LOST Finale

POSTED BY: cljohnston108
UPDATED: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 13:30
VIEWED: 6802
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CLJOHNSTON108

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 2:21 PM

Okay, I finally got to watch the episode, and I was in tears through half of it.
That final shot closed the circle perfectly.

Way back when Abrams, Lindelof & Cuse swore that the Smoke Monster was NOT a cloud of nanobots, I knew that this whole thing was imaginary, so I just went along for the ride, because not one shred of it could ever have happened; it was all just symbolism and metaphor and allegory.

Most amazing thing I'll ever see on TV.

Even though I avoided spoilers until actually watching the episode, I did catch your comments about the overly-Christian theme, but my Atheist sensibilities weren't jarred, especially since the stained glass covered all faiths...

But most folks on other boards are insisting that only the flash-sideways world was Purgatory, but the end credits convinced me otherwise...

There sits the remains of Oceanic 815, undisturbed by human hands, because there were no survivors.

I almost missed it, because my torrent cuts off right after the LOST title card, but somebody on io9 made a joke about it, so I went to Hulu.
(Of course, they should've probably taken care of those footprints in the sand.)

TWO

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 2:38 PM

“The producers came up with the best possible solution for ending the series. There was no way for it to be intellectually satisfying even if they took another 10 weeks. So they left virtually all questions in limbo and presented an emotionally satisfying ending - it didn't make sense but it felt good. OK, only kinda good for me but my wife and daughter spent much of the last hour crying and thought it was wonderful.” http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2010/05/end-lost#comment-590882

“Romantic art like "Lost" always brings out the cynics, eager to piss on the people who are having a good time.” Maybe cynics need to learn to let go.

The Joss Whedon script for "Serenity", where Wash lives, is
Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/two

ZEEK

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 2:46 PM

Hmmmm CLJOHNSTON108, I think you might be right. At the time of watching it I thought that was the wreckage from season 1 and it was just a throw back to the first episode.

However, looking at it now it doesn't really look like the same wreckage. I think they could have come up with something much more similar if that's what they were going for. So, maybe they are saying that the plane crashed and everyone died. Jack died in that bamboo forest and all of Lost was his own little purgatory. It sure would explain everything. Granted we all figured that out in the first season and they vehemently denied the purgatory theories. That I could accept.

If Lost was kind of like a dream world where it makes sense for things to not really make sense. Granted the whole emotional aspect is totally lost if the characters aren't real people.

LWAVES

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 4:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
Quote:
Originally posted by lwaves:
IMO if you go into a show like this wanting every point answered clearly with evidence then you were watching the wrong show.

I never said that.

Fair enough it's not exactly what you said but from your own posts:

Quote:

There is just way too much left open that we don't have enough evidence to answer.

There just isn't any evidence to figure out what was going on

I haven't seen any evidence to the contrary yet.

Looking at what you wrote it led me to believe you wanted some kind of proof for everything. A way for you to join the dots (so to speak).

Quote:

That's a dismissive statement and ignoring the issue that there were no answers. Not that they weren't given. That they just don't exist.

YOU say they don't exist and never did. I'm fairly sure in saying that you're probably not alone in this. That's okay as it's your take on things. I think that there are answers (or information to lead to a potential answer) so I wasn't being dismissive IMO, I was disagreeing. Although I state again that I don't think there are answers to every single point that has been brought up over the six seasons but there are ones in the show that only closer viewing and repeated watching will reveal.

Quote:

I'm saying in the writing meetings they never bothered to come up with a answer for like 80% of the stuff they threw at the screen. That is not deep and complex writing. The writers introduced things to the story with no resolution in mind. I think that's pretty much a fact at this point. That is a cheat to the viewer.

That most definitely is not a fact. It is your opinion. You weren't present at these meetings so you cannot state what went on. Neither you nor me will ever find out what went on.

And I have to ask as you repeatdly say there are no answers but you asked me about Eloise Hawking and Christian appearing to Jack in earlier posts. I gave my ideas/theories and you have yet to respond to them. As I say I'm not stating that they are right but that they are my opinion of possible answers from what I saw. If there are no answers as you say I like to read your take on them.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

ZEEK

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 4:50 PM

There's no evidence to back up that Eloise was special. We did see that she acquired Daniel's notebook when she killed him. That was evidence of where her future knowledge came from. It just doesn't support everything she did. I can't disprove something that was never shown. It's not good storytelling if that's the "answer" though.

As for Christian I can't remember Jack's state at the time. I don't think he was nearly as inebriated as he was in the first flash forward. The other thing to note was that he was drawn to the lobby by a smoke detector. That pretty heavily implies that it was the smoke monster. Which also implies they hadn't come up with the story of him wanting to leave the island. Which once again supports poor storytelling.

We'll never know?

David Fury, Lost co-executive producer, "Rolling Stone" issue #984, October 6, 2005:

"There was absolutely no master plan on Lost" insists David Fury. "Anybody who said that was lying." "On a show like Lost, it becomes a great big shaggy-dog story," Fury continues cheerily. "They keep saying there's meaning in everything, and I'm here to tell you no - a lot of things are just arbitrary. What I always tried to do to do was connect these random elements, to create the illusion that it was all adding up to something." "Many plot elements were concocted on the fly."

BROWNCOAT1

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 6:56 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by cljohnston108:
There sits the remains of Oceanic 815, undisturbed by human hands, because there were no survivors.

I thought about that, but why would Jack's father tell him that some present in the "church" had died before him and some "long after him" if they had all actually died in the crash?

My thoughts are that the island and everything that happened on it was real.

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LWAVES

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 9:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
There's no evidence to back up that Eloise was special. We did see that she acquired Daniel's notebook when she killed him. That was evidence of where her future knowledge came from. It just doesn't support everything she did. I can't disprove something that was never shown. It's not good storytelling if that's the "answer" though.

I agree that there is no evidence that directly says that Eloise was special. My take on it came from the evidence (and facts) that other people did have abilities. And I know it isn't a direct answer or evidence of the kind that you appear to want but it is a theory that I am happy to settle for.

Quote:

As for Christian I can't remember Jack's state at the time. I don't think he was nearly as inebriated as he was in the first flash forward. The other thing to note was that he was drawn to the lobby by a smoke detector. That pretty heavily implies that it was the smoke monster. Which also implies they hadn't come up with the story of him wanting to leave the island. Which once again supports poor storytelling.

No, he was nowhere near as bad as in later times. I don't think he had began drinking (at least not heavily) and I don't think he had his beard. It's not my fave theory and I much prefer the ghost one as we also know that Charlie appeared to Hurley so it's possible Christian appear to Jack. Unless he too is the smoke monster, but I personally don't think so.
As for it being the smoke detector that took Jack to the lobby being an implication that it's Smokey then yes, it is implying that. Doesn't mean it is though. It's not actually stating that it's Smokey.

As you say we'll never know.
I've gone through this show (several times on TV, DVD and Bluray) in believing that there was a plan, or a reason behind it all. I still believe in the show and that it has more to give. You don't think it has any answers and that is quite right on it's own as your view and anyone else who shares it. It wouldn't be the first time fans have felt cheated during a finale to a long running show.

And for the record you may be right that it was all made up for entertainment purposes, I just don't think so. If that was the case then I am wrong but unless the creators come out and actually say so then, again, we'll never know for sure. It was your statement that there are no answers that got me going and probably my statement that I could answer most questions I have that got you going. As I said we went to opposite poles, to either end of the scale or whatever.

So no hard feelings, we'll have to agree to disagree.
I'm genuinely sorry you feel this way about the show. Hopefully you can find something else to fill it's void that is more satisfying.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

LWAVES

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 9:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat1:
Quote:
Originally posted by cljohnston108:
There sits the remains of Oceanic 815, undisturbed by human hands, because there were no survivors.

I thought about that, but why would Jack's father tell him that some present in the "church" had died before him and some "long after him" if they had all actually died in the crash?

My thoughts are that the island and everything that happened on it was real.

I agree that everything but the sideways timeline was real. All the island stuff was definitely real IMO.

I thought I'd heard, or read, that the final shots of the beach wreckage was how the crew had left it after filming. Not sure whether I read it on the net or if it was on that Jimmy Kimmel aftershow thing or where. Could be BS though.

"The greatest invention ever is not the wheel. It's the second wheel." - Rich Hall

ZEEK

Tuesday, May 25, 2010 9:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lwaves:
So no hard feelings, we'll have to agree to disagree.
I'm genuinely sorry you feel this way about the show. Hopefully you can find something else to fill it's void that is more satisfying.

Yep no hard feelings at all. I think we both feel a little sorry for the other. Which is kinda silly when you think about it.

No void though. I was working under the hypothesis that they didn't know what they were doing and could never wrap it up. I got the proof I needed. Plenty of people say why watch if you don't like what they're producing. How do you prove them wrong if you don't weigh all the evidence?

ECGORDON

Wednesday, May 26, 2010 2:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by cljohnston108:
There sits the remains of Oceanic 815, undisturbed by human hands, because there were no survivors.

From the LA Times:

Quote:
ABC sets the record straight about the series finale's plane crash images

"You know those Oceanic 815 plane crash images that ran after Jack's (Matthew Fox) eye closed and the "Lost" logo appeared on our TV screens? Some "Lost" fans and TV critics have wondered if they were a last Easter egg from the producers, a clue meant to lead us to conclude that no one survived Oceanic 815's crash landing — and therefore everything we've seen over the last six years never really happened.

Well, ABC wants to clear the air: Those photographs were not part of the "Lost" story at all. The network added them to soften the transition from the moving ending of the series to the 11 p.m. news and never considered that it would confuse viewers about the actual ending of the show.

The images shown during the end credits of the 'Lost' finale, which included shots of Oceanic 815 on a deserted beach, were not part of the final story but were a visual aid to allow the viewer to decompress before heading into the news," an ABC spokesperson wrote in an e-mail Tuesday.

That means, Losties, that we were not supposed to think that Christian Shepherd (John Terry) is a liar. What Christian told his son, when they were reunited at the church, should serve as guidance for our interpretation of the series' ending.

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