FTL or not FTL...
POSTED BY: BadgersHat
UPDATED: Friday, May 14, 2004 20:35
VIEWED: 17361
PAGE 6 of 9
Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
The kind of velocities a vehicle would experience on reentry would be plenty large enough that “holding on” to something would be pointless during a maneuver in which the vehicle was completely turned about.
Agreed
Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
In fact, I doubt any current construction could even withstand those kinds of forces. The vehicle would likely be torn to pieces and burn up, certainly no one would survive, even if it didn't. They would be greasy stains on the wall.
Do you mean the crazy Ivan on re-entry? If so, agreed.
But, they didn't do the crazy Ivan on re-entry. They did it while taking off and only did the full burn after they did that maneuver.
----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
.... isn't that exactly what I said?
What I caught is that you stated that we must have a crazy acceleration to get to relativistic speeds and that that acceleration can't be curved in some way.
Although it is true that we must have that acceleration (to get to any relativistic speeds within a "small" amount of time) there is no absolute that we must "feel" that acceleration (ie inertial dampeners). I reference my prior conjecture that states the possibility of Serenity's grav drive to reduce the effects of acceleration on the crew.
I think we were both too terse. My wife tells me I do that a lot
----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Ah...a fellow "Joss is an ex-Traveller player" theorist :)
Joss has done enough D&D references over the years that I really DO wonder about Traveller. Makes me feel confident about using Traveller rules for my Firefly game.
I'm not sure if it being Traveller-inspired really decides the FTL issue one way or the other, though - Joss could have just dropped Jump drive (set the show in TL what - 8 or so?). Traveller is full of nice 1-6 G acceleration, which would match fairly well with interplanetary travel times in Firefly.
Someone's got to ask Joss about Traveller somehow someday...let me know if you ever hear anything!
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I'd either agree or disagree with you and your wife, if I knew what the word "terse" means...
I thought you were talking about my response to someone's note about 90c, thinking that I thought it meant 0.9c, or that I was confused (which happens a lot, my hat's too tight)... I think I kinda lost my train of thought (happens, too--see note about tightness of hat)...
Um... so, what we're saying is, they might be able to go really really super duper fast, but not get squashed to little itty bitty smudges of jeely-like protoplasm, due to an inertial damping doohickey?
I see that as possible... but, I'm not sure where you stand in the "They Have" or "They Have Not" FTL issue... umm... do you say yes or no?
If yes, then I think we're more or less on the same page, and are probably arguing each other's point without realizing (that happens, too, but not because of the hat tightness, mainly because my fingers type faster than the brain thinks).
If no, then I'm REALLY confuzzled, because I lost my point somewhere...
Either way, if sublight, we're talking mucho years to the next place...
... ummm...
.... 
....
... if anyone happens to see a medium-sized mind, only slightly used, wearing a bowler hat and singing 80s songs, please forward it to me...
... oh waiter, clue please...
--Jefé The Hat
***************************
"I like smackin 'em"--Jayn
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
I'd either agree or disagree with you and your wife, if I knew what the word "terse" means...
Brief and to the point; effectively concise
So, "too terse" would cloud what you are trying to say as you weren't stating all the necessary data for others to understand. I do it all the time, again according to the wife
I think I make perfect sense 
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
Um... so, what we're saying is, they might be able to go really really super duper fast, but not get squashed to little itty bitty smudges of jeely-like protoplasm, due to an inertial damping doohickey?
Basically, yes.
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
I see that as possible... but, I'm not sure where you stand in the "They Have" or "They Have Not" FTL issue... umm... do you say yes or no?
I haven't really seen a whole lot of evidence for either type of drive. But, since I have seen a some evidence for the one system theory and I tend in that direction, I'd be inclined to move toward the no FTL drive.
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
If yes, then I think we're more or less on the same page, and are probably arguing each other's point without realizing (that happens, too, but not because of the hat tightness, mainly because my fingers type faster than the brain thinks).
I had a friend a while back that would argue a point and then we would end up arguing the same point which would really piss me off. Not because we were arguing the same point. But, because he knew we were and continued to argue anyway. It was quite irritating.
For the record I'm not saying you are doing what he did. Just a story is all.
And my finger type to fast as well. Makes for some interesting first drafts of posts sometimes
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
Either way, if sublight, we're talking mucho years to the next place...
Only if that next place is another star system. Which as said by many people, we can only speculate until we get more info.
----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Prof.: These are the dark matter engines I invented. They allow my starship to travel between galaxies in mere hours.
Cubert: That's impossible! You can't go faster than the speed of light.
Prof.: Of course not! That's why scientists increased the speed of light in 2208!
just gotta say, that rocks! hahahaah
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
... ow....
... my head hurts...
--Jefé The Hat
***************************
"I like smackin 'em"--Jayne
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by BadgersHat:
Even if AC DOES have planets, and planets exactly like earth
The planets in Firefly aren't(well wheren't originally) necessarily like Earth at all, they where Teraformed as is stated in the show a couple of times. Seeing as we're given no information on the Teraforming tech (just as we're given no info on any of the other tech), who's to say what the planets where like.
----------
I have no faith but it's all that I want
to be loved and believe
in my soul.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Ok... I really didn't want to participate in this, but I...can't stop....typing...
Let's see...if the reference to 70 earths is accurate, then there is no possible way that we're dealing with one system.
The Life Zone in any given solar system (capable of supporting water in liquid form) is very narrow. It would be physically impossible to support more than a few planets in this area of space, much less 70.
OK...if we're dealing with multiple systems, how do we go from planet to planet?
Remember, it took man over 2000 years to come up with powered flight (counting BC years), but after that it only took 53 years to go from Kitty Hawk to hitting golf balls on the moon.
With the technology we have now, the gravity dampeners on the show are impossible. The fusion reactor they have is impossible. The ability to keep someone in revivable cryogenic stasis for long periods is impossible. (Let's not even discuss the idea of Jayne ever being mistaken for a heroic figure...that's just too silly for words...still, it happened.)
That's why I think they must have FTL. Of course, they may have something that allows them to warp the curvature of space so that they can travel from point to point faster than light can. (Draw a dot at either end of a piece of paper. Draw a straight line from dot to dot. That's the shortest distance between the two points as we understand our universe. Now, fold the paper in half. The dots are closer. Now if you draw a straight line between the two of them, you would be able to do so significantly faster without speeding up.) On the show they can create gravity, so warping space should be possible...
The only other argument I could use is that it's fiction and anything is possible in fiction.
How is it that we're still talking about this?
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I've held my tongue long enough. Of course they have FTL. They have control of gravity (i.e. gravity drives).
FTL is considered impossible because as a mass (the ship) moves closer to the speed of light, the energy required becomes an impossible amount for the ship to sustain. However, this rule can be broken if the ship's mass is reduced to zero. Given their control of gravity (including terraforming small moons), it is a small step to say that they are able to cancel out the ship's mass with the gravity drive. Hence, very little power is required for them to travel faster than light.
It always amazes me how sci-fi fans continue to dismiss something we are not capable of doing today, despite the fact that sci-fi stories usually occur in a future where technology is beyond what we have today.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME