Minor Pickiness
POSTED BY: Mark
UPDATED: Friday, November 15, 2002 19:58
VIEWED: 4971
PAGE 1 of 2
Yeah, I know, you'll get to the end of this post and say "Why the hell did he need to say that" but I don't care... 'Cause I think you should say what you think, it might stir something in others.
Anyway...
In Out Of Gas - When we're in one of the flashback scenes, we see Mal introducing Zoe to what will become Serenity... Now what bothers me is that she calls him Sir. Now, When it's not a flashback then it's not a problem, because Mal is the Captain of the ship and you call the Captain Sir... But in the flashback, it's set just after the end of the war and, back then, Mal was Zoe's (I expect Corporal Zoe's) Sergeant. And as everyone knows who's seen a military film or TV show with Lee Ermy starring, you NEVER call a Sergeant Sir.
"I'm not an Officer! I work for a living!!!"
Minor Jossian Boo Boo?
Or explainable?
Twelve spheres of unendurable brightness spalled the velvety blackness of space.
The silence on Lester Tourville's flag bridge was absolute
And then the spell was broken as Shannon Foraker looked up from her console from where she had just sent a seemingly innocent command to the main computers of State Security's finest Superdreadnoughts.
"Oops." She said.
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500 years changes military rules/ranks/ordering.
Just be glad they don't call everyone Comrade whatever, or Citizen whatever.
Maybe Zoe really respects him, maybe the Independants classified Sergents as officers, who knows.
I think the writers just screwed up.
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May the road rise to meet you.
May the wind be always at your back.
May you be in heaven an hour before
The Devil knows you’re dead.
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At the Battle of Serenity he ended up being in command of everyone of the Independent troops that were left alive when all the officers were killed. Maybe Zoe considered it a battlefield promotion.
Cardie
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Your information about the present military is incorrect as well. Privates call their Sarges "sir" all the time. In fact, this is the first I've ever heard of it not being insisted upon. (My brother was in the Army for a while.)
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I b'lieve one calls a Sergeant "Sir" (if one values one's life) but NEVER "Officer."
Inside every cynic there's an idealist desperately yearning to be let out, and when they are let out they're usually a real pain and cause all sorts of trouble. --Chris Boucher
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Oh well then... I stand VERY corrected. I always was more of a fan of military technology than the rules and regs that the soldiers live under.
Maybe I've just watched one too many Vietnam movies and gotten the details all jumbled up... Sorry to all the past and future troopers out there.
Twelve spheres of unendurable brightness spalled the velvety blackness of space.
The silence on Lester Tourville's flag bridge was absolute
And then the spell was broken as Shannon Foraker looked up from her console from where she had just sent a seemingly innocent command to the main computers of State Security's finest Superdreadnoughts.
"Oops." She said.
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I don't know anything of Modern Armed Forces but in the Royal Navy and the Red Coats of 1800ish this is definately true. Anybody not an Officer was probably just called Mr "soandso" or just "soandso". Being a Captain had nothing to do with it, infact most captain's prefered to be called cap'n.
Side Note: In the strange event that an entire ship was left without officers and a un-commisioned man must take charge he would not be called "sir" but "cap'n".
Sorry I've read to much C.S. Forester
Firefly@Trekvideo.com
http://www.trekvideo.com/firefly
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark:
Oh well then... I stand VERY corrected. I always was more of a fan of military technology than the rules and regs that the soldiers live under.
Maybe I've just watched one too many Vietnam movies and gotten the details all jumbled up... Sorry to all the past and future troopers out there.
All I know about it is what I got off of S:AAB; my dad was a sarge but I haven't had a chance to ask him.Inside every cynic there's an idealist desperately yearning to be let out, and when they are let out they're usually a real pain and cause all sorts of trouble. --Chris Boucher
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Quote:You probably have watched too many Vietnam War movies, but you’re not entirely wrong. The use of the word "sir" is a complicated custom in the military. Both the Army and Navy officially discourage the use of the word sir in reference to enlisted personnel, however the Airforce and Coast Guard do not discourage such use and there will even be times when enlisted personnel are required to refer to senior enlisted personnel as "sir" or "ma'am." So what you've seen in the movies is not entirely inaccurate. In the Army enlisted personnel are expected to reference a senior enlisted by their rank. Which means, that if you are a private talking to your sergeant, you would be expected to reference him/her as "sergeant" not "sir." However, this would not necessarily be the case in the Airforce and Coast Guard. The matters are complicated even further by the fact that the official customs are generally not strictly followed in every day life in the military. Which means that if you are a private in the Army and you are talking to your sergeant you might very well call him/her "sir/ma'am" regardless of the official custom.
Originally posted by Mark:
Oh well then... I stand VERY corrected. I always was more of a fan of military technology than the rules and regs that the soldiers live under.
Maybe I've just watched one too many Vietnam movies and gotten the details all jumbled up... Sorry to all the past and future troopers out there.
The point being that, while you aren't completely wrong, you can't really infer anything from Zoe's use of the word "sir" in reference to Mal.
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In the Dark Ages, Romano-Celtic Britannia was over-run by Viking-like cultures collectively called the Anglo-Saxons. They were led by warlords called Drytinns, and the greatest warriors among them were the Thegns.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Quill:
I b'lieve one calls a Sergeant "Sir" (if one values one's life) but NEVER "Officer."
Depends on which Army, in the US Army, a Sergeant is addressed as Sergeant, except for First Sergeant and Sergeant Major. Other Armies have different traditions. Some US NCOs would address a Sergeant Major as "Sir", like they would an officer or warrant officer, or Cadet serving for training purposes.
Other forces other rules.
Jeff Timm
Who was in the US Army 1972 - 1982, Private (E-1) to Staff Sergeant (E-6)
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