Objects in Space - River's wanderings
POSTED BY: Rabit
UPDATED: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 03:45
VIEWED: 12846
PAGE 3 of 4
Interesting theory.
In my opinion, i think Joss was just trying to show how wrapped up the crew had become in their own lives that they didn't even notice River walk through...
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
MAL: This is my scrap of nowhere. You go on and find your own.
SAFFRON: You can't just leave me here, on this
lifeless piece of crap moon...
MAL: Sure I can.
SAFFRON: I'll die.
MAL: Well, as a courtesy, you might start
getting busy on that, cause all this chatter ain't doin' me any kindness.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I take the scene where Simon and Kaylee smile at River as part of River's mind reading. It shows their fondness of River, perhaps.
I cannot believe that Book would ignore River if she walked past he and Jayne. Book would have said hello. He is one of those caring, nurturing guys, not self-absorbed at all.
I also find it difficult to believe that Mal and Inara would both a) miss seeing River on the stairs and b) carry on the "Inara is leaving" discussion in her presence.
Okay, MAYBE Wash and Zoe would miss her peeping during their make-out session.
I think that River was not seen by the others. Either she was reading their minds from a distance, or she was clouding their minds so that she could not be seen by them. The latter would not require transparent invisibility to light. It would only be the strong mental command, "You don't see me!" If a camera were on her, recordings of her could be seen.
It is clear to me that this beginning part of the show was River's PERCEPTION of what was going on. This is how River sees the world. This view must then be reconciled with reality.
The Real Me
Got Mudder's Milk?
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by DeannaMay:
I need to go back and watch that episode, because I could have sworn they had both Simon and Kaylee smiling at her, after Simon did his thing about saying he would be there now.
I remember that too. This is a slight tangent, but I think the way Kaylee looks at her when Simon says his thing is a little scary. No smile, no compassion. It's weird to see her like that.
My $0.02:
This is an interesting theory, but I think some people's reactions (Simon, Jayne and maybe Inara) were provoked by her presence, which is why I think she *was* actually there. Simon, for example, looks directly at her when he says he would be there now. He seems to blame her. Jayne also looks directly at her when he says the money was too good. He obviously feels guilty. I don't think he would have had that thought randomly in the middle of a conversation about masturbation. The only other person who looks at her directly is Inara, when she says "You can tell me, I'm a big girl", but I haven't figured her out yet. I also don't know why they would have continued to talk about Inara leaving in River's presence, except that maybe they really didn't see or hear her. She was, after all, walking around barefoot, and those two, as we know, are really into each other.
Julia
Jayne: "Well, I say as a rule that girlfolk ain't to be trusted."
River: "Jayne is a girl's name."
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:Yes!!! Awesome - that's exactly the missing piece that I needed. I'd forgotten that she heard Early's voice. That makes complete sense to me. Many thanks!
Originally posted by THEREALME:
I think she got a gun ready to oppose Jubal Early, whose "voice" woke her near the start of the episode. Of course, when everybody gets freaked out that River has a gun, it blows her concentration and she becomes "wacky fun" River again.
Quote:No offense, but I'd seriously suggest that you watch the scene again. At those special moments (Jayne's money comment, Simon's "be there now" comment, etc.), there is a distinct transition out of the realm of normalacy just before it and another transition just after it. For example, in the case of Simon's comment, he and Kaylee are laughing, then they are suddenly serious as he makes his comment, and then they are laughing again as though the comment was never said. This just doesn't make sense to me if taken literally, as though she were there. I think that both Simon and Kaylee would actually say something to her, if she was. They wouldn't ignore her and just keep on talking, would they?
Originally posted by pingjing:Quote:
Originally posted by DeannaMay:
I need to go back and watch that episode, because I could have sworn they had both Simon and Kaylee smiling at her, after Simon did his thing about saying he would be there now.
I remember that too. This is a slight tangent, but I think the way Kaylee looks at her when Simon says his thing is a little scary. No smile, no compassion. It's weird to see her like that.
My $0.02:
This is an interesting theory, but I think some people's reactions (Simon, Jayne and maybe Inara) were provoked by her presence, which is why I think she *was* actually there. Simon, for example, looks directly at her when he says he would be there now. He seems to blame her. Jayne also looks directly at her when he says the money was too good. He obviously feels guilty. I don't think he would have had that thought randomly in the middle of a conversation about masturbation. The only other person who looks at her directly is Inara, when she says "You can tell me, I'm a big girl", but I haven't figured her out yet. I also don't know why they would have continued to talk about Inara leaving in River's presence, except that maybe they really didn't see or hear her. She was, after all, walking around barefoot, and those two, as we know, are really into each other.
A friend of mine suggested some importance to the individuals that looked at River when making their "comments". I honestly don't think that this is the case - I really think that they just lined people up in positions that made sense. I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time!
), but it seems more that the idea of her reading their thoughts in general was the important aspect.Thanks for the conversation on this, folks! It's greatly appreciated...
Rabit
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Rabit:
A friend of mine suggested some importance to the individuals that looked at River when making their "comments". I honestly don't think that this is the case - I really think that they just lined people up in positions that made sense. I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time!
I'd say everything in the episode is pretty carefully blocked out - given how carefully Joss does "these" episodes (this was clearly one that was going to play out for a good long while), where people were looking and the way things were said probably does mean something. Its like the fact that nobody touched Giles in Season 7 Buffy, Little Miss Muffet and all those other tiny little things.
My view was if they were looking at River, it was a thought about her - else it was a general though bubbling under.
"I threw up on your bed"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Rabit, you are welcome. The idea of River vs Early came to me as I was writing that reply.
I agree with the idea that the stark transitions are important when they go from laughing it up, to serious but cryptic statements, and then back to laughing it up.
Right. Like the statements never happened.
I am also inclined to believe that the directions the characters were facing when delivering their thought-messages are significant, but I am less sure of that.
The Real Me
Got Mudder's Milk?
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Heh, I'm a firm believer in the fact that every little thing has meaning in some way. Unfortunately, Inara's looking at River while making a comment that is - to me, anyway! 
- blatantly directed at Mal... Well, that one is what troubles me. It breaks the pattern of people looking at her regarding comments that are in some way about her.
This is a case where I'm looking forward to being wrong. I really want someone to find out why some of the crew are looking at her and some aren't! But until then... I'll assume there isn't meaning to it. 
Rabit
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
In another thread this idea came up. The theory that I put forth was as follows:
Looking at River = comment about River
Looking at self (Book down at his hands) = comment about self
Looking away or at nothing = comment general in nature.
In that other thread, someone belived that Inara was not looking directly at River, but slightly off to one side. I haven't had the chance to confirm this yet.
I don't think Inara's comment is about Mal at all. She is a companion and can read people. She KNOWS that Mal loves her. And at the end of Heart of Gold he was about to confess his love when she shut him up by announcing that she would leave.
The Real Me
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
i'd agree that inara didn't seem to be looking quite at river. it seemed like she was actively looking away from mal whilst expecting him to come out with something that she didn't want to hear. I'd also argue that in the context of her little insight bit, that it wasn't actually mal that she was talking with, but his being there allowed that sort of body language thing to happen.
---------------------------------------------
eviltobz - that's lowercase gorram it!
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by THEREALME:
Looking at self (Book down at his hands) = comment about self
Look what was in Book's hands- The Knife River used to slash Jayne and his Blue Sun shirt.
Opens the possablitys dosn't it.
The Firefly CCG Yahoo Group:
http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/FFCCG
The Firefly CCG Forum:
http://s8.invisionfree.com/FFCCG/
My Other Site:
http://www.geocities.com/billds9/
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME