Doctor Who - The Moffat Strikes Back.

POSTED BY: MrBlueSun
UPDATED: Thursday, September 25, 2008 08:44
VIEWED: 5024
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DEEPGIRL187

Saturday, August 16, 2008 11:34 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by reginaroadie:
People really don't give Russell T. Davis enough credit. He knew to break up the action and scariness and drama with some much needed cheeky British humor. Also, "Midnight" the ep that was after Moffat's 2 parter, was just as and maybe even more scary than "Blink". So he was a competent show runner and not the George Lucas of the DOCTOR WHO series that some people say he is.

So is anyone nervous of Moffat turning one of the most funny and adventurous sci-fi series on the air into an incredibly serious, not humorous stare into the abyss like BSG and LOST can be at times?

Midnight, in my opinion, is one of the best episodes of the entire series (and I'm inclined to say the best). And while I'm still a little pissed about the season finale, I agree that people are too quick to write RTD off. If you've spent anytime on some of the DW boards, I'm sure you're more than familiar with the RTD bashing that tends to go on there.

I'm not that afraid of Moffat turning DW into BSG, or heaven forbid, Lost. Even in episodes like Blink or The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances, there's humor (though it can be more of the gallows variety). I think that Moffat knows if he pushed DW more towards the dark and grim side of things, it would lose a lot of what makes it Doctor Who. So, no worries, IMO. We're in good hands.

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"This is my timey-wimey detector. It goes ding when there's stuff. Also, it can boil an egg at 30 paces, whether you want it to or not, actually, so I've learned to stay away from hens. It's not pretty when they blow."

IMNOTHERE

Saturday, August 16, 2008 7:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by reginaroadie:
So is anyone nervous of Moffat turning one of the most funny and adventurous sci-fi series on the air into an incredibly serious, not humorous stare into the abyss like BSG and LOST can be at times?

I don't think there's anything wrong with Moffat's sense of humour - its just rather more subtle and ironic with fewer set-piece jokes, double-entendres and fart gags than RTD's high camp style (not that there isn't room for some fart gags in this world).

Please run a level 1 diagnostic on your humour receptors and re-watch "Blink", "The Girl in the fireplace" or "The Empty Child". Firstly, I'd argue that the premises of "Blink" or TGITF are inherently humorous. Actually, I thought TGITF had a distinctly Douglas Adams-y feel to it.

Blink gave us the ultimate antidote to Technobabble: "It goes bing when there's stuff". In TGITF, Micky looks out at interstellar space and proclaims "It's so realistic..." In "Empty Child" we have the whole sonic implement envy routine between the Doctor and Jack and a "Sonic Blaster" with an "undo" button...

Actually, I'd say that Moffat's humour was more in line with Firefly/Buffy than with RTD's (Jeckell and, for those with long memories, Press Gang, showed a similar style).

Quote:
Also, "Midnight" the ep that was after Moffat's 2 parter, was just as and maybe even more scary than "Blink".

You worry about Who becoming an "incredibly serious, not humorous stare into the abyss" and then pick "Midnight" (excellent, but pretty much a serious, non-humorous stare into the abyss) as the best ep ever? Interesting...

P.s. In defense of RTD: RTD, as executive producer, has done a magnificent job of regenerating Who by striking a difficult balance between updating the show for a modern audience and respecting the old show. Most of his critics, given the job, would probably have produced a pile of convoluted fanwank endlessly referencing classic Who and the post-cancellation books which would have attracted an audience of literally dozens. His "sin" is that the episodes he's written personally tend to look a bit weak alongside ones by other writers. OTOH that means that RTD has found and hired excellent writers, and allowed to do their job.

When Moffat takes over he is not, presumably, going to write all the episodes personally. Maybe he'll even hire RTD to write the annual Xmas pantomime episode (or maybe, freed from the bonds of executive producer-ing, RTD could come out with a few more crackers like "Midnight"?)

SIMONWHO

Saturday, August 16, 2008 10:43 PM

Moffat's episodes have had a lot of humour in them and don't forget he wrote Coupling (the original UK version, not the US abomination) so it's not like he's not a comic genius in his own right.

There's no way he can match RTD's success in how popular he has made the show - the combination of an old favourite that appeals to new audiences, two wonderful lead actors and widespread media interest was a perfect storm that simply can't be repeated. But I just hope he makes the very best Doctor Who that he can. He turned down making movies with Spielberg for this job so he's going to make the most of it I'm sure.

REGINAROADIE

Sunday, August 17, 2008 1:09 AM

And the cool thing about that was that Spielberg himself is a fan of DOCTOR WHO and totally understood why he turned the offer down. He probably even had his blessing.

As for me mentioning "Midnight", I brought that up because there seems to be this perception that DOCTOR WHO was a great show despite RTD and not because of him. That Moffat was the true creative genius while RTD was the meddling fool. But I would stack "Midnight", "Turn Left" and any of the two part finales from any season that he wrote, even the season 3 one, against any of Moffat's episodes in terms of scariness, suspense, tension, character and drama.

Or course, there were so many other writers who contributed incredible episodes. Like Robert Shearman, whose one episode in season one "Dalek" turned what was a punchline in sci-fi into the stuff of nightmares. And Paul Cornell, whose "Father's Day" episode was one of the most powerful DOCTOR WHO stories I've seen in the series. So I don't think it's just one person whose solely responsible for the shows greatness. Even Joss couldn't do it would David Fury, Doug Petrie, Marti Noxon, Jane Espenson, David Greenwalt, Tim Minear and Drew Goddard in the writer's room.

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"And it starts with a sentence that might last a lifetime, or it all might just go down in flames. If I let you know me, then why would you want me? Each day I don't is a shame. Each day I don't is a great shame."

Loudon Wainwright III - "Strange Weirdos" off the "Knocked Up" soundtrack

IMNOTHERE

Sunday, August 17, 2008 11:08 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by reginaroadie:
I brought that up because there seems to be this perception that DOCTOR WHO was a great show despite RTD and not because of him.

Yes, well, some people are just wrong... RTD as executive producer deserves heaps of credit for the success of the series. Its just that some of the writers he hired wrote better episodes than him...

I think the strength of Moffat/Cornell etc. is that they seamlessly blend scary monsters (statues, skeletons in spacesuits) for kids of all ages with more psychological horror (people displaced in time, kids surviving in the blitz, the "digital ghosts", Donna's imaginary happy family). RTD has shown he can do monsters (OMG! Daleks vs. Cybermen!!!) or Psychological (Midnight, Turn Left) but it tends to be clearly signposted as one or the other.

...plus, he relies on Deus ex Machina - or worse, Doctor ex Machina and plot reset buttons a bit too much.

TRAVELER

Sunday, August 24, 2008 11:28 PM

I would like to see The Master.

http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=28764731
Traveler

FIREFLY151

Thursday, September 25, 2008 8:44 AM

Um... I'll just get back to main topic for a moment

I disagree with bringing back the Valeyard. Many people have mentioned that idea for a long time, but... it just seems so long ago. It was an idea unexplored and new viewers of Doctor Who won't know who the Valeyard is. He wasn't anything particularly astounding. But the idea of this evil personality could be explored... just in audio or novel form.

Rassilon...definitely. He was decreed immortal, which means he may have survived the Time War, possibly. That would also include Borusa and those other immortal Time Lords. Becasue Rassilon was so powerful, he's like ly to have survived. On the other hand, he may have even played a part in the Time War... But it would be great for a Time Lord to return, and we wouldn't know what to expect with Rassilon. He probably wouldn't even be evil.

It's important to remember that Moffat said he wouldn't bring back original Who foes unless there was a really, really good story. I like this.
The problem is that returning Who foes haven't necessarily been done justice. Yes, the daleks were excellent. The autons/nestene conciousness were good. The cybermen were great too (except for their introsuctory 2 parter and their feet!). But then there's the sontarans. I couldn't believe what they did to them. It was disgraceful. They were made out to be a joke, constantly humiliated, most likely making newer Who viewers see them as funny things, not warriors. The purple lighting, the height/racist jokes... The sontarans were given a poor image. And I don't want that happening to other classic Who enemies.

I would like to see the ice warriors return, as the Peladon serials just weren't ice warriorish enough. And they were creepy, and Moffat could do a good job. As for the zygons, fans seem to have predicted their return, but I doubt it. They already failed to return and ended up in Sting of the Zygons (Book). But yes, zygons (loch nesses), silurians, sea devils, there's a lot... I just hope none are brought back solely for the sake of it. I mean, the sontarans could easily have been something else. And their ships weren't the awesome, classic spheres either. So I hope that returning monsters have more of the classic features too, not just new everything.

And is there even one famous new Doctor Who creature???????? There's the oh so popular daleks and cybermen, but what about NuWho? SLitheen? No. Vashta nerada? No. Adipose? No. Ood? No. But Moffat... I think he's capable of creating the iconic or at least very popular enemies Doctor Who should have. Besides, Doctor Who was known for having great monsters back before I was born. And now? It's simply bringing back the old ones and be lazy with the new...

As for Moffat being un-funny... Well, he has said it will be a darker season in 2010, but I think it would be fine to have dark humour too. Anyway, Moffat will still only be writing some of the epidoes in a season, not all of them, so there's not so much for comedy-loving fans to worry about anyway. And I can't wait for dark Doctor Who, its about time.

Finally, you might have noticed that the aliens species all started with lower case letters. That's becasue I disagree with Daleks or Silurians. It should be daleks and silurians. It's not like silurian is a title. It's a species name. Just like human or polar bear. I mean, it's not Humans. It's humans. So why would aliens have capital letters?... I think it's just a habit that just kept going until it became Doctor Who canonical.

I'm grinning in case I seem unhappy, or agumemntative, or grouchy, or bossy... which I'm not

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Keep Writing, Keep Flying

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