Ahmadinejad: 'American Empire' Nearing Its End
POSTED BY: Wulfenstar
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 4, 2026 13:29
VIEWED: 7899
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Quote:Thanks for the very informative answer Finn. You're amazing! Did all this just flow from your head?...like...without cutting and pasting? Thanks again!
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
The short answer is no. The Roman Empire followed the Roman Republic; it did not coincide with it.
The long answer is that the Roman Republic was never a Republic. It was ruled by unelected patriarchs, not elected representatives. The Roman Republic was heading in the direction of a true democratic republic until Sulla, but it never got there. So the two forms of government that distinguish the Roman Empire from the Roman Republic are probably not distinct enough to avoid categorizing the late Roman Republic as an Empire.
The Republic is probably the most misunderstood. The Romans never had a republic like what we think of today. They did not elect representatives. The Roman Republic was a patriarchal oligarchy; the word senator translates as the elder of a family, and the concept of the republic was nothing more then the continuation of the early Roman tribal leadership by clan elders or chieftains to a larger scale. These elders, or senators, were the ruling members of the elite families (read: clans), the so-called patrician families. The word Republic comes from the Latin words Res Publica, which translates as “a public thing.” Roman Publica was divided up into two large groups – the Patricians or fathers (the ruling class) and citizens or Plebeians (the working class). The idea existed – that the government was a public thing – that the public should own or control or have a say in the government. But the implementation was nothing like what we have today. Of course there were times when plebeians had greater power – the agrarian reforms, the Gracchi brothers, during which the tribunes gained considerable power – enough to move Rome towards a true democracy. But it was superficial, because it never really took power from the patricians.
The concept of Empire is easier to see. It comes from the Roman word Imperator, which means a military general. An Empire then is a nation ruled by a military general, a military dictatorship, as it were. So the idea of an Empire being expansive is simply a consequence of the Roman military dictatorship being expansive more then any real definitive quality of an Empire. There’s no reason why an Empire need be large.
The fantasy that the US represents an empire because it has troops in foreign nations is absurd. The Roman Empire was not an empire because it had troops in other nations, but rather because it replaced the native ruling party with a Roman governor, which answered only to the sitting Roman Emperor or Consul (in other words the military), as far as ultimate control of the territory was concerned. The US does not do this. Just because we have troops in other nations does not mean we replace that nation’s government with a US military dictatorship. Even in situations where we actually have replaced the native government, such as Iraq, Germany, Japan, etc, we don’t do so with a US governor, much less a military dictatorship. Furthermore the concept of an empire is one of military dictatorship; the US is not a military dictatorship. Calling the US an empire is factually incorrect and more often then not an attempt to malign the US for political reasons.
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Quote:
I know a few modern capitalist young Iranian students going to school here who can't wait to toss thier Islamic leaders out as fast as I want to toss out our evangelical leaders here.
Ummm... where is ' here' ? I don't know anywhere where there are 'evangelical leaders' who hold 1/1000th the power or sway over the population as do the Islamic nuts in Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc....
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:I live in the United States. So...that would be "here".
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Ummm... where is ' here' ?
Quote:If evangelicals reach thier goal of overturning Roe V Wade, thier "power" or "sway" over whether or not a woman can choose to abort a first trimester fetus is complete. 1/1000th of "complete" is the same as 999/1000th's of "complete". 10% of nuthin' is nuthin', carry the nuthin'.
Originally posted by AURaptor: I don't know anywhere where there are 'evangelical leaders' who hold 1/1000th the power or sway over the population as do the Islamic nuts in Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc....
Also...I merely pointed out that I, and my Iranian friends, dissapprove of religion as criteria for law makers during thier legislative process. If I was to concede that religious oppression in Iran was a greater hindrance to freedom in Iran than religious oppression in the US is to Americans, my instincts tell me that it is.
But, that reality in no way lessens my dissapproval for American evangelicals using religion in thier legislative decision making process because that legislation affects non Christians.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tankobite:
No the forces in Germany are there to make sure the Germans live with democracy.
Check a calendar, it isn't the late 1940's any more. Also, the US weren't the only ones that were there occupying Germany. There were several others. For that matter, the forces were there long after they were needed.
Point of fact, Bush has threatened to withdraw US troops on a number of occasions because Germany didn't "fall in line." Germany's answer was, go ahead.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tankobite:
You think I'm kidding, don't you? Until the end of the Franco Prussian war there was no Germany, and up until the end of WWI, all the Germanies had been monarchies. Germany had a brief experiment with democracy for about 13 years and then went to Nazism. After that democracy and representative government was force on them by treads of a tank and barrel of a rifle in 1945. East Germany finally got a taste when they unified in 1990.
Not only do I know what happened, I know the motivation of why things went the way they did. You don't. How do I know that? Because, what you've posted clearly indicates a complete ignorance of that knowledge. Read a book. It'll do you some good.
EDIT TO ADD: History is more than just dates.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tankobite:
What's with you all anyway? Just because a person's political beliefs don't fall lock step with your own doesn't give you the right to be a horse's ass, no matter how much "They do it first".
Hypocrite.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tankobite:
Also, in the spirit of this thread: bugger off Sigma; if I didn't know for a fact that arguing on the internet is a waste of time I'd bother with that load of tripe you just posted.
Pax.
What do you mean? Like you just did?
----
I am on The Original List (twice). We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
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Quote:Actually it did. I’m pretty sure it’s all correct, but feel free to point out anything that’s wrong, because I kind of wrote it on the fly. I was going to discuss how the Gracchi brothers tried to bring democracy to Rome, and how Sulla’s reign of terror ended the reforms and started Rome on its track towards empire, but I can’t remember the details off the top of my head. It is however a very interesting bit of history, if you have time to look it up. It's sort of what-if story: what if democracy had come to Rome? This might have begun cultural enlightenment centuries earlier.
Originally posted by MalBadInLatin:
Thanks for the very informative answer Finn. You're amazing! Did all this just flow from your head?...like...without cutting and pasting? Thanks again!
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Finn, if you know this stuff that well, then why are you so blind to it's parallels on our own soil ?!
And that's not an ounce snarky, I seriously wanna know.
-F
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If you really want to understand the financial meltdown and the $100-Trillion scamout this week, read this free book online, or just the chapter on "Ten letters of an international banker to his son", by bankster Speerpoint Moregain, at Ru de Bankruptcy (street) in Paris, during his control of $100-billion in USA during the Great Depression. Apparently Moregain's son was unable to ampute his conscience, as his elitist father wanted him to do, and leaked the letters. This is like hacking Warren Buffet and Ben Bernake's email.
FREE EBOOK: Syndrome of Control, by Pastor Lindsey Williams, page 105 to 182
http://dzone.ca/eBooks/syndrome_of_control.pdf?PHPSESSID=3d2d6fe0f5e05
b4d6fc02af74485080d
www.scribd.com/doc/3911651/Lindsey-Williams-Syndrome-of-Control
Moregain's greatest fear was the "sheeple" discovering that the Federal Reserve Bank was private, and the "idiots" in Congress nationalizing the printing of money at zero interest to the banksters.
This week, that's the only thing that can save USA - and the world.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Actually the Romans and Brits seized territory. That territory was then ruled by Romans and Brits.
Mexican/American War?
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tankobite:
No the forces in Germany are there to make sure the Germans live with democracy.
No, the NATO forces in Germany, which American forces are a part of, were there to assist rebuilding efforts, and later to effect the first line of defence if the Cold War ever turned hot.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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Quote:
Originally posted by MalBadInLatin:
If evangelicals reach thier goal of overturning Roe V Wade, thier "power" or "sway" over whether or not a woman can choose to abort a first trimester fetus is complete. 1/1000th of "complete" is the same as 999/1000th's of "complete". 10% of nuthin' is nuthin', carry the nuthin'.
Also...I merely pointed out that I, and my Iranian friends, dissapprove of religion as criteria for law makers during thier legislative process. If I was to concede that religious oppression in Iran was a greater hindrance to freedom in Iran than religious oppression in the US is to Americans, my instincts tell me that it is.
But, that reality in no way lessens my dissapproval for American evangelicals using religion in thier legislative decision making process because that legislation affects non Christians.
One need not be an evangelical, or even religious in any way to see that abortion past the 1st Trimester is potentially a major problem, constitutinally speaking. The very legitimate issue arises as to when an unborn becomes a recognized 'individual' , a human whose rights are to be protected, the same as the mother's.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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