9/11 Commission finds no Credible link between Al Qaeda and Saddam
POSTED BY: Zoriah
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 7, 2004 14:06
VIEWED: 22022
PAGE 9 of 10
Quote:
Originally posted by Doran:
"Didn't Bush do this to Saddam? Well, no WMD found, etc. You be the judge."
Thank you. Still more Sarin found yesterday. biologicals confiscated at the Jordanian border. The more time passes the more we see Bush hasn't falsely accused Saddam.
link please
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:Quote:
Originally posted by Doran:
"Didn't Bush do this to Saddam? Well, no WMD found, etc. You be the judge."
Thank you. Still more Sarin found yesterday. biologicals confiscated at the Jordanian border. The more time passes the more we see Bush hasn't falsely accused Saddam.
link please
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,124576,00.html
Freedom - Peace - Serenity
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link please>
I think it's wonderful that ya'al finally want to do some research.. Too bad you don't spend as much time researching Moore wacko movie claims.
Here's one but it was all over the news yesterday.. The scarey part is that these ones were intercepted on the Iraqi black market aimed at terrorist. These were found by the Pols..
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,124576,00.html
This stuff keeps showing up a little at a time.. and every time it does mostly the left dismisses it.. but these are them.. this is the stuff that Saddam was supposed to have gotten rid of years ago.
You may be one of those folks who feel really sorry for Saddam but I am not. Here's only a partial list of Saddam's crimes.
• July 16, 1979: Shortly after Saddam seized power, fifteen top party leaders who allegedly conspired against him were executed by firing squad.
• 1980: Iraqi forces invade neighboring Iran on September 22nd, sparking eight years of war that left an estimated one million dead. Chemical attacks against Iran kill as many as 5,000.
• 1983: Government launches campaign against members of the Kurdish Barzani tribe for helping Iran launch offensive in northern Iraq. Estimated 8,000 killed, many buried in mass graves.
• 1986 through '88: Scorched-earth offensive known as Anfal that includes chemical attacks on Kurds, estimated 180,000 Kurds killed many buried in mass graves in the south.
• 1988: Chemical weapons attack against Kurdish town of Halabja, or Halabja kills an estimated 5,000 civilians on March 28 -- and this does not touch on those who lived and were disfigured and ruined for the rest of their lives.
• 1990: Saddam orders invasion of Kuwait on August 2nd.
• 1990: Iraqi forces fire Scud missiles at Israel and Saudi Arabia.
• 1990: Iraqi soldiers allegedly torture summarily execute hundreds of Kuwaitis and set Kuwaiti oil wells ablaze.
• 1991: Some 60,000 people believed killed when Saddam violently crushes rebellion by Shi'ite Muslims in the south and Kurds in the north at close of Gulf War. Their bodies are found in mass graves all over the south.
• 1992: Draining of marshes in southern Iraq driving population known as "Marsh Arabs" from their homes and wiping out their way of life. Tens of thousands killed.
This alone is worth execution because of the environmental destruction. Forget what he did to the people; he destroyed the marsh! I mean, if the environmentalist wackos in this country and in Europe and around the world would be consistent, he goes to the electric chair, to the gas chamber, whatever, for this alone and the oil well fires. Of course, they got a problem with the oil well fires. They hate oil and they love the oil being depleted but they don't like the fires and that to pollute everything. Of course you know those oil well fires after the Gulf War in the early 90s? Everybody said, "It's going to cost tens years of pollution to the damage to the environment." It's all gone, got cleaned up. There's this thing called "rain," and, you know, when it falls through that all that stuff, it's magic. It's magic what happens. But anyway, forget what he did to the people. Forget what he did: gassing them and murdering them and burying them in mass graves. That is nothing. The environmental destruction alone, especially destroying the marsh! Why, he doesn't deserve to even get his day in court, if you ask me.
• 1996: Two of Saddam's sons-in-law are killed on February 20th after they return from Jordan where they fled and exposed the campaign to hide banned weapons from the United Nations.
Of course, there aren't any weapons of mass destruction. There never were any weapons of mass destruction. I mean, the whole world made up that lie, but Saddam executed a couple guys for spilling the beans on his program. That's just scratching the surface. The mass graves in
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Sorry, a link *not* Fox "news" please.
If you have respect for those guys fine, but to say that I lack respect for them is an understatement. Something outside of the US "news" media would be most appropriate.
And by the way, I stopped reading after you said,
"You may be one of those folks who feel really sorry for Saddam..."
If we are going to discuss you really are going to have to stop stuff of this sort.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Agent France Presse (AFP)
http://www.spacewar.com/2004/040702181116.ctvlrxgf.html
But the 122mm warheads, found in late June, have been found not to contain the deadly chemicals, a statement from multinational forces here said.
"Those 16 rounds were all empty and tested negative for any type of chemicals," it said.
Two other warheads found in mid-June were found to contain an insignificant amount of sarin gas. The armaments were left over from the Iran-Iraq war of the 1980s, the statement said.
"Due to the deteriorated state of the rounds and small quantity of remaining agent, these rounds were determined to have limited to no impact if used by insurgents against coalition forces."
Reuters
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=557992
5&pageNumber=1
Poland said the shells found by its troops dated from the 1980s and that it had bought them through individuals who contacted officials in its military zone in south-central Iraq.
"We bought all the shells available ... Terrorists are seeking these missiles on the black market, offering a price of around $5,000 per warhead," General Marek Dukaczewski, head of army intelligence, told a news conference.
He said there was no evidence any shells had ended up in militants' hands.
Poland said its soldiers found 17 Grad rockets and two mortar shells in late June and that U.S. experts had carried out tests on the weapons.
"Tests conducted showed that there was cyclosarin in the rocket heads," said Dukaczewski.
But the U.S. military said only two of the rockets had tested positive for sarin gas, and that another 16 rockets found by the Poles had contained no chemical agents.
The reason for the discrepancy in figures was unclear.
My personal opinion - as a scientist who knows about the technology used for testing - units designed to provide early warning have too many false positives to be useful. It's possible the Polish troops were relating preliminary inaccurate results. Or, it's possible there was miscommunication between various authorities.
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"Sorry, a link *not* Fox "news" please."
Can I have another source for any of M. Moore's contrivance?
Two versions of the same story came out. One from the liberal Reuters service; Polish soldiers last month recovered munitions containing deadly nerve agent cyclosarin and other things, in Iraq, and the first story today said (paraphrasing), "Well, you know these things are from 1988. They're old, and..." It's a typical Reuters story, "...and they have nothing to do with the weapons of mass destruction. They have nothing to do with the war in Iraq. It doesn't prove anything. Blah, blah-blah, blah, blah, blah." Really? 1988, sarin gas, the rocket shells in Iraq, weapons of mass destruction. Has nothing to do with it? The second incarnation of the story is this:
"Chemical munitions..." and this is the AP. "Chemical munitions found by Polish soldiers were being pursued by terrorists. Polish troops had been searching for munitions as part of their regular mission in south-central Iraq when they were told by an informant in May that terrorists had made a bid to buy the chemical weapons, which date back to Saddam Hussein's war with Iran in the 1980s, Gen. Marek Dukaczewski told reporters in Warsaw. 'We were mortified by the information that terrorists were looking for these warheads and offered $5,000 apiece. An attack with such weapons would be hard to imagine. All of our activity was accelerated at appropriating these warheads.' Dukaczewski refused to give any further details about the terrorists or the sellers of the munitions, saying only that his troops thwarted terrorists by purchasing the 17 rockets for a Soviet-era launcher and two mortar rounds containing the nerve agent for an undisclosed sum June 23," a little over a week ago.
Moore, the democrats, Kerry and so many libs think there's no WMD, there have never been any WMD. Well, why is it that the terrorists themselves think there are WMD there in Iraq? They are there looking for it.. I hope that they don't find it first.
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Quote:
Moore, the democrats, Kerry and so many libs think there's no WMD, there have never been any WMD.
OF COURSE there were WMD. We sold it to them, remember? If you care to scan back into one of my posts, they deteriorate with time (except mustard gas). 10 years ought to make cylcosarin oh, about... useless.
Quote:
Well, why is it that the terrorists themselves think there are WMD there in Iraq?
Maybe they're as effing stupid as you are.
PS- I'm working on a CWA project, so I should know.
DUH!
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Doran,
I think you didn't quote either story very well.
The Reuters story reported
Quote:That's according to the US military, not Reuters.
"the U.S. military said only two of the rockets had tested positive for sarin gas, and that another 16 rockets found by the Poles had contained no chemical agent".
The parts you deleted from the AP report said:
http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=12194584&BRD=1817&PAG=461&de
pt_id=68561&rfi=6
"But in Iraq, the U.S. military said trace amounts of the nerve agent found in a cache of rockets dating back to the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war were so deteriorated they would have had "little to no impact if used by insurgents."
...
"Laboratory tests showed the presence in them of cyclosarin, a very toxic gas, five times stronger than sarin and five times more durable," Bieniek told Poland's TVN24 at the force's Camp Babylon headquarters.
But the U.S. military statement said: "Due to the deteriorated state of the rounds, and small quantity of remaining agent, these rounds were determined to have limited to no impact."
As to 'liberals' saying there are no WMD, here is the link to David Kay's speech to the Senate:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/01/28/kay.transcript/
"Let me begin by saying, we were almost all wrong, and I certainly include myself here."
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Doran,
P.S.
The fact that you omitted the AFP story, misrepresented the Reuters one, censored the AP story then conveniently left off the url, and resorted to ad hominem attacks to make you case - should give you pause ...
How strong is your position?
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:
Well, why is it that the terrorists themselves think there are WMD there in Iraq?
Maybe they're as effing stupid as you are.
LOL! Advantage Signy!
Seriously, I'm pretty sick of this idea that "the terrorists" are some kind of unified force out there making policy decisions. Or that all the people in Abu Ghraib are "terrorists" who deserve whatever they get and not just soldiers in Saddam's army or people taken on the streets because they were near a terrorist hide-out or related to a terrorist (hey, all those rich Bin Ladden folks are related to a known terrorist too, but did they get thrown in a jail and tortured? Oops). People in Saddam Hussein's army are no more responsible for his policies than any of our troops are responsible for Bush's policies. In the main, they're just more poor people ground up in the war machine.
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
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