Star Trek: Nemisis...? Another Trek discussion thread
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 15, 2007 21:34
VIEWED: 4774
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Quote:Generations was basically "the first TNG movie." It was great at the time, but without that gimmick, it's just okay.
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Did you think it was better than Generations? Did you like it better than First Contact?
First Contact I loved, just because of the Borg (and because it represents the last time the Borg were written well).
I thought Insurrection was fun, and don't really require my movies to be more than that. One of the things about Trekkies that most annoys me is how so many of them seem to have lost anything resembling a sense of humour.
Nemesis wins for finally showing us the Remans (who we've been hearing about since TOS), doing the evil-clone thing better than most (yes, it's an old gimmick, but what isn't?!?), and providing a solid conclusion to that chapter of the Enterprise's life. Not to everything, just that chapter. Like when DS9 ended, yet the station was still there, most of the characters were still alive, and embarking on new and exciting adventures.
It also fits almost seamlessly into the ongoing drama that is the Romulan Empire:
Way back in TNG, Spock predicted that the Romulan Empire had, at most, 200 years before it succumbed to social strife and collapsed. Then the Dominion War happened, and Romulans --for the first time in recent memory-- started going outside their safe, self-contained little feifdom.
As with the Crusades on Earth, those Romulan (and Reman) soldiers were exposed to different cultures, different ways of understanding the world, and different sets of ideals. They eventually returned home with new ideas, which is the single most dangerous thing a fascist empire can face.
Then there's Shinzon's coup, an ensuing power vacuum, and now (in the novels), a civil war between Donatra's military faction and Praetor Tal'Aura's traditionalists.
Quote:
And doesn't B4 contradict NG's final ep?
You mean the Q-created alternate future, in which the Enterprise-D was still around? That was contradicted by Generations.
If Star Trek has taught me anything, it's that nothing is set in stone. Time is fluid. With the right combination of skill, intelligence, wisdom, and stubborn determination, you can change the future.
And the past.
Quote:That is not a plothole.
Originally posted by Tinadoll:
they killed of Data and replaced him with a sad sorry android named B4 whom they found strewn on a scarsly inhabited planet. What a plothole!!
It's fairly evident that Shinzon planted the B4's body on that world, knowing that Enterprise would eventually find it. B4 was a Trojan horse.
The only thing that resembles a plothole is where Shinzon got the B4, but the movie is clear that Shinzon is reasonably well-travelled (he led the Remans during the Dominion War), and could easily have stumbled over a Soong-type android (as the novels say he did).
And there's little concrete evidence that the B4 will ever replace Data. Not without a massive systemic overhaul, and the only people who knew positronic systems that well are both dead (Geordie is good, but he'd be the first to tell you he's no Noonian Soong).
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We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.
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Cybersnark, you just made me determined to purchase my copy of Nemisis for (as Nomad put it) re-eval-uation.
A most detailed post- thanks!
Trekkie Chrisisall
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CS- You are waaaay too observant.
Also, i may add. The tactic of killing and bringing back a main character reeks of Star Trek 2 and 3
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Wow.
That was...interesting. I had actually managed to block all memories of Nemesis. I saw that crap in the theater and didn't remember the first thing about it, I had to go through the whole webpage you linked to to remember the pain of it.
That said, wasn't Insurrection (the episode masquerading as a movie) the one where when Worf is asked what brought him to the Enterprise they turn down his mike and have Geordie talk nonsense instead of answering? And wasn't it the one where no one even mentions his wife recently dying, or was that a different one?
Need your clock cleaned? home.windstream.net/clockdug
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Quote:And mythology (paging Osiris, Hercules, and Jesus).
Originally posted by Tinadoll:
The tactic of killing and bringing back a main character reeks of Star Trek 2 and 3
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We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.
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Well in the Trek verse it has been done by Spock.
I do not see another TNG movie in the future
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ive been out of the trek loop for too long now to know most of what yall are saying. but i do know this. i hated the enterprise "E" version since the moment they unveiled it. in ST10, they totaled it. it was shot to shreds and they rammed it into shinzon's ship. it was half gone. i though yay they finally got rid of that POS spaceship. and the final scene is that they are in spacsedock being rebuilt? no! you trashed it! get a new one!
also, there will be a star tek 11. its being directed by JJ Abramson of Alias. they havent released any details yet though.
http://www.startrek.com/
look for movies.
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Saw a couple of original Trek eps las Friday night (on BBC2 in the UK after 11pm??!!). Just what was Rodenberry thinking with all those garish bright primary colours? Looks like a party in a child's paint box set to me now.
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Quote:Clearly, you missed the sixties, young one.
Originally posted by Cruithne3753:
Saw a couple of original Trek eps las Friday night (on BBC2 in the UK after 11pm??!!). Just what was Rodenberry thinking with all those garish bright primary colours? Looks like a party in a child's paint box set to me now.
Garish Chrisisall
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