What are your *least* favorite Firefly moments?
POSTED BY: Okkay
UPDATED: Saturday, February 14, 2004 16:39
VIEWED: 28282
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My least favoite part of FF?
There is only one but it sticks out preety badly. In the pilot when Mal tells Simon that Kaylee is dead and the next scene shows the rest of the crew laughing hysterically. It wouldn't go down like that. It was too mean spirited a "joke"for souls like Wash and Zoe to get so giggly about. I have never felt comfortable with that
She understands, she doesn't comprehend
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Quote:
Originally posted by WildHeavenFarm:
The moment that sticks in my brain as irksome is in "Trash" when WhatsHisFace catches Mal and Saffron/Yolanda, is overjoyed, and offers Mal a reward. Had I been him, I would have taken the reward and left the two of them in peace. The pay-off would have been less, but so would the risk.
Now, I may come back later and curse aloud another moment, as my dvd player has yet to allow me to watch "Heart of Gold" and it seems to have raised some ire.
Mary
Always a beast, never a burden.
I think you're underestimating the difference in values of the two payoffs. The Lassiter was a priceless artifact, worth millions, while the reward would have been maybe a couple thousand dollars? I'm guessing at those values since I don't know how money works there, but the difference was probably something like a-thousand-fold. Plus his whole crew helped out on the heist, and they wouldn't have been happy doing all that for just pocket change. Besides, I don't think Haymer was planning on giving him the money, he called the police right when he saw them.
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The only thing that bugs me is the use of present day weapons. 500 years in the future and they still use .45's? I wouldn't think that it would have cost too much to fancify the weapons like they did with Mals.
Think of it this way... there are guns EVERYWHERE in the here and now. Yet some of the greatest genocide of the last century took place in Africa and was perpetuated with the machete of all things.
It's a trickle down world. Old weapons, unfortunately, don't magically disappear when a new one comes along. Some become collector's items. Some get used to survive and are handed down for the newer fancier weapons are unaffordable. It's all part of accepting that (in Firefly's view) a class system with more have-nots than haves could very easily exist 500 years in the future.
The only episode I have trouble with (actually just parts of it) is 'Safe'. I found the actors playing the nurse and the 'mayor' in the town of hill zealots to be a little wooden in their acting. Nothing takes me out of the moment like bad acting. You have to use exceptional actors to pull of zealotry because they have to forget how to be smart while playing such ignorant characters. Some actors have trouble with this subtle nuance.
Other than that I'm pretty happy with the show and didn't notice or wasn't bothered by most of the things detailed in this thread.
That said..
I am upset that we aren't presently enjoying February sweeps editions of Firefly's second season.
I am upset because I do not know what the inside of a Reaver ship looks like (and how these lawless loonies have enough structure to keep a space ship going).
I am upset that I didn't get to see Mal's first face-to-face encounter with the Blue Hands and see how he escapes that situation.
I am bummed I haven't witnessed the further redemption of Jayne nor have I learned more about Book's past.
It upsets me that I know not more about the enigmatic River who is possibly the toughest and most dangerous member of the crew.
I doubt all of this will be addressed in a two hour movie, but I am hopeful!
mattro
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Quote:
Originally posted by meleaux:
My least favoite part of FF?
There is only one but it sticks out preety badly. In the pilot when Mal tells Simon that Kaylee is dead and the next scene shows the rest of the crew laughing hysterically. It wouldn't go down like that. It was too mean spirited a "joke"for souls like Wash and Zoe to get so giggly about. I have never felt comfortable with that.
Actually, I was shocked the first time I saw the show and Mal told Simon Kaylee was dead. I thought to myself "Wow. That was a fast character death, even for Joss". Then when we see Mal and group laughing, I could not help but laugh.
I guess this was an example of "screw w/ the new guy". I think every group in one shape or form has played pranks on the newest member. I think Mal did this as well to put a scare into Simon. In groups as tight knit as the crew of Serenity I am sure they do not find the joke disturbing at all.
"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."
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There are some easy to understand reasons for the different historical firearms.
If you knew you were going to be a firefight and were offered a winchester, an M-16 and whatever plasma rifle arnold requests in the first terminator movie, you might think the plasma rifle is the best choice. But consider: 1) Where are you going to get ammo/power cells for it? 2) How are you going to get it repaired if it breaks? Colonists are going to want a weapon that can be repaired and 'reloaded' with local technology. Depending upon the technological development you will have different weapons available on different worlds. People that travel between them will probably want a range so that no matter what world they are on they will have weapons that can be fixed and ammunition be purchased (or manufactured) there.
The hi-tech alliance weapons also have severe limitations. Seems like they don't kill, nor do they open doors 
. I assume that they need hi-tech gear to repair as well.
I also think, given the nature of the alliance, that ownership of most weapons is illegal or highly restricted. If there are bans on manufacture of civilian or lethal firearms, there will be a good black market trade in older weapons.
I separate least favorite as in disturbing from least favorite as in bad quality. My least favorite disturbing moment is Jubal's threat to Kaylee. Not because I think it was over the top, unecessary or anything, but because I like Kaylee's character and her innocence. Jubal's comment is disturbing, though in character.
My least favorite moment in terms of badness is... I guess I haven't made my mind up on that one.
Arawaen
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Quote:
Originally posted by meleaux:
My least favoite part of FF?
There is only one but it sticks out preety badly. In the pilot when Mal tells Simon that Kaylee is dead and the next scene shows the rest of the crew laughing hysterically. It wouldn't go down like that. It was too mean spirited a "joke"for souls like Wash and Zoe to get so giggly about. I have never felt comfortable with that.
You feel about Wash very differently than I do. I saw Serenity as a character-building episode, so I expect Wash to act like this. Later on Jayne says, "Why don't we shoot her first?" and Wash replies, "It is her turn".
Maybe this mindset helps: At this point in the story, Simon is the heartless bastard that nearly let Kaylee die. He is very worthy of some mean-spirited ribbing.
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Great thread. Love that responses are divided between "worst moment = bad writing" or "worst moment = scene that upset me," both valid takes on the question. My thoughts on much of what's been said:
Fortunatus' plot point about Our Mrs. R is a good one -- if Saffron sent the ship, her colleagues should've known it was worth frying.
On the Inara bathing scene ... I'll take what I can get of that and be happy with it.
On Jubal's threat to Kaylee: Oh, it was SO creepy, and this show had a history of sudden violence (or threat of, thankfully, here) that would shock me, make me say, "They don't DO that on TV." I accept this scene on that ground, and the scene's effectiveness and story logic were best expressed above by Ariya.
Also, it establishes Jubal as not just a brilliant bounty hunter, but a demented and wicked man.
I'm glad, as a fan, that Mal didn't let Jayne get sucked outta that airlock, but it would've been a better ep if he had. I loved the show for making me think, with its sudden bursts of real, cold violence, that Jayne's death was a very real possibility, not just fake TV drama.
I accepted Mal's sick "Kaylee's Dead" joke as the work of someone who has seen a lot of war, death and evil, and who has been affected by it. Soldiers, paramedics, firefighters, even news reporters can be stunningly cavalier about issues of death and worse, because they're numbed to them, or because to feel it all would just overwhelm them.
"Bang."
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To me, the biggest issue on this thread is Mal keeping secrets from Tracey (most interesting was the Jubal/Kaylee stuff). Mal does this kinda thing other times on the show. I fully agree with the general lines of reasoning defending (he's the gorram captain!) or explaining (he's so internalized!) why he does it, but there's another issue: It's a writing device.
The writers here created a bigger, more dramatic problem when, as some posters have suggested, anyone who cared about having no one on his crew getting shot would've tried to talk Tracey down by sharing the plan, if he had one, or by lying, sweet-talking, whatever. Then punch him out when he lowers the gun.
Writers use this device because they need something to propel the plot. Sometimes, it fits the story perfectly. Other times, you can see that it's a lame excuse, illogical, a crutch to keep the story moving forward. Might be worth debating which is the case in this story. Me, while I FULLY see everyone's reasoning for Mal's behavior, I think it was a case of the writers being kinda lazy, when a better solution was called for, and it qualifies as my least-fave moment.
Only barely -- I don't have THAT big a problem with the scene, but something's gotta be worst. And Nandi's death comes close, as another case of "Oh, the plot demanded this, it's the easy resolution to the brief Mal/Nandi/Inara triangle.
When I first watched "Heart of Gold," I actually felt disloyal for not liking it very much, for all the reasons y'all have given above.
Anyone notice how the worst moments/eps of this show are better than the best on most others?
"Bang."
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Quote:
Originally posted by SpikeSpiegel:
To me, the biggest issue on this thread is Mal keeping secrets from Tracey (most interesting was the Jubal/Kaylee stuff). Mal does this kinda thing other times on the show. I fully agree with the general lines of reasoning defending (he's the gorram captain!) or explaining (he's so internalized!) why he does it, but there's another issue: It's a writing device.
The writers here created a bigger, more dramatic problem when, as some posters have suggested, anyone who cared about having no one on his crew getting shot would've tried to talk Tracey down by sharing the plan, if he had one, or by lying, sweet-talking, whatever. Then punch him out when he lowers the gun.
Writers use this device because they need something to propel the plot. Sometimes, it fits the story perfectly. Other times, you can see that it's a lame excuse, illogical, a crutch to keep the story moving forward. Might be worth debating which is the case in this story. Me, while I FULLY see everyone's reasoning for Mal's behavior, I think it was a case of the writers being kinda lazy, when a better solution was called for, and it qualifies as my least-fave moment.
Only barely -- I don't have THAT big a problem with the scene, but something's gotta be worst. And Nandi's death comes close, as another case of "Oh, the plot demanded this, it's the easy resolution to the brief Mal/Nandi/Inara triangle.
When I first watched "Heart of Gold," I actually felt disloyal for not liking it very much, for all the reasons y'all have given above.
Anyone notice how the worst moments/eps of this show are better than the best on most others?
"Bang."
That pretty much sums up my thoughts on this topic, what I was trying to say although I didn't say it very well. Yes, there can be justifications for why Mal did what he did, but to me, it just felt like a contrived conflict used only to further the plot.
And I agree that the worst moments on this show are better than the best on most others. None of these "least favorite moments" in any way diminishes my respect and utter fascination for everything they've done on this show.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ankhagogo:
I'll tell you one thing that bothers me, though, about Trash -- why, oh why, didn't Mal just leave her in the house for the Feds to snatch?
Because she hadn't betrayed him/them at that point. "Man of honor in a den of thieves", remember?
RIVER
Purple elephants are flying.
MAL
Good. Thanks for the update.
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