Real World Event Discussions

BACKBONE: Howard Dean says: Vote the Senate health-care 'reform' DOWN

POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Sunday, September 14, 2025 23:09
VIEWED: 6438
PAGE 7 of 8

KWICKO

Friday, December 18, 2009 5:02 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
Quote:
Byte, what I heard a while ago is that the ins. co's monopoly status makes small co-ops or actually any OTHER insurance company start-ups virtually impossible. It's been long enough ago that I forget the reasons, tho' I do remember one was their influence in local government.

That's why I said this:

Quote:
One thing that could be done locally, if you removed or greatly diminished the power of the insurance industries

Yup, and their specific anti-trust exemption is shielded by the new bill, and codified into law. Of course it is. :(

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

NIKI2

Friday, December 18, 2009 6:23 AM

Shit, Mike, I didn't know THAT was part of it too!!! Damn and f*ck...

They've really got a good thing going with this bill, don't they? Couldn't have fixed it better themselves...and if they'd PROPOSED this initially, it'd have been laughed out of Congress...bastards.

PIRATENEWS

Saturday, December 19, 2009 4:49 AM

Howard Dean goes to war... against Obama in 2012
http://4wrdthnkndad.wordpress.com/2009/12/17/if-current-healthcare-ref
orm-passes-then-howard-dean-in-2012/

PIZMOBEACH

Saturday, December 19, 2009 3:20 PM

"Democrats Say They Clinch Deal on Health Care Overhaul"

http://prescriptions.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/19/democrats-say-they-c
linch-deal-on-health-care-overhauls/?hp

"As the Senate convened in a driving snowstorm, Democratic lawmakers and senior officials said a breakthrough came when Senator Ben Nelson, Democrat of Nebraska, agreed after hours of negotiation Friday to back the legislation, making him the pivotal 60th vote."

"Mr. Reid’s amendment also includes a substantial increase in federal contributions to Nebraska’s costs of providing Medicaid coverage to the poor."

It's like a rug bazaar, Baghdad, circa 500 B.C...

Trying to get this through before Christmas - when everyone is busy doing other things - is pretty sh*tty too.

I think Byte made the suggestion: let's all just stop paying for insurance - A Nationwide "Eff The Insurance Companies Day."

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

CITIZEN

Sunday, December 20, 2009 12:03 AM

Now this is comedy:

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, December 20, 2009 1:36 AM

Re: the bill

It just looks like a very ugly tax on the poor that guarantees no extra medical care. Providedrs and insurance companies can still select what care you will receive, kick out people who are really sick, and include huge deductables so that care isn't actually free. This might very well be *worse* than what we have now, because at least now a healthcare provide can't refuse treatment, but soon, they won't have to, an insurance auditor can do it for them.

I'm pretty strongly RTL myself, but I find this stance just inherently absurd in its contradictions: The bill will charge families by the child, but will not cover abortion. I'm sorry, okay, you can't have the abortion *and* we will add the new child to your policy, which you will have to buy...

Argh. Dean is a dick, but I agree, even if he's just jumping on a bandwagon a la Kerry and Gore. Vote it down and try again later. It's not like the idea is dead forever if the bill fails. A bill can be tried every year, which means that if this bill dies in the House, they won't be able to float another universal healthcare bill that actually *does* contain the public option until 2010, which is less than two weeks from now. I wouldn't be panicking at this point. Just kill it, and write a new bill.

Citizen,

You'll notice a radical misuse of the term "Shadow Government" in the US.

Personally, I support the Shadow Govt. and hope that when they win in 2010 they actually do what they say... but that's another matter

JKIDDO

Sunday, December 20, 2009 1:53 PM

BTW, that's a real phone number in the moveon.org ad. I suggest that you use it.

NIKI2

Sunday, December 20, 2009 5:21 PM

I agree, DT, this bill is a sham and a gimme to the insurance companies. Without a public option and WITH the individual mandate, it's worsre than a joke, it's insane. But I'm not sure failure means it'll be tried again any time soon. I think having observed what happened this time will make any legislator shy away from tackling it again any time soon, which is a damned shame.

It's just proven to me that the ins. co.s and pharma are more powerful than our government, and how that makes me feel, well, I'll refrain.

And yes, Citizen, that prayer thing wasn't even a joke, it was a travesty...that ANY people should pray the way they did sickens me; that they would take it to this extreme leaves me speechless. While I don't want to see the bill survive as things are now, the use of religion, and the absolutely nauseating things I heard, nonetheless make me want to lash out...badly!

The Lieberman thing was all too right on to be funny...but it was all too right on!

JKIDDO

Sunday, December 20, 2009 5:42 PM

Niki, if the bill is voted down then progressive voters can look to unseating specific roadblocks in the Senate in 2010. (We're looking at YOU, Joe Lieberman, Max Baucus, Ben Nelson, Mary Landrieu, Blanche Lincoln and Birch Bayh. ). Don't you think that a lot of progressive rage can't be stirred up against them? It's time the Party purged itself of its right wing anyway... and replacing just one of these dickheads with a more progressive vote would be enough.

NIKI2

Sunday, December 20, 2009 6:13 PM

I absolutely agree, but whether outrage at the Dems not being able to accomplish anything can outweigh outrage at the repubs for not letting anything BE accomplished is bigger will determine the outcome.

Or perhaps I should say, the dems' ability to drive outrage v. the repubs' ability, since it's not about what IS SO, but what is MADE TO SEEM SO.

Sadly, I see the repubs (as they have always been) more adept at manipulation than the dems, but I'll hold out hope.

Yes, if they'd JUST had 60 real dems, or more than 60 with 60 with few enough blue dogs to resist them...but will that ever happen? Will 60 ever happen again in my lifetime? That's the question.

Dems have always been "like herding cats" while repubs like herding shep...the problem with a "big tent" that actually encompasses semi-dems...

(I'm posting a viral video representation of the repubs' ability to control their sheep on Talk Story; check it out just for the entertainment value!)