What are your *least* favorite Firefly moments?
POSTED BY: Okkay
UPDATED: Saturday, February 14, 2004 16:39
VIEWED: 28282
PAGE 5 of 13
My least favorite moment in Firefly.....I had to sit and think on this for a while.^^ I know that many Jayne fans are going to hate me for this, but my least favorite moment on the show is when Mal didn't let him get sucked out of the ship in 'Ariel'. Gorram traitor. I don't know how he can say Simon and River don't belong on Serenity and continue to be so hard on them after that.
"Two by two, hands of blue." -River Tam
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steve580:Also, in Heart of Gold. The whole epsiode.
Ditto.
And I loves Firefly with a POWERFUL strong love.
Heart of Gold was "imitation Firefly" for me. I hate to say it, but yeah... that one just struck me wrong.
Just a few reasons:
- Bad guy was one dimensional bad. No layers, nuthin'. Just Mr. Evil Bully Guy. Generic black hat meanie designed so that we don't feel bad when he gets shot. *Yawn* and... yuck.
- After all the times that Mal has risked his life and gone through hell to keep his crew safe and keep flying... he risks EVERYTHING on a feud that doesn't concern him?! So he gets fully involved just because Nandi is hot and independent (like him) and Inara's friend? Sheesh... sorry, I don't buy it. Life is too hard in the black, you take better care of you and yours. Plus, just because they put down one skirmish doesn't mean something just as bad won't happen after they break orbit.
- The 'Western talk' in this episode was heavy and right outta a B movie Western. Much more exaggerated and unrealistic compared to other Firefly episodes.
- Biggest, clunkiest, plot arc device was dropped, with a thud, between Zoe and Wash. All of a sudden, she wants to have a baby?! Wash agues the point of reason that their lives are too dangerous to bring a baby into their world. Zoe disagrees. Of course this whole conversation is happening while they're preparing for a big, messy gun battle... Uh, can you say dangerous, hello? If this was a hint of where they were going to go with Zoe and Wash, I'm glad it got interrupted.
- The writing was like it came from someone who heard about Firefly second hand, and took a try at it. The crew was acting like loose, one dimensional sketches of themselves. Jayne was just a running joke about getting laid and being a tough guy. Book kept being accompanied by a couple of whore groupies, to whom he offered cliche platitudes. Simon did doctor duties for the oft seen woman having a baby in hard circumstances stuff... and, River watched. Kaylee had a few interesting lines, but not much else. She did save Wash from being shot, and landed on top of him in the process... which made me wonder...
Speaking of that:
- Isn't there any way to lock up Serenity when they park her? How the hell did they let a group of scrappy cowboys get on board so they could get the jump on Wash and Kaylee? Sloppy...
Heart of Gold confused me. It just didn't 'feel' right. Not a total loss, things could have been done to improve it. Mostly the episode seemed to be servicing the need to start an ongoing conflict between Zoe and Wash, which didn't involve Mal. And it also served to prompt the plot arc involving Inara's decision to leave the ship. Which of course is a reflection of her relationship with Mal. The story was just so flawed, in many ways, and seemed forced.
Mostly, I just love Firefly like crazy. It's when you care, that if something strikes you wrong, you speak up. Just my opinion.
11thHour
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"Doing the impossible makes us mighty." - Malcolm Reynolds
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ariya:
As for an explanation, Jubal handled each person on the ship differently (as was mentioned above and in the commentary). Kaylee's character was based in her sensuality, her innocence, and her passion.
Ariya
When I first saw this episode, and he asked that question, I admit, my immediate reaction was "WHOA. . .hold up. . .calm down. . .what were the writers thinking?"
Then I watched it again. . .and again. . .and thought about it some more. . .and I tried to imagine what Early was 'all about'. What WOULD you threaten Kaylee with?
"Have you ever been shot, Kaylee?"
"Well. . .yeah."
"Have you ever been smacked around?"
Probably
"Ooooooooooookay. . .so I guess in order to completely terrify you into utter compliance, I'm going to have to threaten you with the only extremely violent act you haven't experienced. . .or if you HAVE experienced it, I'm under the understanding that it's not something that gets 'less terrible' if it occurs more than once (Not being a person who has ever been subjected to a rape, I would never dare suggest that I could even imagine what it is like)."
Was it extreme? Yes.
Was it over-the-top? Definitely.
Do you think Joss could have come up with a BETTER way to give us a glimpse RIGHT OFF THE BAT of what a deeply EVIL and BRUTAL man our potentially recurring villain is? I doubt it.
What REALLY pisses me off is that the censors would have jumped all over it. . .while at the same time, allowing us to watch people eat pureed GOAT PENIS on "Suck Factor". . .er, I mean "Fear Factor."
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Why will the censors let me watch people eat pureed goat penis, but they won't let me see Inara's nipple?
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>>The only thing that bugs me is the use of present day weapons. 500 years in the future and they still use .45's? I wouldn't think that it would have cost too much to fancify the weapons like they did with Mals.<<
But why ?
The Colt peacemaker is as effective, now, as it ever was.
Even better, the Colt M1911 .45 auto - it's been in service since 1911, unchanged in design or construction and the basic design of it has been retained and copied endlessly - form follows function.
I ain't *ever* parting with mine, it's simple, reliable, easy to maintains and puts big nasty holes in whatever you shoot with it.
Like a toothpick, once you've achieved perfection of design, any messing with it just screws it up.
They'll be around for 500 years and more, don't you doubt it.
As for Early and Kaylee ?
He didn't just want compliance, he wanted to mentally and emotionally CRUSH her to the point where she would not in any way, ever even conceive of defying him... in the same way that he physically beat Book senseless, he emotionally beat Kaylee senseless - he did so because he enjoyed it (he's a sadist) and it was quiet.
And point being, without River's interferance - it would have worked.
Tracy ?
Tracy was already dead.
Ok, lemme sum this up for those of less criminal bent, ok?
There would be no profit in putting his original organs on ice and then putting them back in - thus it wasn't ever going to happen.
He would NEVER have been waking up with his own stuff back in, cause he would never have been waking up, see ?
A - No expense of preserving and reinstalling his organs
B - No having to pay the sodder.
C - No Witness.
No, even if by some wild chance they WERE that nice, they'd have ditched Tracey's organs once he sold em out, and what kind of MORON is Tracey in trying to sell that stuff to someone who did not have his original guts to put back in ?
Simon hinted that leaving those organs in Tracey indefinately wasn't survivable either, thus, he was a dead man from the very beginning of this scheme - just a matter of time.
Don't think I'd feel too bad about blowing him away myself, given the situation.
The hovercraft in heart of gold ?
That was ultramodern... how ?
Ever been to Florida, and seen those fan-powered skiffs ?
They DO have hovercraft on similar designs, even now.... I dunno how fast they are tho.
I did think the CGI on it wasn't too hot, tho.
-frem
diefuxdie
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Gorram doubleposts...
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[QUOTE
The Message has to be my favorite episode of all and here’s why this scene worked for me.
When Tracey first came in and Book and Mal were talking, they didn’t have the plan all talked out to every last detail. Both being men with obvious leadership training and military knowledge they didn’t have to spell out exactly what they were thinking, the other man just caught on. When Tracey turned a gun on our crew Book stepped forward and tried to explain the plan, but the gun was quickly turned on him and he was told to “shut it”. Now it doesn’t matter what anyone might have said. Tracey wouldn’t believe it. It would of all been an excuse, a lie, to get Kaylee back before he was handed over to the feds and killed for those fancy organs he was carrying.
Since Tracey was willing to lie and put Serenity and her crew in danger, it seems fitting that he would believe them capable of doing the same to him.
The part I found most interesting, was the very concept that certain organs could only be transported in a body so-to-speak, keeping Tracy alive. But Tracy's organs could be shipped ahead via some 25th century UPS ... it just didn't make sense.
ABOVE ALL ELSE: KYFHO!
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11thhour- I thought your comments on Heart of Gold were very good. So far I have only watched that epi once and it bugged me too. Ill still watch it again...after all...its all we got :(
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Quote:
Originally posted by Static:
Do you think Joss could have come up with a BETTER way to give us a glimpse RIGHT OFF THE BAT of what a deeply EVIL and BRUTAL man our potentially recurring villain is? I doubt it.
I wasn't going to post on this thread. All of the least favourite moments are simply glazed over in magical memory fog.
But Early is an interesting point. What he says was designed to bring forth emotion from the viewer. Hopefully directed at the character and not the writer. There are worse things than threatening rape and I'm sure those cop / ambulance / lawyer shows go into them all.
As a side point, I was also moved to discomfort by the "on your knees" scene in Heart of Gold but nobody brings that up.
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My least favorite moments: the torture scenes in "War Stories", especially when Mal's ear is cut off. That whole episode is my least favorite. It's totally dark and disturbed in a way no other episode, not even "The Message", is. There is little humor and what there is falls flat for the most part. I find the whole episode hard to watch.
The scene with Early threatening to rape Kaylee BOTHERED me the first time I saw it, but that is one subject that I am definitely overly sensitive about. In retrospect, it does fit Early's character and does show him, to quote someone earlier in the thread, as "one sick bastard".
"Heart of Gold" is a weak link, I agree. It still doesn't bother me nearly as much as "War Stories".
"Hamsters is nice"
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Quote:
Originally posted by Saint Jayne:
[BAs a side point, I was also moved to discomfort by the "on your knees" scene in Heart of Gold but nobody brings that up.
Yeah, me too - I don't know why it doesn't get mentioned in discussions about the reactions to Jubal Early - maybe it's an indication that most people (like me) didn't like the HoG episode and so didn't have that much of a reaction to that situation.
Also, Jubal Early, for all that he's insane, is charismatic so it is more disturbing to see him act this way - plus it was Kaylee and that'll always gets people's blood boiling!
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"I think the right place to start is to say, fair is fair. This is who we are. These are our numbers." Mr Willis of Ohio - The West Wing
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