firefly and kids, help.

POSTED BY: AshCrouch
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 26, 2009 07:19
VIEWED: 3005
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ASHCROUCH

Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:42 PM

Hi guys, I'm new to threading on the forum but been reading for quite a while.

I love firefly, just recently forced my fiance to watch it and now she loves it too, couldn't get her away from the tv when it was on.

I work with children and wanted to know if I could pass on any firefly knowledge to my little ones as though they can't watch it, it could benefit them.

Any help and suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

BYTEMITE

Wednesday, May 20, 2009 10:27 PM

It's tricky, because in some ways the characters have admirable traits, but none of them I'd really call a good role model for kids.

'Cept maybe Kaylee, Wash, and Simon... It's hard really to condemn Kaylee and Wash for any of the more morally ambiguous things the crew does, and Simon is kind of as straight shooter, goody two shoes as it gets. Possibly Book and Inara, if you're particularly liberal or fuzzy on kneecaps, they're fonts of wisdom and moral advice.

There was a similar discussion that Chrisisall started... Here. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=37442

It eventually turns into a big debate on morality, and also where morality comes from. Derails a bit, to be honest... Which is mostly my fault... *Embarrassed*

I guess before I can answer your question, exactly what values do you want your children to take away, or what questions of theirs do you want to answer?

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:12 AM

Perhaps the concepts of no matter where we go, our humanity will follow us, it's greatness and it's frailties. And, contrary to historic Papal teachings, you can still believe in God when not on Earth.
When Star Trek and MASH used futurictic or historical settings to use as fables of modern (or at the time, current) social events, Firefly doesn't use that, it's already dealing with humans versus humans, the social subtexts are already dealt with as givens.
What age are these "little ones" anyhow?

Of course, the quest and desire for Freedom and independence should never be secreted from children.

PEACEKEEPER

Thursday, May 21, 2009 11:03 AM

A similar thread popped up not so long ago.Unfortunately as much as I love Firefly,I have to say that perhaps your proteges need educating from your OWN experiences, rather than relying on a TV programme.I think this takes obsession a little too far.Dont mean to offend by saying that.

ASHCROUCH

Thursday, May 21, 2009 4:57 PM

Peacemaker, no offense taken at all.

JewelStaiteFan, I am a youth worker. Some of the children are as young as 3 but range to 15-16. The older children don't see people giving them freedom and just wanting to control what they do and say so although I don't want them breaking the law (probably not great seeing as that happens most of the time in firefly) I want them to see the freedom the crew have and if they are going to break the law (which many already do) where to draw the line.
I have some of the younger children already saying shiny which has confused a couple of parents and impressed one.

Maybe Peacemaker is right and its taking the obsession to far, but what about the death of the show. I feel encouraging the young to watch it means it will stay around for a lot longer.

One of my biggest aim in my work is showing the children, in the last 30 years childrens freedom has gone from going into forests and walking to school from as young as 6 to not being able to leave there house at 12. I think my biggest aim is for children to be free, follow their own destinies and choose their own lives. Not have life thrust onto them

PEACEKEEPER

Thursday, May 21, 2009 5:51 PM

Ash, What you are saying does make a lot of sense.But I must reiterate my previous statement.The joy of being a Firefly fan,or indeed any other form of televisual entertainment,is to express the joy we had in watching something that took us away from reality in a way that other shows just couldn't.In that respect,I can fully understand why people(Including myself) would actively campaign for the reinstatement of a show that gave us so much escapist fulfillment(albeit prematurely taken from us).What I cannot get my head around,is the idea that a tv show of the nature of Firefly,should be taken as anything more than entertainment,escapism,refreshment at the end of a long working week.I think that overanalysing of such entertainment, by trying to incorporate it as some kind of educational tool for life,is somewhat taking things a little far.Im sure there are lessons that can be learned from many shows and I'm not saying that Firefly doesn't deserve a place in anybody's experience of life.After all,the shows that touch us are worth remembering and fighting for.But i just think it should be discussed for what it IS,rather than what it represents in everyday life.It is entertainment,pure and simple.The kids you are in charge of should of course be encouraged to watch and support the show,but I don't think it is necessary to promote it as an educational tool.That is where I think that some people lose the plot.Enthusiasm is healthy,obsession is dangerous.But,please enjoy Firefly and encourage your kids to do the same.It will ENTERTAIN them someday too.Regards.

MSA

Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:11 PM

ASh I teach special ed and have several behavior and social skills lessons that involve snippets of Firefly if you'd like to use them feel free to PM me.
Their based on cognative mapping so it's intensive intervention using exemplar with anaysis and metacognition.

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

BYTEMITE

Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:14 PM

Hmm. Well, I agree we all like Firefly because of the entertainment value. But if it was just entertainment, would we like Firefly as much as we do? I think all of us who appreciate Firefly do so because in some way we relate to it. There's 9 different characters, all of them nuanced and from different backgrounds, and any one of them or all of them, a person can see a bit of ourselves reflected in them.

I consider Firefly art. Not many tv shows are that, but that's what Firefly is. Like literature, even in just one season and a movie, this show explores some important issues of morality, character, and themes. I think there's meanings and layers, and while a person can just appreciate the snappy dialogue and plot progression, no harm no foul, or as a study in writing, purely intellectual, I think it's the spirit of the show that is so catching.

Ashcrouch. If you were to take anything to the kids you look after, that's what I would bring. The spirit of independence is already ingrained in these characters and their ship. Let the kids decide for themselves who or what they relate to. Some of the characters aren't perfect, some of them even are a bit criminal, but in so many small ways they're all better people than they could be, and that's probably what's most important. None of us are perfect either, after all.

If the kids like the story and the characters, chances are they'll also appreciate the message about free-thinking and will.

IMNOTHERE

Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by peacekeeper:
What I cannot get my head around,is the idea that a tv show of the nature of Firefly,should be taken as anything more than entertainment,escapism,refreshment at the end of a long working week.

Especially if (as Ash's original post seems to suggest) the kids in question aren't actually going to be able to see the show... Stories may have the power to teach, but not if you take away the story!

I think one of the appeals of the show is the moral ambiguity: our Big Damn Heroes are also petty criminals and (unlike the cackling villains of other shows) the Alliance isn't notably more evil than the typical western democracy, and some of the bad guys really do think they're doing the right thing.

I suppose if it has any take-home morals, they are:
1. Right and wrong can be complicated
2. Don't be too quick to judge
3. Few people are completely good, or completely evil
4. ...apart from Niska and the Blue Hand Gang.
5. If you want heavy-handed morality tales, go watch Star Trek (but remember 1-3 above)!

BEATLESFAN

Thursday, May 21, 2009 8:55 PM

I don't think there is any one character or episode that is entirely good for this except for maybe the three previously mentioned characters. The show WOULD be good, though, for snippets, little examples of things.

I don't see a problem using examples - in my teaching experiences I use a lot of references, whether it be TV shows, songs, or other things. It's good to have references or examples to back up things you say. Yes personal experience is great (and most of the time best), but when you have younger students, using something that involves cowboys and space ships is going to grab their attention fast.

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