If you like Bush & what he's done to this world, you are evil.
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 2, 2008 19:38
VIEWED: 30693
PAGE 12 of 32
The "ranch" thing really isn't an issue to any Texan. Everybody down here who has two acres and a double-wide refers to it as their "ranch". Makes 'em sound bigger and better than they really are, puffs 'em up, and embraces that old stereotype about Texans all living on ranches, herding cattle, and hanging rustlers.
Call it a colloquialism, a regional thing. My granddad in Nebraska had some 12,000 acres which he farmed (he didn't "ranch" it, he farmed it); he raised cattle, chickens, alfalfa, corn, and wheat (and hemp during WWII, because his country needed it), and he did so for 60 years, but he never once referred to his land as a "ranch" or to himself as a "rancher" because he thought that would sound arrogant. He was a farmer all his life, and he died on his farm, in his farm house.
If he were in Texas, he'd have been a rancher.
Mike
"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions
I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock
The Myrmidons were an ancient nation of very brave and skilled warriors as described in Homer's Iliad, and were commanded by Achilles. - Wikipedia
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Mike, all these quotes you claim are " misleading " are nothing more than OPINION !! These aren't FACTS. If the President is told by his CIA director that the case against Saddam and WMD is a " slam dunk ", wtf is the President suppose to do ? Tell the American public that his top intelligence man said one thing, but I'm just not too certain there's anything to worry about here. Even though every single Democrat leader has been saying Saddam has WMD and we must not allow him to use them again, , even though there were 17 U.N. Resolutions against Iraq , even though there were agreements from the 1st Gulf War which were broken, even though there were missing WMD materials - catalogued by the UNITED NATIONS THEMSELVES, even though all this was going on and a HELL of a lot more that's not even been reported,..... you STILL want to take the position that.....meh, there's nothing to all these things. Maybe we should roll over and go back to sleep? ( Like we did for the previous 8 yrs ??? ) Sorry, but the one legitimate thing Bush has done in his terms in office is to protect the United States, its interest and the interest of many other countries.
Them's the facts, whether you want to accept them or not.
Actually, them's ain't the facts - those are just mere opinions!
YOU say that "everybody knew" that Saddam had WMD, and that the intel agencies of every nation knew it. Again, nothing but opinion. Not even our own intelligence agencies had any real, solid evidence that Saddam had any WMD, nor did they "know" he had them - it was the OPINION of SOME within those industries that he PROBABLY had them. At best, they ESTIMATED that he might have them.
So you have yet to offer one single FACT that he ever had them.
You say Bush's statements weren't misleading, but that it's the OPINION of the United States House of Representatives that they're misleading (or lies, in simpler terms). Okay, I say the only thing Bush ever offered for justification for the war was his OPINIONS - or worse, the opinions of others - with no factual, solid evidence to back them up, only more "opinions". You're saying that because he simply repeated what he was told, without ever trying to verify it with any other sources, that he wasn't "lying".
I've gotta ask - which comforts you less? The idea that your President is a liar, or the idea that he's nothing but a talking head, a puppet for liars?
You've stated that if Bush was told something that was wrong, and he repeated it without checking it out for himself, then HE wasn't lying. Okay, I'll play. Let's say that I'm told the world is flat. I don't have the resources to go to orbit to see for myself, or to sail around it to see if I end up where I started. From my perspective as I stand on a piece of seemingly flat ground, that statement makes sense, and I repeat it to any and all who will listen.
Does that make me a liar?
Your options for Bush are pretty narrow: Either he's a liar, or he's a fool who listens only to opinions that reinforce what he already thinks. Neither makes for a very good leader...
Mike
"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions
I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock
The Myrmidons were an ancient nation of very brave and skilled warriors as described in Homer's Iliad, and were commanded by Achilles. - Wikipedia
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
According to AwwCrapper's logic, none of these statements are facts. The fact that they were made by Bush is true, but the statements themselves are nothing more than opinions, which were proven wrong.
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa."
Source: President Delivers "State of the Union", White House (1/28/2003).
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"He said he wouldn't have chemical weapons, he's got them."
Source: Remarks by the President at Arkansas Welcome, White House (11/4/2002).
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment needed for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons."
Source: President Bush Outlines Iraqi Threat; Remarks by the President on Iraq, White House (10/7/2002).
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"If the Iraq regime is able to produce, buy, or steal an amount of highly enriched uranium a little larger than a single softball, it could have a nuclear weapon in less than one year."
Source: President Bush Outlines Iraqi Threat; Remarks by the President on Iraq, White House (10/7/2002).
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"Knowing these realities, America must not ignore the threat gathering against us. Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof - the smoking gun - that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud."
Source: President Bush Outlines Iraqi Threat; Remarks by the President on Iraq, White House (10/7/2002).
Public Statement of President George W. Bush:
"In defiance of the United Nations, Iraq has stockpiled biological and chemical weapons, and is rebuilding the facilities used to make more of those weapons."
Source: President: Iraqi Regime Danger to America is "Grave and Growing", White House (10/5/2002).
Remember, Kiddies, any statement of fact that you don't agree with can be dismissed with a wave of your hand as "only an OPINION".
Mike
"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions
I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock
The Myrmidons were an ancient nation of very brave and skilled warriors as described in Homer's Iliad, and were commanded by Achilles. - Wikipedia
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
He do? Then why he keep going back to Congress demanding (not requesting, but DEMANDING, as if they owe him) more money to throw into that hellhole that he created in Iraq? And why does he keep referring to it as "emergency" spending? We've been in this ridiculous war for over 5 years now - do you still think sudden emergencies are cropping up every 3-4 months that require another $80-120 billion?
That money is allocated to the Military no matter how the Newscasters try to portray it.
Quote:
How's that workin' out for ya? Let's see, we have the Palestinians electing Hamas to represent them - in elections which weren't disputed as being faked or rigged - and in response to that "democracy" the US has simply refused to acknowledge or speak to Hamas representatives.
We have a puppet regime which we installed in Iraq, and every time they try to flex a little muscle and show some free will, we shut them down and shut them up, and continue to ram our own policies down their "democracy".
Firstly, the Palestinian State is an entirely different problem with shades of connectivity to Iraq. Secondly, can you please provide some instances where we shut down Iraqi policies? Thirdly, I think the process of incorporating the plans laid out by the Commander in Chief has been flawed and in hindsight 20/20 perhaps we should have taken the Iraqi Government over completely like we did in Japan and in Germany and only relinquish control over a certain sector of the Government after it had been fully trained and demonstrated that it could manage its job. Perhaps then the Iraqis would have that Medicine and dependable electricity they so need.
Quote:
But apparently it gives you a pass on even being a DECENT person. Once you slap on that "Christian" label (and a cute little flag lapel button), you feel like you can do anything you want, because you're "forgiven". Calling yourself a Christian might not mean that you are a perfect person, but it SHOULD mean that you're damn well TRYING to be a BETTER person!
What you call yourself or what lapel button you where matters not to God and it is up to him on your judgement day. It is not for me to Judge him as it is not for me to judge you.
Quote:
Ah, but we seldom hear that during the upturn, do we? What we get are these horseshit predictions about how, if things continue at this pace, we'll have nickels piled to the moon in three weeks, and other such gibberish. What DOESN'T get pointed out is that things DON'T continue at this pace, because they can't, because it's a cyclical thing. Now, if you scroll around the archives, you'll find posts about how "the economy's on fire!" and "despite doom-n-gloomers, economy continues to roll" - where the Bush supporters didn't care to point out that (a) the President has very little real impact on the economy, but gets most of the blame when it goes to shit because "the buck stops here" as the man said, and (b) the Republican model of deficit-spending can only keep so many balls in the air for so long. It's a juggling act, it's smoke and mirrors - it's like me going out and buying millions of dollars worth of crap that I don't need and can't afford, just to APPEAR as if I'm much richer than I actually am.
No thought is ever given to HOW we're going to pay this off, or WHEN we're going to pay this off. Democrats get so much crap hurled at them for traditionally being the party that raises taxes, but it never once gets pointed out that ANYONE who follows someone like Reagan or Dubya is going to HAVE TO raise taxes - not to pay for new programs or increase existing programs, just to pay off the massive amounts of debt incurred by those who were trying to give a false sense of how great their economies were doing.
We do seldom here of how the economy will sour sometime in the near future because of it being cyclic, but that is no politicians fault.
Actually we don't even need income taxes to pay off our debt, because the Government gets so little of its financing through the income tax and
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:Salman Pak was not used to train Terrorists, a fact the CIA was aware of. Also after the invasion it was determined that Salman Pak was used to train counter-terrorism units.
Originally posted by rallem:
You forgot revenge, but there were camps like Salman Pak which were used for the training of Terrorists which were ended with the invasion of Iraq.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
You say Bush's statements weren't misleading, but that it's the OPINION of the United States House of Representatives that they're misleading
Wrong. These very same folks who were saying 1 thing prior to the war flip flopped for pure political expediency when it suited them to do so. So if the members of the House or Senate plays politics, you're going to completely ignore what they said before ? Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
It bothers me most that folks , who said EXACTLY the same thing as The President , are now ignoring their own words and calling him a liar. THAT's what really gets me pissed off.
Quote:Problem w/ your scenario, is that it's wrong. The President DID ask for more clarification to make sure the intel was right, he DIDN'T blindly take Tenent's word and assume it was a "slam dunk " .
ou've stated that if Bush was told something that was wrong, and he repeated it without checking it out for himself, then HE wasn't lying.
My opinions of Bush are that he's every bit the leader as Clinton ( Bill and Hillary ) , Ted Kennedy, Al Gore, John Kerry, Sandy Berger, Madeiline Albright, and a host of other Democrats who sided w/ Bush's position on Iraq, even before he was in OFFICE !!
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Prepare a funeral for your computer AU.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Prepare a funeral for your computer AU.
Fascist! Fascist ! Repressin' the truth, you are !!
Help Help! I'm being repressed!!
Hey, where's my Fiona clone ??
You're nothing but a low down , double crossin' deceiver !
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:Don't worry AU, Chris's computer FU is not strong. That's why he's getting me to do it :P
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Fascist! Fascist ! Repressin' the truth, you are !!
Help Help! I'm being repressed!!
Hey, where's my Fiona clone ??
You're nothing but a low down , double crossin' deceiver !
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Problem w/ your scenario, is that it's wrong. The President DID ask for more clarification to make sure the intel was right, he DIDN'T blindly take Tenent's word and assume it was a "slam dunk "
Wrong. According to CIA records, George Tenet sent TWO memos up the chain (one to Condi Rice), explaining that the Niger intel was highly suspect and considered by the agency to be "highly dubious", and that he SHOULD NOT USE IT IN HIS SPEECHES.
He was ignored by one and all.
I know you like to blame it entirely on him, and Tenet will even accept his part of the blame (proving that he's not a Republican in the process), but according to Tenet, the "slam dunk" remark was him making the case that we needed more investigation and vetting. He says that us needing more corroboration was a "slam dunk" - not that Saddam having WMD was. So far, his is the only account of that conversation that has been committed to paper, so unless we have a transcript of Oval Office tapes of the day, we may never know if he's telling the truth or not.
But Tenet DOES claim an amount of responsibility for many of the failures of 9/11 and after - something Bush has NEVER done (even claiming in one interview not to have made any mistakes).
So whose account rings truer? Oh, I'm sorry... whose OPINION rings more true?
Quote:
So if the members of the House or Senate plays politics, you're going to completely ignore what they said before ? Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
Keep that in mind. I expect you to live up to that as this campaign rolls on. How many things has McCain said before that he is now utterly contradicting, doing a complete 180-degree flip-flop on?
Quote:
My opinions of Bush are that he's every bit the leader as Clinton ( Bill and Hillary ) , Ted Kennedy, Al Gore, John Kerry, Sandy Berger, Madeiline Albright, and a host of other Democrats...
And given your past statements about them and their leadership, I guess that means you REALLY hate Bush. As such, you must be an "America-hater".
Mike
My opinions of Bush are that he's every bit the leader as Clinton ( Bill and Hillary ) , Ted Kennedy, Al Gore, John Kerry, Sandy Berger, Madeiline Albright, and a host of other Democrats... - AuRaptor, Real World Events Discussions
"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions
I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock
The Myrmidons were an ancient nation of very brave and skilled warriors as described in Homer's Iliad, and were commanded by Achilles. - Wikipedia
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME