May the Gods forgive us.

POSTED BY: Fremdfirma
UPDATED: Friday, August 15, 2025 14:25
VIEWED: 4059
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FIVVER

Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:04 PM

This is a bit personal for me. The father to be of my lovely bride was a navy medic attached to the Marines. His division had already been in action on Okinawa and was slated to land on D-day for the invasion of the home islands. By D+10 his division no longer shows up in the Allied order of battle. The assumption was it would have been destroyed by then. Using the bomb quite probably saved his life and definitely saved thousands of his comrades.

Several years ago I had the privilige of touring Pearl Harbor with him. Seeing through the eyes of a man who was last there while they were still clearing up debris was a moment I'll never forget.

While not technically a Marine he was always invited to the division reunions - even though he was only a swabbie, the Marines respect the medics.

Today he's in his 90s and no longer as spry as he used to be. He is now willing to talk about his experiences so everytime we visit we take a tape recorder.

BYTEMITE

Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:18 PM

Our attacks on the Japanese homeland during WW2, all of them, from the nukes to the firebombing, would be considered war crimes if any other country had done them. Or rather, if we lost.

WW2 was a horrifying war. I'm not giving a free pass to the other nations who committed war crimes, either, and they committed equally bad ones. Every single country involved killed and tortured civilians, not as collateral damage, but intentionally. Every single one.

It was a dark era of humanity, full of hatred and murder. This thread has disturbed me, and I'm done here.

AGENTROUKA

Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
WW2 was a horrifying war. I'm not giving a free pass to the other nations who committed war crimes, either, and they committed equally bad ones. Every single country involved killed and tortured civilians, not as collateral damage, but intentionally. Every single one.

It was a dark era of humanity, full of hatred and murder. This thread has disturbed me, and I'm done here.

That's very well stated.

RIGHTEOUS9

Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:36 PM

is definitely a hard topic...

Yeah, I just read Slaughterhouse 5 again about 2 weeks ago, and I guess conventional weapons can also exact the same kind of death toll...

I'm vaguely conflicted on hiroshima, I am disturbed by Nagasaki. How many bombs did we have? Could we have dropped one in demonstration somewhere? I know the counter to this is that the Japanese didn't readily surrender after Hiroshima, but could we have waited some time?

It is certainly technology(the weaponized side of it) of disturbing magnitude and I wish it didn't exist in that form---on the flip side, it could be argued that somebody was going to get that bomb...I'm not sure how good my history is on this but I did watch an old star trek episode...

wasn't Germany in development of one themselves?

I will say I feel very little ill will towards the scientist who helped the russians get up to speed, and I think, given our history, or any country's history for that matter, that as not only a citizen of the U.S., but as a fellow human being on this Earth, I am glad we had an arms race and not our own private bullying device. (and yes, I know how bad stalin was)

SIGNYM

Thursday, August 6, 2009 3:54 PM

Have to look back on it but... I recall an analysis that indicated the Japanese were within a few days of surrender. The Bomb was sent as a warning shot across RUSSIA'S bow, should they have plans on Japan. The message was: We'll annihilate anyone, including you.

PIRATECAT

Thursday, August 6, 2009 4:43 PM

Hero, you proved my point. Sherman and Grant devised a plan to end the South from making war. War is ugly. You must devastate the enemy. The South was the better soldier. Now you have a sneak attack on the Pacific Forces. 30,000 armed and supplied troops surrender. The Bataan Death March should never be forgotten. The rape of China. Tarawa and Saipan are unbelievable losses for the Marine Corp. FF doesn't care how many US troops would have died in an invasion. The second bomb was dropped because Tojo wouldn't surrender. Then a coup was lead to the unconditional surrender on the USS Missouri. When the Germans not just SS pulled back from Russia the rape of children and murder of there parents in every town is really not known to the public. When Stalin's troops got to the border of Germany the order was only babies are innocent. So I don't care what happened in Berlin. They deserved it.

"Battle of Serenity, Mal. Besides Zoe here, how many-" "I'm talkin at you! How many men in your platoon came out of their alive".

PIRATECAT

Thursday, August 6, 2009 4:50 PM

Kinko, I have only one response to you. Shane would say this to ya "Your a low down lyen Yankee".

The Blockfighter has few words for ya too.

Big Shtyle

"Battle of Serenity, Mal. Besides Zoe here, how many-" "I'm talkin at you! How many men in your platoon came out of their alive".

SIGNYM

Thursday, August 6, 2009 5:21 PM

It's interesting that people who value Firefly put such small thought towards the concept of Small People getting ground up by Big Forces. Japan, USA, Soviet Union, China... one Alliance versus another, with people caught in the middle.

AGENTROUKA

Thursday, August 6, 2009 5:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by PirateCat:
So I don't care what happened in Berlin. They deserved it.

Sure, the children and young teenaged girls totally had it coming.

Does it ever enter your mind that some things are just wrong, no justification necessary? If it's wrong when the Nazis did it, it's wrong when the Russians did it. Or anyone else does it.

PIRATECAT

Thursday, August 6, 2009 5:39 PM

Agent, so did Ike. It's apathy like yours that it happens in the first place.

"Battle of Serenity, Mal. Besides Zoe here, how many-" "I'm talkin at you! How many men in your platoon came out of their alive".

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