Funny Taser Video
POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 19:48
VIEWED: 4816
PAGE 5 of 6
Rue: I guess my point is that "the system" as we have currently constructed it doesn't really deter crime, which is its putative goal.
If you take a look at a lot of crimes, especialy the more horrific ones... the kind that really make people WANT to string up the perp... there are a lot of reasons why they're committed:
drugs
traumatic brain injury
other organic brain problems
poisoning
other physical illness
alientation
former abuse
psychiatric illness
"born that way"
These are the people LEAST likely to be thinking about "consequences". When I hear of something truly horrific, my lizard-brain says STRING EM UP! I get angry. But I wait a couple of seconds, and think about the whys and wherefores and question whether jail time would really keep this from happening again (either with the same people of by example) and the answer is most often NO.
Usually the perp needs to detox, or take the right meds. Sometimes it's as simple as putting them in charge of someone who's even worse off than they are. (These kinds of programs for "at risk" youths have the lowest recidivism rate, while "boot camp" programs have the highest.) Sometimes there is no resolution, and that person simply needs to be isolated from others.
Yes, punishment works for some. At times all it takes is a slap uspide the head, and the perp recognizes that Hey, other people take this seriously. I'd better clean up my act! I suspect that works for littering, graffiti, white collar crime, yelling at the kids, and for people whose brains are functioning properly... they're just committing crimes of convenience. But unfortunately the justice system doesn't take notice until the crimes are serious, and by the time it rises to the level of being noticed by the "justice" system the person has had a LONG history of that kind of behavior "working" for them in some fashion, and the threat of punshiment is not much of a deterrent.
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Always look upstream.
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Hi SignyM
Oh - I thought you were making a point about people responding to the type of system they're in. And while I agree that most people do, there does seem to be some extra factor that causes people to respond out of 'type' - King-Drew and the CHP are two good examples.
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"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."
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Quote:I've been hesitant to comment on this topic, but I will risk voicing a different perspective.
Originally posted by rue:
Hi AnthonyT
I knew of a guy who was quite popular with the boss, co-workers and neighbors but would beat up and terrorize his wife and children because there were no 'consequences' to that. And studies have found generally that on-line discussions tend to be meaner b/c the 'consequences' you get with face to face interactions are missing. I would think in general that people more freely express their 'true' selves online than in real life.
Posting on the internet within a community is not completely without consequence. I will agree that you get more 'honest' answers here than you will from folks you have 'just met' in real life; at the same time, folks develop reputation; and folks are -projecting a persona-. This last part may manifest in folks 'overstating' their position to either make a point or perhaps to somewhat escape reality. As a consequence, it is somewhat dangerous to take completely at face values things post on the internet.
I'm going to risk commenting on some recent posts Hero made; and I apologize 'up front' for talking about him like he isn't here; and if he asks I'll purge the balance of this post (Hero: I'm hoping you'll take this in the spirit intended).
At one point, Hero made the 'famous' quote, I never saw a taser video that wasn't funny.' I admit when I first saw that, I seriously wondered about his sanity (or wondered if he was seeing some of the video I had bumped into while trying to form an opinion about tasers). DESPITE that, he sees this one, and acknowledges it is -not- funny; that in fact he can highlight specific points where the police made mistakes. This actually relieved a great deal of my fears regarding his character (or at least, the character he is trying to project here.) However, rather than acknowledging he's clearly not as 'out there' as he had originally positioned himself, most folks continue to pound on him like he hadn't said a word above. It astounds me.
It is my belief that Hero gets tired of hearing the "Cops are unfair to me" "The system is putting me down, I didn't do nuthin." It is my belief that Hero himself is probably about a 'good as cog' as any in the system, personally attempts to make the system 'as good as possible' and would have no tolerance for police 'shenanigans' if he personally came across any. And my guess is the police in his area know this, and try to live up to his expectations; thus driving to what I would expect to be a 'better system' than if someone with less integrity were in the position that he holds.
As to finding humor in 'odd' places, I will simply reference 'gallows humor' and say not much more.
HAVING SAID THAT, I do not mean to discount other folks struggles with 'the system'; but will only observe that Hero most likely was not in the area where you had your struggles with 'the system' and thus is not particularly aware of what problems lurk in those portions of the system.
** Now practicing 'duck and cover.'
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Hi LeadB
Hero (same apologies) was quite upfront about the idea that it's all funny until someone dies. That's actually what I have an objection to. Finding the vision of a person screaming, writhing, crawling away in pain amusing is twisted, even if they don't die from it.
And Hero keeps trying to 'normalize' it.
Doesn't everybody ? Isn't that what AFV and YouTube is all about ? People screaming in pain at the hands of another ? And even if not everybody does, it's my job. It drives me to it. It keeps me from burning out. Just like teachers, and nurses and doctors and animal shelter workers ... but unlike them I can't afford to be sympathetic, so it's different, even though it's the same. Oh yeah, and I love my job, too. That counts.
Because he tries to 'normalize' it, it makes me think that even he realizes it's at the very least not acceptable.
Even though Hero tries to frame it as this or that, there are many responses to choose from. It's not a matter of either turning into a puddle of sympathy or snickering over a defendant's pain. Hero chooses to find it amusing.
***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."
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Prosecutors, police etc often focus on the "free will" nature of crime. It was a "chosen" behavior. Altho Eileen Wuornos had been abused since childhood and hooked at the age of 13 to support herself, she "chose" to kill all those men. Altho Andrea Yates was profoundly depressed and heard voices, she "chose" to kill her kids.
What strikes me then is the illogic of saying that prosecutors, police, and detectives get a "pass" on bad behavior because they're traumatized by the violence they see in their jobs. And these professions often develop their own little subculture of what's acceptable and what isn't, plus a sense of alienation from "regular" folks.
The same COULD be said for many criminals, who often have backgrounds of abuse (to the point of brain damage) and neglect, combined with mental dysfunction and their own little subculture of alienation. And the criminals have to endure the violence first-hand 24-7, not just watching videos of it at work. So if criminals "choose" their criminal behavior, the same should be said for cops (and prosecutors) who "choose" to be less than empathetic. But if cops and prosecutors get a "pass", so should criminals.
When I look at it this way, I see a culture just totally traumatized by violence. First-hand, when kids are abused or grow up in violent neighborhoods. And then second-hand trauma in the people who are sent to deal with it in a violent way. The answer to violence is not more violence. If we stopped looking at this as a problem of "justice" and focused on treatment, sending people to drug treatment programs, and using social workers instead of cops, we'd prolly get better results.
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Always look upstream.
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FWIW, I only find AFV sometimes amusing; and that which I don't tends to keep me from watching it on a regular basis. But I will observe that AFV has had a relatively long run. It makes me wonder if -I'm- not normal. Perhaps I'm not, but I think I can deal with it ;-)
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Sometimes I laugh while watching AFV, but I often wince which is why I don't watch it very often either. People are on a spectrum- some have more empathy than others. But our culture is particularly punitive, and what empathy people have is often ground right out of them.
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Always look upstream.
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Siggys mad a lot of my case for me here, and prolly more coherently that I coulda done it.
Ain't nothin I haven't been sayin in many ways over a long time, anyhow.
Especially on the "free pass" issue.
Leadb I think has also gotten similar sentiments about a system being put in place to defend something, actively attacking it instead.
So on that front I've little else to say.
As for perception once consequence is removed...
Anthony, I know it's not a full picture that way, but tells you who they are inside, who they wish they were, and that really does tell you a lot about them, more so than most folk would believe it does - if you look slow and careful.
I offer this, hesitantly, but still enough folk might have put it together after Jack convinced us to spill Meyers-Briggs...
Consequence of various type does have it's uses and the acknowledgement of em isn't always a bad thing - but not everyone can mentally get "here from there", lifestyle-violent offenders, particularly juvenille ones, simply do not have the ability to look that far ahead and thus nothing but an immediate on the spot consquence has any effect whatever on their behavior.
And some folk, ISTP in particular, do not feel fear - that is NOT courage, but rather, imho, a limited form of insanity.. courage is when you're scared out of your wits and take action regardless, but to not feel fear can lead one into some damn stupid conduct.
There's also folk who are by virtue of employment or social status, somewhat removed from the consequences of their own actions.
So that's not always a good ruler to measure by either, you see.
Short of being in their head, a persons actions are really in effect all you can perceive them by, and the truth of them far better than a persons words.
Try watching TV with the sound off, or observing people in general by focusing on their actions rather than their speech, for a while, and you might get what I am tryin to put across here - who ya are, is what ya do.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
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Friends, family mourn 'good kid' who died after Taser incident Quote:
Friends and family identified the 20-year-old Frederick, Maryland, man who died after police used a Taser stun gun on him Sunday morning, according to a local television station.... A deputy used a Taser on Gray, who fell unconscious, Bailey said. He was taken to Frederick Memorial Hospital where he was pronounced dead.
www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/19/taser.death/index.html
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Always look upstream.
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Let me guess.
Excited Delerium, Right ?
Safe and effective, Right ?
I swear, they sound like a goddamn Comcast phonedrone blaming the users equipment in spite of the fact that there's a countywide outage at the time.
Scrambling from excuse to excuse as the bodies pile up...
LESS Lethal, not NON Lethal, dammit.
-F
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