No matter what Joss says, The Matrix is a stupid movie.
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Sunday, December 30, 2007 01:08
VIEWED: 6236
PAGE 5 of 5
Quote:Chris tends to pose questions for discussion but doesn’t necessarily assert his own opinion into them. So just because Chris makes a point about what science fiction is, doesn’t necessarily mean that this is really what he thinks in it’s entirety, but merely a question to discuss. It‘s not always good idea to try and pin him down because he can be deceptively open-minded.
Originally posted by embers:Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
To be honest, I don't really understand chrisisall's definition of science fiction. Perhaps it's just above me.
I am probably wrong here, but I am beginning to suspect that 100% of Chris' criteria for Science is in fact gravity...
because 2001 did show artificial gravity being created on the space ship, that makes it all scientifically viable....
But the Matrix appears to defy gravity...
but of course I would argue that is doesn't because their physical bodies are not in play...and when they are they DO respond to physical laws....
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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I liked the original matrix, don't care for where they took it with the sequels, but the original is good
"Haha, mine is an evil laugh."
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Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Chris tends to pose questions for discussion but doesn’t necessarily assert his own opinion into them. So just because Chris makes a point about what science fiction is, doesn’t necessarily mean that this is really what he thinks in it’s entirety, but merely a question to discuss. It‘s not always good idea to try and pin him down because he can be deceptively open-minded.
oh yes I know... he actually starts most of my favorite threads...
and I think he knows I like to give him a hard time, nit-picking at his arguments....
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Quote:First time I had that said about me...
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
deceptively open-minded.
Ooops- I left my skull open Chrisisall
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First off, The Matrix cannot be a really stupid movie, for that would leave too little distance to its sequels, which were truly horrific. Other than that, I thought The Matrix was great. :)
Naturally, the whole fusion idea, with humans serving as batteries, was utter bull. If you can build a Matrix, you can build a half-way decent power plant that doesn't require body heat. But the whole premiss of the movie is predicated upon the idea of this one concept (MORPHEUS): "That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born into bondage, born into a prison that you cannot smell, taste, or touch. A prison for your mind." A Terminator style scenario would be far more likely: machines try to wipe out humanity. Period. But then there's nothing to work with. So, if you're willing to accept that there even IS a story, I think it's not unreasonable to ask of the viewer that he accept the possibility that mankind is somehow subjugated -- and, in consequence, kept alive for a reason to justify said subjugation. Otherwise, like I said, there's no story.
So, I'm willing to accept the premiss of an enslaved mankind. And, after that, found it to be a fascinating, original story--with dazzling effects to boot, and great pieces of text. For instance, I found Agent Smith's next monologue nothing short of absolute brilliance:
"Did you know that the first Matrix was designed to be a perfect human world. Where none suffered. Where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. No one would accept the program. Entire crops were lost. Some believed that we lacked the programming language to describe your perfect world. But I believe that as a species, human beings define their reality through misery and suffering. The perfect world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from."
And so very insightful it is! And what about this philosophical beaut' by Mouse?
"How did the machines know what Tasty Wheat tasted like. huh? Maybe they got it wrong. Maybe what I think Tasty Wheat tasted like actually tasted like oatmeal or tuna fish. That makes you wonder about a lot of things. You take chicken for example, maybe they couldn't figure out what to make chicken taste like, which is why chicken tastes like everything."
And, of course, the simple, but no less true:
"There's a difference between knowing the path and walking the path."
Then there's the cute play with reality, like how they worked in deja-vu's as glitches in the Matrix. Very nice!
Mal4prez quoted: "Neo, I know you're the one, because I love you!" Well, it weren't all THAT trite. :) Trinity had said: "The Oracle told me. The man I love is the One. You can't be dead." So, it's not like he can't be dead simply because she loves him, but because the Oracle had identified the One as he who she loves: so she knows for certain he cannot be dead (after all, the Oracle had been right about everything else). And yes, btw, Trinity is a very hot chick! :)
--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam
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There may be a more basic reason the machines keep humanity enslaved: revenge. The whole concept of the machines enslaving mankind is a complete role reversal to the way things existed before the war. If machines were so reliant on solar energy, which lead man to blacken the skies, they may have initially used human batteries as a stopgap. As time went on the machines continue to really on people energy as punishment for the 100's(?) of years they were used by humanity. It seems to me that the machines may have inheirited certain qualities from mankind, one of them being vindictiveness.
With regards to humanity rising up against the machines they probably did not believe people were capable of overcoming their imprisonment. After all, the Architect explained that Zion had been destroyed several times coinciding with previous appearances of The One. Again, this may be a case of the machines taking after humanity with regards to hubris.
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We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.
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Did anybody watch The Animatrix DVD?
It was released just before Reloaded and fills in a lot of the backstory. It was meant to be seen before the sequels, especially Final Flight of the Osiris & The Second Renaissance: Parts 1 & 2.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Animatrix
http://animatrix.thesolarnet.com/
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Yeah, Mouse was my favorite character of the bunch, since he had something of a personality. He also offers up this little bon mot that I really enjoyed. "To deny our own impulses is to deny the very thing that makes us human."
But to get back to DARK CITY a bit, I just think it has a more spooky and nefarious atmosphere to it that makes it a bit more memorable. There's a reason why Roger Ebert chose that movie above SAVING PRIVATE RYAN as the best film of 98. I mean, the way that it blends film noir and German expressionism creates a visual world that still to this day hasn't really been copied. THE MATRIX is more cyberpunk, which may excite most people, but as a film geek, it's more interesting to see these blends of visual style.
And The Strangers and what they're trying to do is a lot more high minded and nefarious. It's one thing to turn the human race into batteries. It's another to abduct them, strand them in a city that's constantly changing and always night, and then play with their memories and identities and give them new personalities almost every night, all in some abstract quest to locate the human soul.
I actually read somewhere in EW that the reason that THE MATRIX is so mainstream, while DARK CITY is something of a cult classic is that THE MATRIX takes the same themes and ideas of DARK CITY, but that it structures it around the whole Joseph Campbell journey of the hero that STAR WARS touched on, which made it more mythic and accessible to the general public.
I dunno. For what they do right, they equally get a bunch of stuff wrong. But DARK CITY just has that little bit extra.
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"And it starts with a sentence that might last a lifetime, or it all might just go down in flames. If I let you know me, then why would you want me? Each day I don't is a shame. Each day I don't is a great shame."
Loudon Wainwright III - "Strange Weirdos" off the "Knocked Up" soundtrack
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