Cheney's assasination ring
POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 17, 2024 22:12
VIEWED: 3267
PAGE 5 of 7
Quote:Well, another option is to toss in comments like this and then not elucidate. Another option is to simply abandon the thread entirely, or do the Rapo thing: Declare yourself the winner and THEN abandon the thread. Yet another is to engage in all the usual rhetorial tricks: changing the topic, ad hominem (calling me unpatriotic etc.), strawmanning, etc. Or, you could whine about how "unfair" I was being. If you REALLY wanted to be nasty you could ask the FBI to investigate me (again). Or, you could PM me. I was limiting myself to the options of open, honest discussion.
Well, Geezer is faced with several options- Signy
None of which you guessed- Geezer
So far, this looks like you're just pretending to have something to say.
If you have anything of substance to add, feel free...---------------------------------
It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.
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Looks like
Quote:may have been the option of choice.
abandon the thread entirely
---------------------------------
It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:Nah, so many are aware of the fact he's gone & his name was used for that purpose...but he wasn't assassinated, he died on his toilet (okay, a REALLY nice bucket).
Originally posted by SignyM:
You know ONE THING that would cause riots in the streets? Proof bin Laden was assassinated many years ago, and was simply held up as a boogeyman to frighten the American people.
The laughing Chrisisall
You... you...
You mean OSAMA WAS ELVIS?!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!
Mike
A baby seal walks into a club...
The "On Fire" Economy -
The Dow closed at 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day GW Bush took office. Eight years later, it closed below 8000 on the day he left office - a net loss of 25%. That's what conservatives call an economic "success".
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Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Okay, since YOU claim we've been assassinating people for years PROVIDE SOME EXAMPLES HERE...
Note that I said "assassinating" in quotes. Picture me making air "quotation marks" signs with my fingers when I say it. What I consider an actual assassination and what Mr. Hersch considers "assasination" probably differ quite a bit.
What Mr. Hersch would probably consider "assasinations"(imagine the air quotes here) in Vietnam were killings of known VC and NVA commanders, spies, informers, etc. by Special Forces or SOG teams or snipers. These are pretty well documented in any history of Special Operations in Vietnam.
I have no doubt that such "assassinations"(air quotes again) were carried out during various counter-insurgency operations in which the U.S. participated during the Cold War; principally in Central and South America. Killings of enemy officers, agents, and such by stealth, rather than in battle.
We're carrying out such "assassinations"(Yep. More air quotes) today in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, using Special Operations teams and Predator drones.
I suspect that Mr. Hersch's "assassination squads" are various Special Operations groups who are attacking the command and control structure of Al Qaeda and the Taliban. I don't have a problem with this, since I consider Al Qaeda and the Taliban aggressive enemies in a declared war.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
Actually, Geezer has a pretty good point here - we've been doing these kinds of "assassinations" at least since the Revolutionary War, where we were using snipers armed with Kentucky Rifles to take out British majors and generals from hiding - a practice that was NOT part of the approved warfare scenario of the day! War was supposed to be a more gentlemanly pursuit, whereby the officers would stay in the rear issuing orders, and were strictly off-limits as far as targeting went. But a bunch of rebels decided to change the rules a bit...
Mike
A baby seal walks into a club...
The "On Fire" Economy -
The Dow closed at 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day GW Bush took office. Eight years later, it closed below 8000 on the day he left office - a net loss of 25%. That's what conservatives call an economic "success".
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:Well, another option is to toss in comments like this and then not elucidate.
Well, Geezer is faced with several options- Signy
None of which you guessed- Geezer
I did elucidate, in the post prior to the one you quoted. Perhaps you should actually read it before you go off on another rant.
I have to admit I'm impressed with the way you make up things you think I might say, and then become insulted by them. You can have an argument with me, and get to feel your righteous indignation, without me even having to be involved. Are you enjoying masterdebating?
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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"And we want a ring. A ring with LASERZZZZZZ."
Or it might be THIS ring:
One Ring to rule them all,
One Ring to find them,
One Ring to bring them all
and in the darkness bind them.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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So, speaking of rage:
The US Is Facing a Weimar Moment
By Robert Freeman
In early 1919, Germany put in place a new government to begin rebuilding the country after its crushing defeat in World War I. But the right-wing forces that had led the country into the War and lost the War conspired even before it was over to destroy the new government, the "Weimar Republic." They succeeded.
The U.S. faces a similar "Weimar Moment." The devastating collapse of the economy after eight years of Republican rule has left the leadership, policies, and ideology of the right utterly discredited. But, as was the case with Germany in 1919, Republicans do not intend to allow the new government to succeed. They will do everything they can to undermine it. If they are successful, the U.S. may yet go the way of Weimar Germany.
World War I left Germany utterly devastated. The landed aristocrats, industrial magnates, wealthy financiers, weapons makers, and the officer corps of the military that formed the locus of right wing power were completely discredited. Their failure in provoking and prosecuting the War was catastrophic, undeniable, and complete.
The economy was destroyed. Prices were at 800% of pre-war levels and rising quickly. Agriculture, pillaged for the War, lay in ruins. Social insurance payments for the War's injured, to widows and orphans, and newly unemployed soldiers were astronomical. And all this was before the cost of rebuilding was even begun.
At the same time, Germany faced massive reparations payments to the Allied victors, France and England. But Germany's foreign properties had been confiscated and its colonies turned over to the victors. The combination of these conditions, both domestic and international, made it extraordinarily difficult for the German economy to recover.
As a result of the failure of the right, the German people elected a moderately leftist government to lead the nation's rebuilding. It was named the Weimar Republic for the city in which the new post-imperial constitution was written. The new government was led by Friedrich Ebert, head of the German Socialist Party.
But the country's new parliamentary system had allowed dozens of parties to run, making it impossible for any one party to win an outright majority. Ebert's party had achieved the highest portion of votes, 38%, in the first post-War elections, held in January 1919. Ebert would have to govern by coalition.
It was at this time that the right wing made its crucial decision. Despite its shocking, naked failure over the prior decade, despite the horrific devastation it had wrought on the German people, despite the discrediting of everything they had purported to stand for, they would fight Ebert, his new government, and its plans for recovery. They would do everything they could to make sure that the new government failed.
Their strategy was two-fold: first, stoke the resentment of the population about the calamitous state of its living conditions-no matter that those conditions had been created by the very right-wing oligarchs who now pretended to befriend the little guy. Rage is rage. It is glandular and unseeing. Once catalyzed it is easy to turn on any subject.
And stoking resentment was easy to do. Just before the War ended, the military concocted its most sensational lie: the German army hadn't actually been defeated. It had been "stabbed in the back" by communists, traitors, and Jews. It was an easy lie to sell. It entwined an attack on an alien political ideology - liberalism- with the latent, pervasive myth of German racial superiority.
The second strategy of the right was to prevent the new government from succeeding. To begin with, success of the left would conspicuously advertise the failure of the right. Moreover, success by the left would legitimize republican government, so hated by the oligarchs of the right. Much better for the people to be ruled by the self-aggrandizing right-wing autocracy that had governed Germany for centuries.
So the righ
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Quote:Nah... you gave a handwaving reference. (Elucidate: to make lucid or clear; throw light upon; explain, clarify
I did elucidate
) Yes, we assassinated "people" (One? Two?) in Vietnam, and we "supported tyrants" because we thought that was the better option. I read that. That doesn't exactly prove your point that it was SOP, not the exception. Seems you'd have to come up with several examples from each (or most) Presidents since Kennedy... So be specific about your examples. The worse in the past, the better Cheney looks. So have a it:Which tyrants?
Which Presidents?
Which other completed (or attempted) assassinations?
Demonstrate your case that this is nothing new.
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It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.
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Rue, yer creepin' me out...
The laughing Chrisisall
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