Haken speaks

POSTED BY: SigmaNunki
UPDATED: Sunday, July 27, 2008 23:01
VIEWED: 6539
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FOLLOWMAL

Friday, July 25, 2008 4:31 AM

*waves to Chindi!*

Nice to see you!!! *hugs*

Haken, you already got my thanks type written over on Shiny Universe.

Now, I'll go put some money in that PayPal thingy over there and put my money where my typing is.

Thank you as always for making this wonderful place and for maintaining it and giving us still yet a home.

Like Chindi, this is my fave site, always will be home to me and I appreciate it so very much.

To answer your question about the official sites...
the Uni site as you know went down and Gossi made serenitymovie.org.
The OB ( the original board ) is still there and going strong ( it amazes me that Fox keeps it up! )although the talk about FF/S is intermittent just like it is here and the off topic threads, particularly poli threads get more posts.

http://community.kidsneedtoread.org/

http://www.iamasoftwire.com/

http://www.drhorrible.com/

CHRISISALL

Friday, July 25, 2008 4:38 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Haken:
I think a little nonsense is forgivable every now and then, right?

I SO totally agree; we heart our beloved Haken for this place- don't let any say any different!!
Firefly/Serenity is our great passion, the base of our entertainment existence...WE thank you, dude.

Oh crap- the cat s**t on the carpet...! Real life intrudes

Laterisall

BTW, I'm serious with the thank you thing...

CHRISISALL

Friday, July 25, 2008 4:40 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SergeantX:
Frankly, I'm appalled that Sigma's needs are not being met.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAisall

HAKEN

Friday, July 25, 2008 5:00 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
Take that how you want, but those are the facts. Criticising him for facts is hardly out of line. In fact, it's part of the normal process of improving things. Again, I reference his first post on this thread in which he explicitly states that he won't, for whatever reason, improve things himself and worse yet, has refused all offers of help.

This isn't exactly respectful to the sites users. Especially since accepting help would have prevented or minimized all problems seen over the years.

I have no doubt that if this was an OSS software project, it would have been forked a long time ago. Because, that's what happens with "management" such as this. Unfortunately, domains can't be and there are probably copyright issues with some of the content here. So, sadly, it isn't going to happen even though this site desperately needs a rewrite.

I don't mind the criticism, so you are welcome to post your opinion.

I had responded to the wrong person in my previous post, please read that response because it partially addresses what you're saying.

As I have stated, this site was written in MS ASP. No one builds websites in classic ASP anymore. There are way better ways to build a fansite these days. A framework like Ruby on Rails is way more elegant.

I'm an uberfan like everyone else on here, but I'm not sure if this site warrants the effort of a rewrite. It's been 5 years since Firefly was canceled. Wouldn't all that human resource used for a rewrite be better spent elsewhere? Perhaps build a Dollhouse website or a website for some other cool TV series that might be around for a few seasons. Caprica and Fringe comes to mind.

Also FFF.NET isn't an OSS project. I don't know of any fansites that are. I have heard of fansites being built with OSS tools and frameworks. DotNetNuke and Joomla are commonplace nowadays. I've been seeing Flex too. Imagine a Dollhouse fansite built with Flex. That'll be a worthwhile project.

Anyway, my feelings are I see no point in continuing development of FFF.NET in a dead language and I see no point in rebuilding FFF.NET in a new framework for a long canceled series.

Now, if everyone is willing to build another fansite in RoR, we can certainly OSS that.

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Friday, July 25, 2008 5:35 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Haken:
Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
Take that how you want, but those are the facts. Criticising him for facts is hardly out of line. In fact, it's part of the normal process of improving things. Again, I reference his first post on this thread in which he explicitly states that he won't, for whatever reason, improve things himself and worse yet, has refused all offers of help.

This isn't exactly respectful to the sites users. Especially since accepting help would have prevented or minimized all problems seen over the years.

I have no doubt that if this was an OSS software project, it would have been forked a long time ago. Because, that's what happens with "management" such as this. Unfortunately, domains can't be and there are probably copyright issues with some of the content here. So, sadly, it isn't going to happen even though this site desperately needs a rewrite.

I don't mind the criticism, so you are welcome to post your opinion.

I had responded to the wrong person in my previous post, please read that response because it partially addresses what you're saying.

As I have stated, this site was written in MS ASP. No one builds websites in classic ASP anymore. There are way better ways to build a fansite these days. A framework like Ruby on Rails is way more elegant.

I'm an uberfan like everyone else on here, but I'm not sure if this site warrants the effort of a rewrite. It's been 5 years since Firefly was canceled. Wouldn't all that human resource used for a rewrite be better spent elsewhere? Perhaps build a Dollhouse website or a website for some other cool TV series that might be around for a few seasons. Caprica and Fringe comes to mind.

Also FFF.NET isn't an OSS project. I don't know of any fansites that are. I have heard of fansites being built with OSS tools and frameworks. DotNetNuke and Joomla are commonplace nowadays. I've been seeing Flex too. Imagine a Dollhouse fansite built with Flex. That'll be a worthwhile project.

Anyway, my feelings are I see no point in continuing development of FFF.NET in a dead language and I see no point in rebuilding FFF.NET in a new framework for a long canceled series.

Now, if everyone is willing to build another fansite in RoR, we can certainly OSS that.

Haken, let me add thanks for all that you do here.
It is generous of you to accept criticism even when it is fairly rude.
I was under the impression that this site was created around Feb of 2002, so that would make it 6.5 years old. Most of us are not accessing this site with computers that old.
I understand what Sygma is saying about your "not accepting help" and your "refusal" to upgrade or do things Sygma's way. However, I do not agree with him in the way he likely intends, and I think I know why you do not respond directly to those comments.

If Sigma has his way, there would be apparently many "Haken Helpers" sticking their grubby little paws into the workings that Haken took the time to create, tune, craft, and review. This means that every "helper" that didn't understand the nuances of the code (trust me, there are many who think they know what they are doing, but are actually clueless) and screwed up what Haken had so carefully and adroitly resolved previously, would be taking down the site until Haken had time to review what they had done, and conjure how to fix it, or undo the "help". This would create more downtime, more other problems, and longer repairs (trust me, it takes vastly more time - think multiples - to repair or undo what somebody else has done than to fix a previously working model that suddenly has a non-worky element; technical problems are much easier to troubleshoot than human problems.) Admin by committee is not the best template for net forums that I have seen. It would mean a lot more work for Haken, and a lot more repairs. I also appreciate that Haken does not constantly change or "upgrade" every couple months like so many other web admins love to do, in or

CHRISISALL

Friday, July 25, 2008 5:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Haken:

Anyway, my feelings are I see no point in continuing development of FFF.NET in a dead language

Latin might work...
Okay, maybe I'm not funny here. But thanks for what you've given us to this point. Sincerely thanks, whatever happens.

Hawaii-lovin' Chrisisall

CHAPTERANDVERSE

Friday, July 25, 2008 8:36 PM

Haken,
Thank you for this wonderful site. It may have picked up more passengers than you ever expected but its been love at first site for most of us!
Chapter.

WYTCHCROFT

Friday, July 25, 2008 9:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by FollowMal*:

To answer your question about the official sites...
the Uni site as you know went down and Gossi made serenitymovie.org.

I am risking my neck to put words in Gossi's mouth here but - don't G feel the same as Haken???
The effort has been going into Dollverse/Dr Horrible... serenitymovie is just ticking over... it seems. I know Gossi has said nix to the idea of any more firefly/serenity actually happening... but i'm too nervous to ask!

Quote:
The OB ( the original board ) is still there and going strong ( it amazes me that Fox keeps it up! )

y'mean Prospero - my lurkers paradise??

Quote:
although the talk about FF/S is intermittent just like it is here

ah, but when it's ON here - there's no place like it right? There's more indepth discussion, analysis and speculation here than anywhere (IMHO?). you just have dig into the archives when it's a slow patch.

Quote:
and the off topic threads, particularly poll threads get more posts.

there is the HD site - as you know
http://boards.nbcuni.com/universalHD/

it's real basic - and i think the administrator may be in the deep freeze (darkstar style) or have regenerated in Cordrone, but it's there.

And the unofficial + browncoat forums are pretty busy.

it is true that we seem to have lost some of the regular in-depth posters here - but that may be ebb and flow - most are lurking or busy elsewhere (podcasts etc) but they are still fans.

Quote:
Haken: but I'm not sure if this site warrants the effort of a rewrite. It's been 5 years since Firefly was canceled. Wouldn't all that human resource used for a rewrite be better spent elsewhere? Perhaps build a Dollhouse website or a website for some other cool TV series...

there aint one as cool - that's the problem!
but i guess there are shows more popular...
(and hell, i LIKE BSG but...)

and despite the drag factor - the number of youngsters winging around FF sites right now is interesting since they could be seen as future audience - and could be cultivated - (no no put the shears down! i know, i know but we can be nice...). Darkhorse perhaps is part of the reason for that.

Quote:
Haken: Anyway, my feelings are I see no point in continuing development of FFF.NET in a dead language and I see no point in rebuilding FFF.NET in a new framework for a long canceled series.

man, you've been at this so long i don't hardly blame ya - but it makes me feel very sad, really very sad.

*FollowMal - i know you know all this - by which i mean 'i am not worthy!':)- i just had to let my mouth run (as ever).

MSB

Friday, July 25, 2008 9:07 PM

HUGS Haken... and thanks again for making this site:)

____________________________________________

Love doesn't make the world go 'round; love is what makes the ride worthwhile.

STEAMER

Saturday, July 26, 2008 12:48 AM

Haken, I can see why you feel the way you do about the site and the series that inspired it. Point of interest? I've yet to see anyone bellyache quite so harshly about Myspace when they get some of those 'Sorry! an unexpected error has occurred' pages. (Which, I've noticed, seems to happen a lot more often than kooky FFF.) It's the Internet and therefore it's computers, something's bound to go crazy and fall asleep at some point - hell, I got booted off my network just as I was typing this.

However, I'd like to ask you respectfully to consider that the site still gets a great deal of traffic every day. Even though the series has been over for quite a while, the fandom by no means died with it. I've seen an influx of introductory threads and blog entries just in the past few months - new fans are still joining the ranks and signing up on a site that seems to have established itself as THE Firefly fansite, a fine and fun community for fans and friends. Sometimes it's mind-boggling what you do to keep it going for everyone as it is, but IMHO, the amount of activity around here, and the effect it has on the site, is hard to overlook. Because I don't think many users are much of the mind to take flight and find a new place to commune.

It's your site, and far be it from me to tell you how to run it. As I see it though, there's a great deal of life left in the site. I hope you'll keep this in mind as you're plotting the course.

Simon's got
To get a grip
River's turned
Into a ship
FIREFLY

Captain of the New England Browncoats
http://www.myspace.com/nebrowncoats

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