A question for those of you who support Israel....
POSTED BY: STDOUBT
UPDATED: Sunday, March 8, 2026 23:09
VIEWED: 8531
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Quote:Then I'm claiming a right to global domination, by your reconing. Sorry, but political parties don't have their own standing army, independent of the country's actual army, and funded primarily by other Gov'ts.
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Auraptor
I don't accept the definition of Hezbollah as a terrorist organization. I think it's a political party. Anytime we can call a political party in another country a terrorist organization we are claiming a right to global domination. What's to stop us from defining Sinn Fein the same way? And then what? The LibDems? This is insane, and it has to stop yesterday.
Quote:Where is your evidence that Israel wants to own Syria and Lebanon? If that IS the case, why did they retreat from Lebanon, and why did it take an overtly hostile act for Israel to strike back ? Why are they already talking cease fire , if their intent wasn't only to destroy Hezbollah?
Hamas and Hezbollah are people with whom I have some disagreements, but that's really not what's at issue here. If anyone else had issues with them, they could support opposition candidates. Anything above that is way out of line.
Palestine is a political entity recognized by the majority of govts, and almost the entirety of the people of Earth. Therefore, it does exist. It consists of the west bank and gaza.
Israel wants not only to own lebanon, but syria as well, and I suspect only two points of view are really going to openly disagree with that, the ignorant and the dishonest. I suspect that you not only know it to be true, but support the position.
Quote:Um.... now you're sounding down right silly here. The Jews lived in Isreael BEFORE Western history, certainly long before Mohammed.
The real name for this war should be the 29th crusade. It's a sobering thought that the first "mission of colonial exploration" to the ME started only 30 years after the last crusade ended. In fact, there has never been an interval of a human lifetime in which the west has not launched a crusade against the people of the middle east since. In fact, it would probably hold going back to the time of mohammed.
Quote:To quote Buffy.... " I think I speak for everyone here when I say 'Huh ?'. " You speak of doing right w/ the muslims and all, when its muslims themselves who have slaughtered far more of their own kind than anyone else.
I thought it curious, in fact stikingly so, that the neocons of the forum had shed any pretense of being politically motivated be a desire to better the lives of muslims and had fallen back an lunatic jesus ravings. Yhwh, God of War, has shown his true face.
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:Sinn Fien does, paid for largely by American dollars no less.
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Then I'm claiming a right to global domination, by your reconing. Sorry, but political parties don't have their own standing army, independent of the country's actual army, and funded primarily by other Gov'ts.
Quote:Native Americans lived in your back yard before the West had even discovered America.
Um.... now you're sounding down right silly here. The Jews lived in Isreael BEFORE Western history, certainly long before Mohammed.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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Sinn Fien has 3000+ rockets and rocket launchers? Wow, I didn't know that. I stand correctd. But Sinn Fien is funded by Irish who live here in America, and should not be confused on any level as an "American" cause. The nation, simply put, has no dog in that fight. But just becausse you find another example of a renegade mlitia, it still doesn't make it right. Lebanon must carry some of the burden for what is happening, because they allowed Hezbollah to carry on unchecked, in free lance fashion.
Dinosaurs lived in my backyard too, so what's your point? America was colonized by every country from Europe, so there's hardly any room for you to try to lay any guilt on us today. England, France, Spain, Germany, Italy, EVERYONE who was sick of the old world risked the high seas to make it here.( Ok, the Africans , mabye not so much) But make no mistake....We ARE you, we are EVERYONE! In case you forgot. 
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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And who do you think you are to imply the lives taken by the IRA weren't important or as important as Israeli's killed by Hezbollah?
My point was that Sinn Fein is the political wing of the IRA, a party that the American Government recognises and feels perfectly fine about allowing American dollars from American citizens (nice way of trying to paint some American citizens as the 'Irish' BTW, I'd of thought in a multi-ethnic country like America you'd be able to get over those sorts of petty racial/nationalistic distinctions, apparently not) going to the political wing of a known terrorist organisation.
This rather goes against your supposition that political parties don't have standing militias, so you were wrong some do and ones recognised by the American government and funded by American citizens to boot, which is why I responded.
Quote:Well you just kind of made it for me, its somewhat puzzling that you need it spelled out.
Dinosaurs lived in my backyard too, so what's your point?
One could argue that the Native Americans have more claim to your back yard given they were only 'thrown off' of it in the last two hundred years than the Israeli's do to Israel considering that they were 'thrown off' thousands of years ago from a historical perspective.
I guess if the Roman civilisation rears its head again some how we can send you to Italy to explain to the Italians that they have to STFU and put up because the Romans were here first. Or we can recognise that "The Jews lived in Israel BEFORE Western history, certainly long before Mohammed." actually really does mean bugger all.
Quote:Funny, you'll use the multi-ethnicity of America as a non-sequitur to support a point that, well I'm not entirely sure you know what your point is to be honest, but in the very same post it's not Americans sending money to the IRA, Sinn Fein whoever, it's the Irish...
America was colonized by every country from Europe, so there's hardly any room for you to try to lay any guilt on us today. England, France, Spain, Germany, Italy, EVERYONE who was sick of the old world risked the high seas to make it here.( Ok, the Africans , mabye not so much) But make no mistake....We ARE you, we are EVERYONE! In case you forgot.
“We’ll take the Nigers and the Chinks, but we don’t want the Irish!”
And that particular bit of rhetoric works well for you doesn't it, when we do wrong it’s your fault, when you do wrong it's your fault, when we do right look how great we are...
No, we can still blame you for things, you've been making your own decisions for sometime now, you don't get to act like a spoiled child and blame all your faults/actions on your 'parents'.
Personal responsibility, I know you only like it when you get to blame other people for their actions, but I'm afraid it doesn't work like that.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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Quote:Yeah, and then they vacated the premises for nearly 2000 years. For a damn long time, OTHER people lived there.
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Jews lived in Isreael BEFORE Western history, certainly long before Mohammed.
How would you feel if in around 3500 AD, Native American descendants came to the home of YOUR descendants and claimed ownership of that land and all improvements thereon.
Hell, Palestinians tricked or forced from their lands 30 years ago can't even get them back. After nearly 2000 years? I'm sorry, but they lost all entitlement to that land a long, long time ago. It rightfully belongs to the people who were living there for generations. Back in 1948, Britain and the UN were giving away land that was not theirs to give away.
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Quote:
The Jews lived in Isreael BEFORE Western history, certainly long before Mohammed.
Not so. Jews are native to the arabian desert and the sinai pennin., their ancestors come from iraq. The migration into israel, the conquestion of the philistines (palestine, as they called the land, and still do) was completed in the 5th century BC, shortly after the greek wars with persia, long after the trojan war. At the time the greeks were learning how to write from the phoenecians, the Hibiru nomads were wandering the desert fighting over which god to worship. Moses' cult of Yhwh, which dates back to the writing of exodus between 1200-1450 bc., which did not take hold over the people collectively for some thousand years. As the jews searched for a promised land, after the desertification of their nomadic territory and the conquest of sinai by egypt, the europeans were building cities, making govts. Egypt, which is generally considered part of western civ. had a full blown empire going, with not only writing and cities, but schools, armies and the first forays into modern medicine.
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I am a responsible citizen now. I have found peace from a never ending source.
When this happen to me I gave up running around trying to be what the gang called a man.
I no longer steal to prove I'm a man .
I no longer wear my clothes as they do.
I gave up the things which a gang says you are to do to be a member and remain a member.
If my life's story would help I could give you the highlights, but this is not the time or place.
non-sequitur..ha!
LOGICAL...don't you think?
LOL
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I've been through the system.
It dont work.
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Quote:Not to quibble with ya, but I'd say that is way before western history. Of course, it appears my idea of western history (more western european history) is different from yours. I wouldn't call Egyptian empire part of western civilization.
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
The migration into israel, the conquestion of the philistines (palestine, as they called the land, and still do) was completed in the 5th century BC,
Quote:Huh? I am confused.
Moses' cult of Yhwh, which dates back to the writing of exodus between 1200-1450 bc., which did not take hold over the people collectively for some thousand years.
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"Maybe she's a lazy hooker. They can't all have hearts of gold and good work ethics." -- Jaye in Wonderfalls
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Quote:
citizen wrote:
Sunday, August 13, 2006 05:35
And who do you think you are to imply the lives taken by the IRA weren't important or as important as Israeli's killed by Hezbollah?
You brought up Sinn Fien, not I. By the way, have you stopped beating your wife yet ? Don't tell me what I think or don't think on the issue, and do NOT try to intermix 2 unrelated issues for the sake of trying to win your case. You can't do it. I'm not talking Ireland, but am talking about ISRAEL.....as was asked by the thread. Hell, you can't even get it right when I tell you straight out how I feel on an issue, what makes you think you can read into my words about 1 topic and figure out what I think on another issue?
Do yourself a favor and stick to one thing at a time. You don't make quite as big an ass of yourself that way.
Some Americans ARE of Irish ancestory. How else should I put it?
I am a Native American, you pin head.
Romans were from Italy, were they not ? What am I missing here. Why would I be sent to Italy to tell them to STFU ? I don't speak the language, for starters. Nor do I care.
Quote:Once again, you've show you have trouble when you try to make up what it is I think. You really must keep that impulse in check. What's this crap you have about me not linking the Irish? I happen to be part Irish. You've lost me.
“We’ll take the Nigers and the Chinks, but we don’t want the Irish!”
People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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CTTS
I got my degree in west. civ., and we started way earlier. Stone henge is western civ. Homer is definitely western history, 8th c. bc, which is before 5th c. bc, conquest of palesting. Israel is not older than greek civ. Sure, jews existed before that, in sinai and arabia, but they didn't conquer palestine until later, and so there were jews, but there were europeans as well. We included egypt, as well as other extinct civs. such as minoa and carthage.
About Yhwh, cult of Yhwh was a fringe group within the hebrew (from hibiru, meaning nomad,) for hundreds of years. It wasn't until late in the biblical period that the cult of yhwh actually began to dominate the hebrews. Most of the history, the dominant deity was Elohim, or El, which later became a generic for god or deity. Later in the bible, 'el' appears, such as jesus' my [el] my [el] why hast thou forsaken me, but the represnts the word el, and no the deity El. The bible is a collection of the writings of the followers of yhwh, and so it includes no El worship. There have been some claims that moloch worship got transliterated as yhwh worship, or that yhwh and moloch were the same, but I doubt this.
Other biblical texts exist and can be found usually incomplete. I have found the sacred text of Baal to be an interesting read for example.
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