Controversial Mal characterization
POSTED BY: SpaceAnJL
UPDATED: Saturday, January 3, 2009 06:12
VIEWED: 42749
PAGE 7 of 12
Quote:
Originally posted by TheHeroOfWilliamtown:
i have to admit i was a little confused but that's how i spend alot of my time these days.
Me, too, obviously!
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The catalyst for Mal's change in the BDM I believe stems from when he shot the guy who was trying to get on the mule, then taken by the Reavers. Mal came up with all the reasons he could use to defend his actions when Zoe brought it up later, and his final answer about leaving wounded behind as a reason why they lost the war was his lowest point.
When Jayne asks him why he rescued River and brought her back, Mal glances over at Zoe...it is that moment that tells me Mal has changed...his humanity has kicked back in...he could not abandon another person.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
The catalyst for Mal's change in the BDM I believe stems from when he shot the guy who was trying to get on the mule, then taken by the Reavers. Mal came up with all the reasons he could use to defend his actions when Zoe brought it up later, and his final answer about leaving wounded behind as a reason why they lost the war was his lowest point.
When Jayne asks him why he rescued River and brought her back, Mal glances over at Zoe...it is that moment that tells me Mal has changed...his humanity has kicked back in...he could not abandon another person.
Good observation, I missed that...ummm more to think on... Thanks
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Another point to add: Mal's leadership qualities during the war. This man always inspired people to follow him. He still takes care of those under his 'command'.
He's flailing and a little lost, until he finds something new to believe in. You watch one small damaged little girl carve her way through a bar of folks like the Angel of Death come down, and then fall like a broken angel. You think that he could leave her lying there?
Of course, I don't think Mal has a very clear idea of the why himself. But...both he and River had a clear shot in the bar, before Simon horned in. Neither of them took it. You might want to wonder on that a while.
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Quote:Joss said in the commentary that someone (his wife?) brought this issue up late in the movie-making process: he never explicitely addressed Mal's decision to bring River back to the ship. So Joss says - of course Mal brought her back! Wasn't any need for him to waffle about it, he probably didn't even question himself until he was out of atmo. It was just the thing to do. (I'm totally paraphrasing, I can't remember what Joss actually said, but you get the point.)
Originally posted by SpaceAnJL:
Of course, I don't think Mal has a very clear idea of the why himself.
Kind of goes with him (Mal) being a man of action before anything else...
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hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left
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The 'why are we still talking about this?' approach.
I think Mal reacts to things very quickly, which includes yelling at folk who punch him in the mouth. (Simon) And then he doesn't ever back down. Doesn't know how. Like a lot of the Inara situations. A lot of smart mouth, and then no way back. In a command situation, he can't be seen to back down, and I think he gets command and real life a mite twisted together. So he throws the Tams off (which he almost instantly regrets, probably, but doesn't know how to retrieve.) And he's horribly defensive about it to Kaylee.
But Mal wouldn't be Mal if he'd left her there. After all, that was the sensible option, and does he ever take the sensible option...
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I am jumping back a little to an issue which I think is important (to me) and then catch up with everyone.
"When you've been in Serenity you never leave" and "The war is all I lost". What do they have in common?
It is not that they are about Mal, but that they are said by Zoe. I think she truly believes that and the other quotes, but they are more about her than Mal.
Why does Zoe have to always always know and understand everything about Mal? IMO she is trying to understand Mal through her own demons. That does not mean she is accurate in any way at all. (Yes - Joss was trying to get a message across through Zoe, but that don't mean what Zoe thinks is fact.)
That is the worst thing that had happened to her, and her coping mechanism is "Mal went through worse. He survived. I hold on and I will too."
If you watch the scene in OoG, Mal does not pick the name for Serenity out of spite or bitterness. You hear hope in his voice. (I am of course assuming that "Serenity" IS the name he had picked out, not some other name he got talked out of or something. That does not show to me that Mal is as bitter about the war as we all assume. Then there is his banter in The Train Job. "Superior numbers. That is why we lost." Once again, not showing much bitterness.
I have this theory that Serenity valley was the worst thing that happened to Zoe. It still gives her bad nights. (maybe after the demise of Wash this will change) But for Mal, his worst came much later. Maybe something Zoe is not aware about.
I had this theory of him being tried for treason by the independents, War crimes by the Alliance, but the former of that got scuppered by the fact that Mal got a commendation over Serenity Valley. Maybe something else then. Still ways around that, but there is a lot to explore here.
The significant glance in Serenity IMO is also about asking "You too?" Is Zoe also demanding an explanation? If she is, he would have to provide something. Since she does not, he just ignores the issue, moves on to the next point of if she goes woolly again.
About his actual decision to allow Simon to leave (not kick them off, as it was Simon who suggested it), I don't think Mal would have immediately regretted it if the stuff that happened did not happen. It is just like the Tracy situation. "I'll go to Hell before I watch you turn and bite us for the favor". Maybe later on he would have, but he probably would not admit that to even himself.
With the Kaylee bit he is once again fed up of being challenged on everything he does. Mentally he has already moved on from the Tam's.
While Mal is loath to change his mind, he can and will if needed. Once he has had a breather and room to think. Look at the Pilot. Simon is a dead man even when Mal knows the score, all the way up to when Mal has a quiet moment where he can look to change his mind. Indecisiveness costs lives. He will not do that in a moment of action. (In the case of the Tam's, the journey to beaumonde took 10 hours, so he had a chance to reconsider. But would there be any point since Simon wanted to leave? can't hold the man against his will - no matter how stupid he is being.)
EDIT - I actually put the point I was making in (choosing the name for Serenity bit). Forgot about it the first time.
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Of course, I don't think Mal has a very clear idea of the why himself. But...both he and River had a clear shot in the bar, before Simon horned in. Neither of them took it. You might want to wonder on that a while.
Oh, I think we've all wondered about that...
My interpretation is that Mal already knows River to be more than just a fighting demon, he's already established a relationship with her beyond this new behavior. (Do you know that girl?) Like Tracey, he gives her time to stand down.
and I think River is smart enough to know that Mal is Simon's and River's ticket to safety and freedom. He holds the Captain reins and makes the calls on where their going, (he has to see) Miranda. She is like Joss says "watching him carefully".
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Quote:
Originally posted by SPACEANJL:
Of course, I don't think Mal has a very clear idea of the why himself. But...both he and River had a clear shot in the bar, before Simon horned in. Neither of them took it. You might want to wonder on that a while.
The main question is that was that a stand off, or artistic licence?
In the script is as soon as they point the guns she will be made to fall asleep. But saying the words does take time.
I am not too sure where I stand on this.
The problem with Mal is that sometimes he does the right think without thinking about it. like on autopilot. That gets him into trouble sometimes.
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Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:Quote:Joss said in the commentary that someone (his wife?) brought this issue up late in the movie-making process: he never explicitely addressed Mal's decision to bring River back to the ship. So Joss says - of course Mal brought her back! Wasn't any need for him to waffle about it, he probably didn't even question himself until he was out of atmo. It was just the thing to do. (I'm totally paraphrasing, I can't remember what Joss actually said, but you get the point.)
Originally posted by SpaceAnJL:
Of course, I don't think Mal has a very clear idea of the why himself.
Yeah heard that in the original commentary. (No CE in the uk = me waiting longer to listen to the new nuggets that are teasing me on this very site.)
I don't think many people thought he would do any different to be honest. WHen I heard the commentary, I thought "huh, that IS a good question". But because of who we see Mal as, I doubt anyone really questioned why he did that. And so, he didn't, and joss did not have to get himself out of a situation. :P
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