Global Warming...the Movie

POSTED BY: Hero
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 19:58
VIEWED: 9891
PAGE 4 of 12

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Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
I’m going to assume they are using sensationalism to make a point, which is what they would be doing.

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Yeah, just them and everyone else in the American media/government .

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More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Originally posted by rue:
Finn

No apparently you don't know what sensationalism is. But claiming words mean something other than their actual definition is your game.

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You’re not helping yourself any. You’re starting to sound like Citizen - like the only thing your interested in is starting a flame war. As long as the only point you can make are personal attacks, then you’re credibility doesn’t seem to be much either. I already know that you think everyone who disagrees with you is an idiot, but that kind of belligerent attitude just doesn’t make for very interesting discussion.

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Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Finn

You says it's sensationalism. And refuse to back up your claim. If you're looking for intelligent discussion, don't go looking in the mirror, dude. B/c simply making unsupported ridiculous claims isn't intelligent.

BTW, what did you think of ALL THOSE home videos of glaciers calving, from all around the world ? Pretty cool, hunh ? And, uh - what do they do to your (ridiculous unsupported) claim that it isn't happening often enough for people to film ?

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Quote:

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Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
You’re not helping yourself any. You’re starting to sound like Citizen - like the only thing your interested in is starting a flame war.

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Except you're the one insulting me for no reason. Maybe you're the one that sounds like 'me'...

As one of the posters on this forum least interested in discussion, and who has actually accused people of being paedophiles because they don't agree with you, I have to say you saying something like that is pretty funny, if only because of your complete lack of self-awareness.

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More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by rue:
Finn

You says it's sensationalism. And refuse to back up your claim. If you're looking for intelligent discussion, don't go looking in the mirror, dude. B/c simply making unsupported ridiculous claims isn't intelligent.

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If you expect intelligent discussion, don’t start out using personal attacks. Honestly, what good would is it do to back up any claim to a person who is so closed minded their first response in a discussion is to attack the other person when they hear something that challenges their world view? And if you don't know what sensationalism means, you need to start listening and learning instead of shooting your mouth off.

MmmmBubye.

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Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Well, Finn, I see you have no interest in the topic at hand. So since I have the floor all to myself, I'm going to consider a roughly 2 second stock footage clip of a glacier calving.

Since the topic was ABOUT glaciers retreating, it doesn't seem out of place to illustrate what that might look like.

So the first thing to consider is: are glaciers retreating ? Because it would be wildly misleading to portray glaciers calving if it wasn't happening. But since nearly all glaciers ARE retreating worldwide, and the ones that touch water do so by calving, it's fair to say talking about glacier retreat is not only factual and honest, it's instructive. IOW, it wasn't a 'lie' to talk about or illustrate glaciers retreating.

Now, is there a problem with obtaining actual footage ? Is it so rare and so remote that it had to be 'fudged' ? Apparently not, as the many, many clips from YouTube show. So they could have used YouTube clips to portray this common event if they so chose.

There is, however, the slight issue of production values. The real footage is taken by amateurs with amateur equipment, usually on boats moving in some way, sometimes not completely in-frame, with people talking over the sound, the picture out of focus etc. So while it is possible to use any number of real videos, it's clearer to use the computer-generated stock footage already available to illustrate what glacier calving looks like. (And remember, we're talking about a 2 second clip illustrating the fact of glacier retreat within a 100 minute movie.)

Finally, Finn feels it's 'sensationalism'. Since it's been established that glaciers are calving all around the globe, enough to be retreating, one of the aspects of sensationalism - focusing on the extreme or unusual to get attention, is NOT met. (Prurient, which is another part of the definition doesn't apply here.) More subtly, you could wonder if they used a wildly outsized portrayal to exaggerate the point. Having looked at the home videos, I'd say no. Some calving was smaller in scale, some larger (the one from Argentina was monstrous), so the footage used in the movie was middle of the road for that kind of thing.

So, since the footage illustrates a real event of common occurrence without exaggeration, I wonder - why do people like 'Hero', Rap and Finn have such personal issues over it ? Perhaps they can explain.

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Citizen-
Name one. One. That's all. Name one time where 'science' has done a complete U turn.

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have we learned anything new in the last 500 years? im curious... it seems science is ever changing and evolving, as we learn new information. there are continuously new discoveries being observed in the universe, which is always changing current beliefs and theories in the field. thats my point. im not a scientist, but i found plenty of now discredited or defunct theories, varying in acceptance, which have been improved or surpassed, just do a search. GW may be no different, in matter of the planet and universe, there is still a lot to be learned

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No, it's(science)(is) the search for truth.

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right.. not truth itself. pursuance is not a claim to truth

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So's gravity. Do tell us when you start floating off into space old boy. Beyond that, I'm sorry but that's a pretty ignorant thing to say. In science a theory is somewhat different to 'theory' in common usage. What most people mean when they say theory, a scientist would call a hypothesis.

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i know what an hypothesis is, i believe ive made that point to you before about your sacred evolutionary theory

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A theory requires supporting data, saying something is 'only' a theory indicates you don't have a clue what you're talking about, in science there's no 'only' about a theory.

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hey, tell me exactly how our ancestors managed to crawl out of molten lava? thpse were some mighty intelligent raw elements to have designed all these awfully complex biological organisms we see today. ive never seen any data to support that.. instead, i see a lot of cherry picking of evidence to fit ones own chosen belief

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Pollutants aren't something 'unnatural' added into the environment. Oxygen is poisonous, but I'd say it's also pretty key to life on Earth. Pollutants are anything at an abnormally high concentration that upset the natural balance. So yeah, abnormal amounts of CO2 upsetting the natural balance would be pollution.

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actually, the natural balance says otherwise. http://www.heartland.org/Article.cfm?artId=22787
recent data shows warmer temperatures precede higher CO2 concentrations. according to this new research, i could presume that we were amidst a warming cycle before humans began burning fuel

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You're point is (beyond an appeal to ridicule I mean)?

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i had two points:
1- high CO2 concentrations resulted in a rich diversity in life, so whats the problem?

2- a still to present un-explained "explosion" of complex organisms, without any appearance of prior evolution(throughout the pre-cambrian era). ID(i just love to insert it when possible)?

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Yeah, that's half the point. We don't. The warming is happening at a much faster and unprecedented rate.

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NASA and all the major institutes maintain only a .7 degree surface temperature increase over the last 100 years. what constitutes unprecedented? thats beyond the avg lifespan, its unnoticeable

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The 'peak' of the industrial revolution was actually further back than that. Not that I see the point in talking about it, the we're more polluting now (as a species) than at any other time in our history.

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i was making a correlation between the last 100 years of industry, and our oldest current recorded climate data. its still only .7 degrees. no doubt third world countries are operating with less stringent particulate pollution standards, but CO2 just doesn't seem to be the big problem its being made out to be

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Err, actually it is(a dramatic increase). And it's accelerating, especially in the last few years.

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thats a matter of opinion, but either way, i haven't seen any evidence of dramatic increases over the last few years. we're only talking a few hundredths of a fraction of a degree over decades. besides, who's to say what a stable climate is? seriously.. the earth and our universe are beyond our control

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From the fact that a wo

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