Lonely Mal
POSTED BY: beatupplenty
UPDATED: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 15:14
VIEWED: 6590
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What, other than the war, do you think he's bitter about?
Well, the entirety of his beloved biological family is dead and his homeworld Shadow was completely destroyed. Oh, and he's very angry at God. It's all technically related to the war, but I think it's also separate issues that all hit him very strongly.
He's not just angry at the Alliance. There is a shit ton that he's angry about. He is bitter over everything he's lost (with occasional cross over into wistfulness if the mood hits him in regards to family), not just the war. He's not angry at his fellow browncoats, but he's pretty angry at Independent High Command for surrendering, enough that I think he'd balk at joining up with the Independents Try #2 if they offered him the chance. He's angry about what's happened to his life.
And he's angry at himself, a little, for getting himself invested in something that failed, for failing people he cared about (which, as we see in a few episodes, is a BIG deal to Mal, and arguably the one thing that hurts him the most). His becoming criminal is both a rebellion against the Alliance and the God who betrayed him and also a self-punishment that reinforces his opinion of himself as a bad man and a failure. Similarly, the name of his ship is equal parts rebellion and self-laceration, with a little bit of grim "funereal feel" to it.
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Sure, but IMO, what's important is how you control/express your anger, not whether you have it or not. If he was ridiculous and flew off the handle, then something is wrong. But I just don't see that.
As much restraint as Mal has, sometimes he DOES fly off the handle. Punching Simon, putting Jayne in the airlock, bullying Wash in Out of Gas (even though he kind of regretted it at the time), the way he went after Rance for shooting Nandi... People back away from Mal when he starts throwing his weight around (remember Jayne's response in Out of Gas?). He can be scary. Generally what Mal does is warranted, and lot of his anger and bitterness is understandable/forgivable/sympathetic just because of what he's been through. Plus he IS a decent guy underneath. But he's still scary, and he's still dangerous, and he definitely has a temper.
He has good days and bad days I'd say. Good days he's charming and funny and relaxes and probably fun to be around. But if he's in a mood about something, which generally amounts to either job worries, tense situations, bad memories, or Inara giving him the cold shoulder, then he wouldn't be easy to live with.
Simon decides to leave in the movie partially because Mal's been in an extended snit (judging by the comic book Those Left Behind, and extending those events into the movie, when Kaylee complains that his bad mood is running everyone off). His bringing River along on the Lilac job was most likely him being disagreeable and trying to piss Simon off than him actually NEEDING to bring River or wanting to give her job experience. Turns out they did need her, because for some reason Wash wasn't watching the Cortex for Reaver warnings, still, there's no way Mal could have anticipated that.
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Originally posted by Bytemite:Quote:
What, other than the war, do you think he's bitter about?
Well, the entirety of his beloved biological family is dead and his homeworld Shadow was completely destroyed. Oh, and he's very angry at God. It's all technically related to the war, but I think it's also separate issues that all hit him very strongly.
He's not just angry at the Alliance. There is a shit ton that he's angry about. He is bitter over everything he's lost (with occasional cross over into wistfulness if the mood hits him in regards to family), not just the war. He's not angry at his fellow browncoats, but he's pretty angry at Independent High Command for surrendering, enough that I think he'd balk at joining up with the Independents Try #2 if they offered him the chance. He's angry about what's happened to his life.
And he's angry at himself, a little, for getting himself invested in something that failed, for failing people he cared about (which, as we see in a few episodes, is a BIG deal to Mal, and arguably the one thing that hurts him the most). His becoming criminal is both a rebellion against the Alliance and the God who betrayed him and also a self-punishment that reinforces his opinion of himself as a bad man and a failure. Similarly, the name of his ship is equal parts rebellion and self-laceration, with a little bit of grim "funereal feel" to it.
Kind of all about the war, IMO. Yes it's a huge mish-mash of stuff, but it's pretty much the war and its effects on his life that he's angry about. A truly angry person finds little to no joy about anything. They are miserable 24/7 and repulsive. Mal has anger...but he's not an angry person.
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Originally posted by Bytemite:Quote:
Sure, but IMO, what's important is how you control/express your anger, not whether you have it or not. If he was ridiculous and flew off the handle, then something is wrong. But I just don't see that.
As much restraint as Mal has, sometimes he DOES fly off the handle. Punching Simon, putting Jayne in the airlock, bullying Wash in Out of Gas (even though he kind of regretted it at the time), the way he went after Rance for shooting Nandi... People back away from Mal when he starts throwing his weight around (remember Jayne's response in Out of Gas?). He can be scary. Generally what Mal does is warranted, and lot of his anger and bitterness is understandable/forgivable/sympathetic just because of what he's been through. Plus he IS a decent guy underneath. But he's still scary, and he's still dangerous, and he definitely has a temper.
He has good days and bad days I'd say. Good days he's charming and funny and relaxes and probably fun to be around. But if he's in a mood about something, which generally amounts to either job worries, tense situations, bad memories, or Inara giving him the cold shoulder, then he wouldn't be easy to live with.
On the instances you mentioned: Jayne and Wash was Mal being Captain. Doing what needed to be done to keep his ship and crew safe. It wasn't sunshine and roses, but it had to be done.
Being firm, commanding, even menacing doesn't bother me if it's for the right reasons. Mal is rarely any of those things without just cause.
Few people are truly "easy" to live with. I had a roomie for a while that was easy to live with...but it was still hard because I had to work at not taking advantage of her. She is the quintessential doormat. I could do anything and she'd take it. I could ask anything and she'd do it. It took a lot of effort, and was honestly exhausting at times, to try to guess where her boundaries were so I could be respectful of them. I like to think that after three years of living with me she cowboyed up a bit and wasn't so accomodating, but I'm not sure. :D
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Originally posted by Bytemite:
Simon decides to leave in the movie partially because Mal's been in an extended snit (judging by the comic book Those Left Behind, and extending those events into the movie, when KaylNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
How much joy does Mal have? It's like snippits here and there in a generally miserable universe. They're stuck between a crapsack world of primitive technology and extreme poverty and a crap sack world governed by an authoritarian police state and a crap sack world where all the other criminals are backstabbing untrustworthy scavengers. It's a post apocalyptic setting (Earth becoming uninhabitable counts, right?) meets a futuristic dystopia. We only see a few of his friends still alive, and it's very likely, considering they're all in dangerous occupations, that most of them will die.
The only times in the show where I actually see Mal somewhere approaching happy is when the crew is in good spirits eating dinner together (or drinking wine in the cargo bay with Inara) and the rare occasion something went RIGHT. Sometimes he's happy even if he was stabbed/shot/clothes got stolen, because it's so rare for ANYTHING to go right for him! And in the next minute, the engine could be blowing up.
I find that really, really sad. Hell, I'll be the first to wish that the universe would throw the poor dog a bone. But it is what it is.
Believe me, I think the anger he has is entirely justified, but that doesn't mean his anger isn't a problem for himself and the people around him.
And as for lonely, is there anyone on Serenity who he really talks about his problems with? Wash tries like once or twice, but is rebuffed. Zoe doesn't, she's a soldier, he's her commander, she expects him to buck up. They understand each other intuitively when it comes to combat, but personal matters? Not so much. Mal was completely taken by surprise by Zoe's marriage. Zoe often questions Mal when she thinks he's being reckless (like the Train Job) or unnecessarily hard (the kid attacked by Reavers in the movie), but Mal doesn't listen to her and she never asks him WHY. Kaylee? The most she might do is kiss his check and drop hints about Inara until he gets irritated. River might at least understand Mal, but she's got more than enough of her own problems to deal with, and I doubt Mal would actually unburden himself to her, he'd likely feel it was unnecessary because of what River already knows (but might not comprehend). Inara might understand him, and might even have the time and inclination to help him, but she doesn't.
I think there's a lot of things Mal struggles with under the surface, and he has no outlet. The question about whether he's lonely would be if he actually wants someone around to listen, or if he's naturally a loner. I think there's times where he tries to talk to Inara about this stuff, so I think he IS actively seeking SOMEONE, but he's usually shot down.
So, yeah, I see him as angry and lonely and generally a tragic character, even if there's times he's more upbeat. Mal, despite everything, is strangely an optimist and an idealist.
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Originally posted by Bytemite:
I think there's a lot of things Mal struggles with under the surface, and he has no outlet. The question about whether he's lonely would be if he actually wants someone around to listen, or if he's naturally a loner. I think there's times where he tries to talk to Inara about this stuff, so I think he IS actively seeking SOMEONE, but he's usually shot down.
So, yeah, I see him as angry and lonely and generally a tragic character, even if there's times he's more upbeat. Mal, despite everything, is strangely an optimist and an idealist.
Mal does not open up to people during the series. He hurts people's feelings (I'm thinking Kaylee, especially), and is not above drawing his gun on his own crew. People are drawn to him anyway. Maybe thats one of the reasons why I like him? Because when he's a jerk he's so dashing?
Anyway, I hereby endorse Byte's characterization of Mal. Byte is an oracle.
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I guess it's our worldviews that set us up for different interpretations.
I'm in the "life is a struggle that is mostly getting through one craptastic moment to the next and the moments of joy, be they few and far between or coming in succession,are what make it worthwhile." Kind of a "life sucks and then you die" philosophy but with a *wee* bit more optimism.
IF Mall wants someone to unburden himself to and can't do it...I would agree with you that he's closed off and lonely. But I just don't see that in him.
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"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw
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Originally posted by mincingbeast:
Mal does not open up to people during the series. He hurts people's feelings (I'm thinking Kaylee, especially), and is not above drawing his gun on his own crew. People are drawn to him anyway. Maybe thats one of the reasons why I like him? Because when he's a jerk he's so dashing?
Anyway, I hereby endorse Byte's characterization of Mal. Byte is an oracle.
but, but, but...Simon, the doormat hurts people's feelings. There's no one alive that hasn't hurt someone. And being a leader? You are going to do things people don't like.
Mal's not perfect...but he's by no means some angry, closed off person who's crew follows him despite himself. He's a flawed character, but one that is at least 90% good.
'course I know my opinion of Mal is different from the majority. I read that one thread all gaped mouth and was like "are we watching the same show?"
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"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw
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point taken.
when simon hurts people's feelings, it is because he is a boob. he doesn't really consider the implications of what he's saying. case in point: his awesome comment to kaylee about "well, all the other women are pros, married, or related to me..."
when mal does it, like his comment about kaylee and the ball, or kaylee and simon, he bristles with hostility and intent. as in, he knows hes hurting people's feelings, and thats why he says what he says. mal is an asshole, not a boob.
see, mal's character is not subjective, but rather totally objective. there is only one proper way to see mal: my way. let's duel over it. pistols or sabers, your pick.
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Actually, I'm not sure Mal intends to hurt people either, EXCEPT when he's really pissed off. Which... Happens.
But the Kaylee thing, I think Mal was more getting hostile because she made the connection between Inara and pretty dresses and her high status and her clients. And so Mal snapped at Kaylee about the dress, but it was really about him, Mal, being low in comparison, and being jealous about the clients. Kaylee is often a direct analogy for Mal's hidden good side and remaining innocence, that gets crushed down by the overwhelming darkness and bitter tragedy he's gone through. Mal bristled, leveraged that darkness at Kaylee, and shot his mouth off.
He indulges the girls admiring the dresses, right up until...
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KAYLEE
Only place I ever seen something so
nice is some of the things Inara has.
MAL
We'd best be movin'--
ZOE
Guess she needs all that stuff, life
she leads.
KAYLEE
Well, sure. And sometimes the
customers buy her things. She knows
some real rich men--
MAL
Come on. T'ain't feathers I'm toting
here, you know.
KAYLEE
I like the ruffles. Inara gets to
wear whatever she--
MAL
What would you do in that rig?
Flounce around the engine room? Be
like a sheep walkin' on its hind legs.
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Quote:
Originally posted by mincingbeast:
see, mal's character is not subjective, but rather totally objective. there is only one proper way to see mal: my way. let's duel over it. pistols or sabers, your pick.
Awesome. I choose this: edited out the giant picture of the giant sword. Didn't mean to screw up the thread parameters. :D
Bytemite: I agree that Mal didn't intend to hurt Kaylee's feelings about the dress but spouted off because HE was hurt.
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"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw
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well, i disagree. he was hurt, but that doesn't mean he didn't intend to hurt kaylee. if anything, that's why he wanted to hurt kaylee. he wanted to hurt something, and couldn't really hurt the object of his hurt, so kaylee was a serviceable punching bag.
also, rugbug, unless i am mistaken that is a katana. i distinctly offered to duel with pistols, or sabers. katanas are not for dueling, but rather ritualistic suicide.
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