Now That You've Seen It, Let Everyone Know What You Think!

POSTED BY: Haken
UPDATED: Monday, April 16, 2018 02:39
VIEWED: 22026
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ALTERNITY

Saturday, September 21, 2002 7:51 PM

Hmm.... I think of Buffy as really campy. That's why I like it. I wouldn't like it otherwise.

roj

NOVAGRASS

Saturday, September 21, 2002 8:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Alternity:
Hmm.... I think of Buffy as really campy. That's why I like it. I wouldn't like it otherwise.

roj

Perhaps your definition of camp is different than Zicsoft's.

I personally believe that Buffy's main strength is that it avoids camp while maintaining lightheartedness.

--Dylan Palmer, aka NoVaGrAsS--

"Oh, shoot" - Mal

ZICSOFT

Saturday, September 21, 2002 9:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Novagrass:

I personally believe that Buffy's main strength is that it avoids camp while maintaining lightheartedness.

I agree. I don't necessarily dislike camp. I actually enjoyed the Buffy movie -- sorry Joss -- and also Airplane! (but not the sequel) and Top Secret! and other stuff like that. But that sort of broad self-mocking is completely different from Whedon's more subtle humor.

Here's a more obvious difference: Whedon likes to make you laugh, but he's not a commedian. He's a story-teller. A commedian uses a story to tell jokes, whereas Whedon uses jokes to tell a story.

Oh, here's another example. Anybody seen Zero Effect?

http://castle-rock.warnerbros.com/zeroeffect/

One of my favorite movies. And very funny. But if you call it "camp" -- well, I'll just have to have you killed!

JASONZZZ

Saturday, September 21, 2002 10:02 PM

Andromeda defines camp. Cleo2626 *defines* camp.
Afterawhile, Hercules and Xena also defined camp.

Let's face it. There is Airplane/Naked Gun funny/
There's Three Stooges/Scooby Doo funny.
There's John Cleese/Monty Python funny.
There's Jim Carrey/Dumb-n-Dumber really stupid (I can barely bring myself in saying it) funny.

And then there is campy. Andromeda, Cleo, Hercules, Xena were not even original in campiness, they were the same old tired campiness. Just completely asinine - can't even bring yourself to groan and roll your eyes - because you just can't belief they wasted film doing that - sort of campy. They could have at least innovated on it, Airplane innovated campy and bathroom humor without it being tiresome. They strung the jokes until they know they couldn't get away with it anymore and went on to the next one. Yes, I groaned and moaned at how completely dumb some of the jokes were. But they were smart and innovative (and stupid) jokes. It worked.

Tired, stupid, and dumb camp doesn't. It's beyond
the point of feeling being insulted. It's beyond the point of even knowing that they didn't cared or didn't tried at all. It's beyond the point that you know that the writers are completely tired and didn't really even want to shuffle in to commit something to paper. It's like the entire production just wanted to commit suicide, and yet the writers can't believe people are still watching the same tired stupid crap.

That's what I hate.

That's what really killed me.

CARDIE

Sunday, September 22, 2002 1:55 AM

I was very happy with the first episode. I'm a big fan of westerns, and I'm thrilled to see one on television again, even if it's set in space. Since I'm also a big SF fan, this is heaven for me. The ensemble all did nice takes on very standard character types. I can't wait to see "Serenity" and get all the backstory. My favorite Joss Whedon moment was when the thug in the bar said that Mal's coat looked brown, and Mal said that he got it on sale.

Cardie

"Well, they're saved from the blessings of civilization."--Doc Boone, Stagecoach

SUNTZU

Sunday, September 22, 2002 4:28 AM

I have to say I loved it right from the start.

You could see Joss Whedon’s typical balance of humour and action which makes his other shows so good. The characters are interesting and three dimensional and I quickly became emotionally invested in them.

One exception was Jayne, it may have just been the circumstances he was in, but he acted like a jerk in a lot of his scenes. Although I loved his line about the “Chain of Command”

Anyways, I like this show and I only hope more people watch it so it stays on the air. I’m certainly going to recommend it to my friends and I hope everyone else does too.

QUEENTIYE

Sunday, September 22, 2002 11:56 AM

This was a pretty good ep - I especially want to know more about the companion. So far I like the female characters and feel mostly neutral about the males.

QT

FASTAL

Monday, September 23, 2002 2:01 AM

I haven't been this dissappointed since the last Star Trek first episode. The characters are all so one dimensional and in a role it is sickening. I will leave the season pass on my TiVO for now because as far as I'm concerned Firefly can only get better since it has started out so poorly.

MILLERNATE

Monday, September 23, 2002 4:17 AM

I still haven't commented on the actual episode yet! I must be slipping in my old age (I can remember when The Simpsons were on the Tracy Ulman show...does that make me old?).

Any way the mostly non-spoilery thoughts (and those that are include the relevent tag):

The Good:

The FX looked good, which is a good thing after having heard about various delays from the company. The Serenity itself looked excellent.

Adam Baldwin. While there wasn't a high total of bad acting, most of the performers in question ranged from "alright" (Alan Tudyk couldn't hope to be better give his sad lack of screen time) to "above average" (Nathan Fillion as the captain). Baldwin, however, was freaking great. From the

Select to view spoiler:

Chain of command

line to

Select to view spoiler:

any scene were he was doped up

he was absolutely great. Even if I didn't like the show I'd still watch to see what the actor could do with the role (and I do like the show).

I very much enjoyed the last half of the show as things started to go far more right as well. I'd go into specifics but I don't want to use that much spoiler space.

Things I didn't Like:

This show really didn't seem to have a lot of depth. Even the worst episodes of Buffy (well, up until the current year anyway) usually had some sort of message or subtext underneath things that made it worthwhile. I didn't see anything of that nature in Firefly and I watched the episode in question twice.

Lack of screentime for Ron Glass. You have an Emmy nominated actor and you don't give him screentime? Yeah I'm biased but I'm not the NY Times, I'm allowed to be biased

.

Fox not having the guts to show the pilot as is. Better to have a slow akward start where we get to know the characters (even if Mike Duffy from the Detroit Free Press said the original pilot was murky and confusing) then to go in blind.

THe opening theme: I didn't hate it, and it could be my TV, but something about the lyrics didn't really come through right and I ended up with the feeling that I was missing words.

The feel of the episode itself. Do to the negative buzz this episode BADLY needed to blow everyones socks off to get them set for more (aka the 24 philosophy) and it didn't. It wasn't bad but when compared to the first 2 episodes of Buffy (WTTH/TH and THe Witch) you really get a sense of just being there.

All in All: A 3.5 out of 5. Solid but it will have to get better than this if it hopes to keep my support (and even to survive period). It go into week 2 of my standard "4 week trial period" with my mind not yet made up.

Nathan
"It looks like a great adventure...That's what it is; that's what it feels like. When I saw the pilot, it was really engaging. It was exciting. It was unusual. It threw me off every now and then. I think people will be grabbed by it." - Ron Glass, on the pilot, during an interview with the Indianapolis Star

MALCOLM

Monday, September 23, 2002 6:01 AM

Having seen the pilot, it was a crime not to show it first.

You learn about the Alliance and the war.

You discover why everyone is on the ship.

You learn about River's past.

Fox was afraid of having the story unfold in the same way that a movie does. Pussies.

Wait until you see Minear's episode (#2). It rocks in a scary Alien-like way.

Keep watching...

P.S. 24 just won an Emmy for writing... WRITING! Directing? maybe. Acting? maybe. Writing?????? Must stop being an idealist....

-MBS

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