Global Warming proven a hoax!

POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 02:11
VIEWED: 11291
PAGE 12 of 13

PREV PAGE 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 NEXT PAGE

RUE

Monday, January 22, 2007 6:50 PM

Fletch,

"What happens to the carbon in this ethanol conversion? Is it captured? Ethanol is a hydrocarbon fuel --- it's made up of both carbon and hydrogen. If you extract the hydrogen what happens to the carbon byproduct and what form is it in?"

The carbon is released as CO2 - but since it comes from plants it doesn't add to the overall carbon load.

FLETCH2

Monday, January 22, 2007 7:14 PM

So the advantage of using a reactor plus a hydrogen fuel cell is system efficiency over just burning the ethonol in a heat engine? In making CO2 in the reactor you are effectively burning carbon and releasing energy, energy that isn't making it to the driving wheels. I'm wondering how this compares with just making an ethanol burning traditional engine.

RUE

Monday, January 22, 2007 7:17 PM

Rap,

"ocean level"
Somehwere in a post a long time ago a person said they would not believe in global warming until the Statue of Liberty was drowning, and maybe not even then. That may be your issue, or someone else's, but not mine.

Since I haven't made that claim I don't feel any need to discuss it.

"many scientists"
As to the post you copied (which I appeciate btw) what I got out of it is that there is a researcher named Roger Pielke Sr. who disagreed with an article in the NYTimes. After reading his post, I'm not sure he disagrees with the concept of global warming in general or with specifics in the article.

RUE

Monday, January 22, 2007 7:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletch2:
So the advantage of using a reactor plus a hydrogen fuel cell is system efficiency over just burning the ethanol in a heat engine?

Higher efficiency. (Ethanol => heat => expansion => mechanical engine motion => transmission => wheels) wastes a lot of energy. With a fuel cell and direct electric drive you eliminate the waste of (heat => => transmission). You can also regenerate electricity during braking. If you insist on a liquid fuel (as I did when I made myself my promise) it's b/c you don't have to rebuild the entire infrastructure to accommodate high pressure hydrogen gas, for example.

AURAPTOR

Monday, January 22, 2007 10:21 PM

This is why I seldom bother with taking the time to post my research. So few times is it even read by those who call for it the most. My 'ocean levels' reply was meant to show that credible scientist have grave reservations as to the science as well as the CONCLUSIONS which support global warming. Point of fact...there are other answers besides man made global warming. At least, for those willing to hear.

As for Roger Pielke Sr, he's taking issue w/ the errors in oversimplifying the evidence, which leads to a misunderstanding of the greater issue. He's not so much a skeptic of man caused global warming, but stresses the complexities in climate change and how those errors can lead to false conclusions.

Per one of the links which seems to have gone overlooked by you, dealing with how temperature readings are represented - " If you have followed World Climate Report over the past few years, you are aware that we have taken countless swings at the “Hockey Stick” depiction of planetary temperature. The “Stick” is popular with the global warming crowd for it wipes out the “Medieval Warm Period” of 1,000 years ago and the “Little Ice Age” that began 450 years ago and thankfully ended around 1900. The “Stick” makes the warming of the 20th century look incredible, disturbing, and completely unmatched over the past 1,000 years. The only explanation for the recent warming must be the dreaded buildup of greenhouse gases. "

So, you see, my remarks about global warming aren't merely " my opinions" , as rue falsely tried to portray earlier.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

FREMDFIRMA

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 12:13 PM

Umm, quick thought for ya.

When you "plug it in" - where does the energy then come from ?

From powerplants, burning petroleum, coal or what have you, unless you're downline from a Nuke or Hydro, you see.

So yer STILL burning petrol-energy, you are just reducing it's efficiency by a significant factor by having it processed somewhere else and then forced down the line to you against the resistance of the circuit.

In the end, you use MORE petrol to power a plug-in than you would using a semi-efficient ordinary, all you do is move the waste and pollution down the line, where there is more of both - does that make you less responsible for it ?

Any "Alternative" that involves using more petrol energy to produce it than it reduces is ludicrous.

We really need to work on our alternatives and think about both issues like this, and stuff like waste/battery turnover, etc etc.

Logistically, for non-time-critical freight, a solar/windpower rail system wouldn't be a half bad idea, with powered assistance at road crossings to clear them.

And yanno, it really WOULD help if someone smacked some sense into the detroit automakers who don't comprehend why their 12mpg supersize SUVs ain't sellin and the Toyota Prius is.

I swear.. THAT particular ivory tower crowd needs a close encounter with a clue-by-four.

-Frem

RUE

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 5:21 PM

Rap,

"World Climate Report" I went to the other two websites you linked. I didn't mention them b/c they are obviously dedicated to an anti-global warming stance. Not only is that bad science (selecting data to fit your conclusions) I couldn't find any cv's on the principals or information on the sources of funding. So I did look at it but didn't find anything valid to reply to.

RUE

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 5:22 PM

Frem,

That's the beauty of what I'm waiting for. The electricity is generated onboard from ethanol. You fill-up like normal.

FLETCH2

Tuesday, January 23, 2007 5:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Umm, quick thought for ya.

When you "plug it in" - where does the energy then come from ?

From powerplants, burning petroleum, coal or what have you, unless you're downline from a Nuke or Hydro, you see.

So yer STILL burning petrol-energy, you are just reducing it's efficiency by a significant factor by having it processed somewhere else and then forced down the line to you against the resistance of the circuit.-Frem

Actually no, that's wrong. Portable heat engines, like the internal combustion engine in cars are VERY inefficient because in order to make the system light enough to be mobile you have to sacrifice efficiency. Even allowing for transmission losses it's much more efficent to burn 100 gallons of fuel in a power plant and distribute the power than it is to burn the same 100 gallons in 100 vehicles. Also, I can elect to buy my power from green sources (like wind farms) there is no way I could strap a windmill to my car. In addition the way internal combustion engines burn fuel creates more problems than a "clean burn" that only outputs CO2 and water. Cars also produce nitros oxides, carbon monoxide and partially burnt hydrocarbons. While some of this is caught by the catalytic converter in a car it's not nearly as clean as the large and heavy filters/scrubbers in a major power plant can manage.

Hybrids are not a perfect solution but it's available now and will be more common and cheaper as time goes on. Currently the biggest problem with fuel cells is polution, not what it produces but the stuff already in the air. Fuel cells used by folks like NASA are closed system, they get both hydrogen and oxygen in pure form from tanks. A vehicle fuel cell would have to be open system and take the oxygen it needs from the air. Unfortunately there is so much rubbish in our air that the cells can be poisoned. The Norwegians have built some pretty big units to supply power for some remote islands. The plant manager for the system was interviewed by the BBC last year and said that the technology had problems in urban centers because of air quality.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, January 24, 2007 1:29 AM

Quote:
I didn't mention them b/c they are obviously dedicated to an anti-global warming stance.

Seems we're back to square one. You dismiss my research out of hand simply because of YOUR opinion, that they are "anti-global warming" . Seems rather specious, don't you think? ANY site that arrives at that conclusion is viewed by you as " anti-global warming ",is guilty of bad science, a priori . I even posted a PRO - global warming scientist who rejects the tactics and methodologies which lead to , in HIS opinion , false conclusions over the matter.

Quote:
I couldn't find any cv's on the principals or information on the sources of funding. So I did look at it but didn't find anything valid to reply to.

So, after ripping me time and time again about me NOT posting any references and accusing me of simply offering my 'opinion', you fail to even comment as to the references I DO post, because you claim they are invalid ?

You and Kent Hovind should set up a DISPROVE Global Warming challenge. Offer up to $ 100,000 to $ 1 Million, or what ever you want. Doesn't matter, because you'll always change the goal post further and further back when ever the evidence doesn't fit your ever changing 'acceptable' sources.

Classic.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

PREV PAGE 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 NEXT PAGE