interest portion. Okay, back to education.
Now, surely, there's not a kegger in the world that's worth a quarter million dollars, or $100,000 in debt on average, or 10 years or 25.
Is it even worth anything at all, this education (Okay, we all know the answer to that now, of course not, as information, probably any one of you who went to college in the information age picked up a text book, the googled the information learned 10 times as much about it, and then if you had any questions you could email people anywhere online, and you probably ended up more informed for it.) So, what you didn't get from your googling wikipedia was a degree.
So why do we need this degree? To get a job of course. Why do we need this job? To pay the debt of course, for the mortgage and the education and horseshoe nail.
I hope no one missed the circular logic here.
A working year is 40hr/wk x 50/52 weeks = 2000 manhours
Housing cost, 1-12 thousand man hours. So at $10/hour that would be 10k-120k which seems about right, but of course, your labor when you do it yourself is not taxed, and there is no interes
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Hello,
I don't think that working 7 days a week would work for me. I need a break to unwind and get things done, and I need that break regularly.
--Anthony
Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I don't think that working 7 days a week would work for me. I need a break to unwind and get things done, and I need that break regularly.
When I first graduated Law School and went to work for the City I kept my part time weekend job because it was too good to give up. So I worked 7 days/week and took no vacations for the first two years...then I took a week off and continued another year at 7 days/week.
It was very tough, but I liked that extra money when I was first starting out.
H
"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I would rather not ignore your contributions." Niki2, 2010.
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I had a 138 hour major with many bullshit 1 or 2 hour classes that were in practice as work intensive as 3 hour classes, while practicing at least 3 hours a day and rehearsing and performing in 3 or more performing ensembles each semester. Also everything in the world was a prereq for something next year, so ya couldn't blitz the course work (assuming you could somehow function on no sleep).
And what do I have to show for this Music Education degree? Student loans and a therapy job, cause that makes sense...
Not that I'm complaining. I mean I am, but I also know I am fortunate to find any work at all in this economy. Looking for work sucked because every potential employer thought I would jump ship and leave them for the next band director job that wasn't there. Sometimes I think my degree was just a colossal waste of time and money. Still, things could always be worse.
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I'll just say I disagree wholeheartedly with "The only difference between a mortgage and an indenture contract is that the latter is easier to get out of." That's simplistic and there is a whole lot more that goes into it, and I don't think taxes are the entire problem.
Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off 
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I've been looking into the cost of log homes for a while now. A lot of components are the same, such as foundation, heating, cooling, water, sewer, electric and communication. But the structure is dirt cheap, if you live in a rural area. Think it can't be done alone? How did the first settlers set up their homes?
A 12 inch thick log wall, depending on species, is about R30 for insulation value. Good luck getting that out of a stick built wall. It can be done, but adds to the expense and time to build.
Properly designed to protect the logs from the worst of the weather a log home is very energy efficient. You need wide overhangs to shield the logs from weather. Those wide overhangs shad your windows in the summer. In the winter, when the sun does not rise as high in the sky you can still benefit from passive solar.
And the envelope of the home is dirt cheap. About $99 for 1000 log feet in the northeast.
Or there are insulated concrete forms that can be used for the log home foundation. ICF can also be used to build the envelope of a regular home. Depending on thickness you can get a wall with R55 insulating value.
These homes are not significantly cheaper to build, because you need materials to finish the interior. But they are vastly cheaper to operate than a stick built home of comparable size.
And speaking of size, how big a house do you need? about 7 years ago I remember the hosts of This Old House were speaking unfavorably of 3,500 square foot McMansions springing up in the suburbs. I thought that if these guys are speaking against a bigger house, there's a problem. It wasn't just the size, but also the features. Cathedral ceilings, small lots, massive garages, total reliance on systems to heat and cool the home. All of which equals a home that is expensive to purchase and operate.
The more I get to know people the more I like my dogs.
...and he that has no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. Luke 22:36
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"Anyone stop and think about their personal economics and where their money and effort is going?"
Most people on this board get a rebate or pay nothing. They also get the entitlements. Why change anything?
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Mock, I've been here for years, these people work hard. I can't name a single welfare recipient here off the top of my head.
That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.
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Frem,
Roger that, loud and clear. Oh, I didn't know there was a musical animated series. Hmm...
That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.
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