stupid, evil, and corrupt
POSTED BY: rue
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 25, 2026 22:34
VIEWED: 5904
PAGE 11 of 13
Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Sitting here waiting for a search to end, so I can set up the next one and go home.
I really don't know how you all have the patience to debate ass-wipe.
"war crimes? Now that's funny. Realy, it is." Ass-wipe minimizes, rationalizes, condones, - supports evil. Rape, beating, murder - torture - ? No problem. Fascist control? Never happened. Bush breaking the law? By definition, he IS the law.
Every day every one of us draws a line as to where we will accept evil. If you don't stand against it - then you are for it. And ass-wipe, zero and slick have thrown in with evil and sold their souls for peanuts.
Got my new search set up. Time to boogie.
Rue - Very soon I'm going to stop responding to you at all, dick head. At least until you figure out how to have a civil conversation. Probably too late that now anwyays. But if this is the last post I have for you, let me be abundantly clear.
I don't condone 'rape, torture ', and what ever bullshit you claim. You obviously have the US forces confused w/ those of the U.N. Yeah, those fucks are the ones doing the WIDESPREAD raping and murdering in Africa,all in the name of 'peace'. Not so w/ the US forces under Bush. Fact is, where a very few have acted in a criminal manner, they get nailed for it. And rightfully so. Some might even get the death penalty. That's not 'whole sale condoing' of your precious 'war crimes', so stuff it.
Most of the nonsense we were told about as 'torture' was nothing more than fraternity hazing. Wooo...barking dogs and nekkid pyramids. Boo fucking hoo. You want real torture? Try Saddam's goons lobbing off ears, fingers or whole hands. Try victims being fed into industrial shredders..feet first, so as to maximize the amount of suffering they endured before they died. Try being bloodied and beaten, then having a pack of hungry dogs let loose to devour the prisoner alive. NONE of that shit went on under the worse case scenarios w/ the US forces,and it pisses me off that you'd casually lie so much about that stuff, just to vilify Bush. Don't even fucking start on any of that bullshit about torture until you've admitted who REALLY did the torture in the Iraqi prisions. It sure as hell wasn't Bush. And same goes for Gitmo. Those murdering bastards who got a trip down to that tropical paradise never had it so damn good. (Remember the phony 'Quran's being flushed down the toilet stories? ) Spare me the Amnisty International b.s. and their bogus claims. Where were they when UN soldiers were / and still ARE , raping women in Africa? What about the conditions in China, N.Korea, or in a dozen other places through out the world where people who haven't vowed to murder innocent people are being treated much worse. I'm really fucking sick and tired of hearing how those who want to murder innocent Americans or Westerners are really the victims here. They're lucky they're still ALIVE, to be honest. I'm a bit surprised we didn't let some of those al Qaeda monsters go night swimming in some shark infested waters. Would serve them right.
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Auraptor,
We're skating very thin ice here, and I need to make a point very clear, I hope you understand what I'm getting at, it's a subtle distinction, and I wish I was better at being terse about it.
Quote:
Yeah, those fucks are the ones doing the WIDESPREAD raping and murdering in Africa,all in the name of 'peace'. Not so w/ the US forces under Bush. Fact is, where a very few have acted in a criminal manner, they get nailed for it. And rightfully so.
Absolutely correct. No argument here, I think this is very true.
Quote:
And same goes for Gitmo. Those murdering bastards who got a trip down to that tropical paradise never had it so damn good.
I think this is going too far. I think Rue goes too far in the other direction.
What the US is doing officially, is out of line. What people under the US command are sometimes doing, unofficially, and not under order of Bush et al, but because of the lack of proper screening and leadership, is way the f^&k out of line. I think the army is going to end up shooting it's own guys over haditha, and it's probably right to do so.
You might be thinking "back in Saddam land, guys who did that sort of thing got thown a party" ... which is probably true. But the thing is, this is not the basis by which we define ourselves. "better than saddam hussein" in not only not good enough, it's not even a valid measuring stick. The evil of our enemy should not be taken into consideration when considering what is acceptable for the US to do.
In WWII, on of the key differences between the US and the USSR was that the soviets define proper behavior as "not as bad as the Nazis" whereas we defined it on an absolute scale, such as "how would we want to be treated?"
Right now, we're crossing a line from which there may be no coming back. We decide so far is acceptable, and maybe a little bit further, and then we aren't who we used to be. Wake up, one day in twenty years, and we'll be Saddam Hussein. This concerns me a great deal more than Al Qaeda, who, objectively, I think is a major nuissance on the world scene, but not a great deal more important than that.
I remember the confession of two british soldiers that made the UK news a while back. The two had taken pictures of the off-base torture they had been conducting on Iraqis. These guys had done their stuff outside the base because their commanders would have kicked their asses for what they were doing. They were picking up kids and slowly mutilating them until they died. Sometimes they'd chuck them in the river before they died and some probably survived, and told their families. They'd do things like blow off the boys dicks with shotguns.
A few guys like this are like a big billboard for the insurency. Don't you think? I know that when I talk to my friends here some of them get all riled up to go sign up because they hear some story about some guy setting his sister on fire because she committed adultery or something over in the ME somewhere. Picture what would happen if an iraqi came to their town and raped their daughter and cut their son into 20 pieces. Just one incident like that, we'd have a f^&king crusade.
Pretty soon the endless cycle of retribution takes over and we have no idea who we used to be. I agree, Americans aren't as bad as we're being painted, but we've definitely crossed a line and need to take a step back and take a good look at ourselves, or one day, not too far away, what they're saying today, won't even begin to describe our sins.
Btw, if you don't believe me, go and read about germany in the 1920s. It's a lot like here today. Add a sense of conviction that we're doing the right thing, that we need to do this, and about ten or twenty years.
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Quote:
Btw, if you don't believe me, go and read about germany in the 1920s. It's a lot like here today. Add a sense of conviction that we're doing the right thing, that we need to do this, and about ten or twenty years.
There's very little, if anything, remotely in common w/ that time period of Germany and the modern USA. Not politically, not economically, not anywhere.
And I'm far less concerned w/ what we MIGHT turn into than what we're doing now. People in that part of the world understand force more than anything. If you hold back and show any signs of weakness, they'll pick up on that. It's been reported time and time again from the troops who are over there. How many choose to listen is another story. Quite frankly, I don't buy this ' we'll become no better than they are ' nonsense. That's nothing but a load of psychobabble horseshit. Wars run even in the BEST of circumstances are far uglier than most of us would ever imagine.
And that's what this is. A war.
Also, there's the other side of all this that ISN'T getting reported. That's the good things we're doing over there. Building of roads, wells, hospitals, power plants, schools.... there's a list a mile long of things good we've done over there, and it NEVER finds its way on the network news. Geee, ever wonder why?
Anyway, I think I've had quite enough of this thread.
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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DT ?
Right-wingies, as in Right Wingnuts, emphasis on nuts.
I don't have a very good description of em other than the fact that they scorn critical thought (See Comments like: no matter what your liberal arts professor thinks) and positively revere ignorance - yet spout off as if they have a pipeline straight to god, and often think they do, usually via Limbaugh, Hannity or Faux News.
They come on with a nice, reasonable sounding front that's based on complete fabrications and fallacies and then when people point that out go straight from sounding reasonable, to snarling pitbull because you dared do something other than meekly agree.
On two or more occasions i've done a little chain-yanking to bring this fact into clear focus so that folks realize what they're dealing with here.
I'll also note that PN does the same thing (cep't that he skips the nice front part), I suppose we'd call him a Left-wingie, by that same scale.
Basically it's a slagging term used on someone who has taken a political position to such an extreme end of the scale that it becomes a mockable parody.
As for the rest - lest you forget, imma Anarchist, and the terms liberal and conservative have become so slurred and completely distorted they make no sense anymore as descriptions and have fallen to use soley as political labels and slams.
I am no friend of Clintons little smiling liars clan any more than Bush's little elite club, neither one offers a damned thing I am interested in, which is essentially a free, or at least more free country and be-damned to safe, there's no such thing in a free country, you can minimize risks, but they're still there - and I think a monstrous resource eating engine of destruction more often than not against it's own citizens (i.e. our current FedGov) is a piss-poor entity to be depending on for our safety OR our freedom.
I want the FedGov out of my damn business, out of my damn pocketbook, out of my gun cabinet and most especially out of my LIFE, they're an uninvited guest with no legal right to be there, and the only politician currently with enough skill and experience to play in the big leagues who has any sympathy at all for my position is Ron.
Clear enough ?
-Frem
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"AUraptor"
I wasn't posting to you but I will reply.
All I get out of this is that you support torture.
This is how it works: when you say "NO, BUT" you are explaining your "YES".
It's one of those weird circumstances that really are black or white. If you don't oppose torture under ANY circumstance, then you support it under some, which means YOU SUPPORT TORTURE.
BTW - you claim to want a "civil conversation". I propose this. I will be civil IF you will actually converse. Though I have not a lot of hope for you as you seem to not understand what a conversation is. You post, then refuse to discuss. It's a pattern that goes back YEARS. Makes you kinda trollish. 
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Quote:If you think asking you to back up what your saying is being difficult I think that says more about you than me.
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Citizen,
You really just try to be difficult don't you?
Quote:Yes, But I don't see how the relationships are any different to that of Bees and Flowers. So who does the domesticating there, the bees or the flowers?
Ants domesticate other insects, they don't just have pre-existing symbiotic relationships. I do understand the difference. We didn't domesticate the bacteria in our stomach. Ants actually trap and enslave other insects, much as humans do. But it makes me wonder, do you ever read science at all? I think this is pretty common knowledge.
But one condescending remark deserves another: did you ever study a science, any science? I was always taught that one should attempt to back up one's statements, perhaps they teach things differently where your from?
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"AUraptor"
I wasn't posting to you but I will reply.
All I get out of this is that you support torture.
This is how it works: when you say "NO, BUT" you are explaining your "YES".
It's one of those weird circumstances that really are black or white. If you don't oppose torture under ANY circumstance, then you support it under some, which means YOU SUPPORT TORTURE.
BTW - you claim to want a "civil conversation". I propose this. I will be civil IF you will actually converse. Though I have not a lot of hope for you as you seem to not understand what a conversation is. You post, then refuse to discuss. It's a pattern that goes back YEARS. Makes you kinda trollish.
Dismissing your irrelevent 'trollish' comments, I'll give this a go.
It seems we disagree on just what IS torture. You might think that anything which causes a captive individual discomfort is 'torture'. I don't. Also, you seem to be ignoring just WHO IT IS that is being held captive. Think more in the lines of al Zarqawi, who sawed off heads of innocent men and women and less Ahkmed the simple shop keeper, or Mohammad, the goat herder. The whole POINT of agressive questioning isn't to inflict pain, like Saddam did, but to get ANSWERS! Answers that will keep our soldiers safer, answers that will stop suicide bombers from blowing up entire market places full of civilians, answers that will lead to the capture of known terrorist.
So, by your definition, yes. I do support torture. If it keeps 10, 50 or 100 + men , women and children from being blown up, not just yes, but hell yes! Every single time. Doesn't matter if those men, women and children are Iraqi, American, British, Spanish or Russian. Any day we stop a terrorist is a good day. How we do it is of little consequence to me.
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Torture is raping women, adolescent boys and little girls. Torture is hanging a man up, beating him on the backs of his knees for 18 hours, and leaving him to internally bleed to death in his cell. Torture is wrapping up an old man in a sleeping bag and kicking him to death.
Is THAT what you support?
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Frem
Not wingnuts. The left has started misusing this term. Wingnuts was a self-applied term for people so far to the right that they thought that the federal reserve was a threat, and that the republicans spend too much money, and take too many liberties with our civil liberties. The wing nuts are people like Ron Paul, Pat Buchanan and Larry Craig. At least, originally. I'm afraid the left's use of it will kill the term, and we'll revert to something else. I think the latest term is paleocon.
A lot of my recent post was pretty close to the language John McCain used recently, including the we-become-our-enemy stuff. I think McCain is closer to Bush than I'd like, but I agree with him on a lot of stuff. This isn't a far out position, but as you can see, there's a great divide over here on the right. I'd put myself in the wingnut camp, but not in the neocon camp. Neocons are misguided at best, and at worst, "the enemy within" to quote sherry boehlert.
Limbaugh isn't a wingnut, he's a hired gun. Any careful examination of Limbaugh shows he has almost no political positions whatsoever. He backs the line his contributors pay for. I think if you gave limbaugh enough money, he'd support gay marriage. If it was *enough* money, he'd marry a gay guy. Once in the distance past, limbaugh was probably a wingnut, but now he's a whore.
Hannity I haven't figured out, but I'm afraid he's on the same track. Ideology is replaced with rhetoric, rhetoric is replaced with talking points, talking points are replaced with advertisments.
PN isn't particularly left or right wing. Try him on Clinton some time. Clinton doesn't get as much abuse because he's not currently the idiot in chief, but come back in two years and folks will be grilling hillary alive, and pn will be leading the parade. I'm sure she's an MKUltra Moloch-worshiping drinker of childrens blood fascist femi-Nazi. I probably should have thrown jew in there somewhere.
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Citizen
Horticulture is not domestication. read up on some ants, you'll get it.
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