Hoo yeah! The economy's ON FIRE!
POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 5, 2025 02:39
VIEWED: 7512
PAGE 5 of 7
Quote:Carter was such a man...
Originally posted by citizen:Quote:Not to mention one that couldn't get elected in the US.
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Those would have been the words of a thoughtful and reasonable President, yes.
Too bad he didn't know how to swim w/the sharks.
Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:While I don't disagree, he could 'merely' have stopped with the invasion of Afghanistan. He would have looked tough, and avoided a debacle.
Originally posted by rue:
"If the president had said, "Eh, ignore them and they'll go away," he'd have been denounced."
If the president had said ... we've been tragically wounded but our future is still bright. We will mourn our losses, and remember for all time our grief, but we will be a strong and free country now and in the future. We will seek justice, we will seek security, we will work with our friends and allies around the globe to insure a safe and secure world. ...
I think that would have gone down just fine.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
ahem Yeah, on fire all right. Last one off this burning tub is a ...
Dow drops over 200 points
It's a week of big losses as Wachovia, Fannie Mae are the latest lenders caught in the real estate mess. Nasdaq slides over 2.5 percent.
***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Time to get a gat.
Wild in the streets Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Providing mortgages to those who should not qualify is nothing new, especially in good times (when merely the fuse is burning). Here's how the scam goes, as always:
Bait hook with American Dream.
Sink hook.
If the fish, erm, customer is able to make payments, great! If the customer is barely able to make payments, better still! More money.
If the customer is unable to make payments, great! The market is going up, repossess the house, sell it at a PROFIT! More money.
Either way, more money for the lenders. Now...
Too many people default on their loans (shoe #1)
Market goes into decline (shoe #2, aka "other shoe")
Voila! Now, lenders lose tens of billions, and the downward spiral begins.
The problem with mortgages is that lenders and borrowers forget to pronounce the "t". If it were pronounced "mort-gage", as in "mortis", as in "death", the pronounciation just might help with lending and borrowing decision-making processes.
ravingmoderatekarelisall. 
"And we've just heard that in the English Channel, a ship carrying red paint has collided with a ship carrying purple paint. It is believed that both crews have been marooned. And now, back to our regular programme." -- The Two Ronnies.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Karel:
Providing mortgages to those who should not qualify is nothing new, especially in good times (when merely the fuse is burning).
But haven't you heard. People getting themselves into situations they know they shouldn't have is not really their fault at all. It's somehow all traceable back to the Big Bad Bush. Welcome to the new land of no personal responsibility.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:Quote:
Originally posted by Karel:
Providing mortgages to those who should not qualify is nothing new, especially in good times (when merely the fuse is burning).
But haven't you heard. People getting themselves into situations they know they shouldn't have is not really their fault at all. It's somehow all traceable back to the Big Bad Bush. Welcome to the new land of no personal responsibility.
I've heard that both borrowers and lenders are able to over-extend themselves, regardless of who is in office. *snort*
"And we've just heard that in the English Channel, a ship carrying red paint has collided with a ship carrying purple paint. It is believed that both crews have been marooned. And now, back to our regular programme." -- The Two Ronnies.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:And here we have a systems problem as viewed by an ant.
But haven't you heard. People getting themselves into situations they know they shouldn't have is not really their fault at all. It's somehow all traceable back to the Big Bad Bush. Welcome to the new land of no personal responsibility.
There are all kinds of issues about the current mortgage crisis: lending regulations, capitalization requirements, the necessity of credit to keep consumption afloat, etc. Even if people HAD been "personally responsible" we'd still have a mess on our hands, so it's not all about your crusty list moralisms. Trying to control the economy by telling people how they "should" behave is like trying to control electrons by telling them how they should behave.
FWIW I think we're facing a "perfect storm", and the mortgage problem is simply a trigger for a larger crisis, just as Black Tuesday (1929) was just a trigger for the Great Depression. And yes, I think this is a real sea-change, of about the same magnitude as the Great Depression.
1) A larger income gap than at any time since 1929.
2) Loss of manufacturing capability in the USA.
3) Massive Federal debt, paid for by Treasuries bought by foreigners.
4) Massive trade debt.
5) Worldwide political ill-will against the USA.
6) A shift from the USA being China's main market to the EU being China's main market.
None of this has to do with mortgages, but what is does is seriously undermine the value of the dollar. Without those factors in place, the mortgage "crisis" would simply be a mortgage blip, just as the S&L crisis of 1982-3 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savings_and_Loan_crisis
didn't affect the dollar's exchange rates.
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/data/EXJPUS.txt
I'm certain that what we're seeing is the conversion of the USD from being "the" world currency to "a" world currency- and not a particularly valuable one at that.
ETA: And may I add my WELCOME to Karel!
---------------------------------
Always look upstream.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Well spoken Karel - and welcome to the chaotic warzone hell that is RWED, also known as swimming with pirahnas. 
You'll find reason and logic don't go far around here, but you're welcome to attempt it's application as much as ya please.
Don't let it discourage you, I for one welcome new opinions even radically different than mine own.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:Thank you Fremdfirma and SignyM!
Originally posted by SignyM:
FWIW I think we're facing a "perfect storm", and the mortgage problem is simply a trigger for a larger crisis, just as Black Tuesday (1929) was just a trigger for the Great Depression. And yes, I think this is a real sea-change, of about the same magnitude as the Great Depression.
1) A larger income gap than at any time since 1929.
2) Loss of manufacturing capability in the USA.
3) Massive Federal debt, paid for by Treasuries bought by foreigners.
4) Massive trade debt.
5) Worldwide political ill-will against the USA.
6) A shift from the USA being China's main market to the EU being China's main market.
None of this has to do with mortgages, but what is does is seriously undermine the value of the dollar. Without those factors in place, the mortgage "crisis" would simply be a mortgage blip, just as the S&L crisis of 1982-3 didn't affect the dollar's exchange rates. I'm certain that what we're seeing is the conversion of the USD from being "the" world currency to "a" world currency- and not a particularly valuable one at that.
ETA: And may I add my WELCOME to Karel!
Great Depression? We'll see. Regardless of the magnitude --
1-5) Agreed.
6) Holy crap! As China's dependence on us wanes, how will that change their policies toward us?
Random thoughts:
Somebody in the late 1980s or early '90s said something like "Potato chips or microchips, what does it matter?" I'm afraid that we are starting to find out! We do not provide the world with goodies like China does. What are we going to sell China to level the trade deficit? What do we have to offer China? Fighter jets?
Here's a list, along the "perfect storm" lines:
1.) National debt
2.) Trade deficit
3.) War
4.) Economic slowdown
5.) Bad loans
6.) Falling interest rates
7.) Rising energy costs
All inter-related. What can the power of the almighty dollar do for you? Less with every passing second.
The government says that inflation is low. It is amazing what 'nothing' can do to a man. I say that whomever is elected President in 2008 is screwed on at least the the economic front.
"And we've just heard that in the English Channel, a ship carrying red paint has collided with a ship carrying purple paint. It is believed that both crews have been marooned. And now, back to our regular programme." -- The Two Ronnies.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME