Question re: the intent of the US government

POSTED BY: Amiton
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 5, 2006 02:43
VIEWED: 3812
PAGE 3 of 4

FIRST PAGE PREV PAGE 1 2 3 4 NEXT PAGE LAST PAGE

RUE

Friday, June 30, 2006 10:11 PM

So Amiton,

You got lots of posts - people just expressing opinions, sometimes backing them up with history.

What say you?

SOUPCATCHER

Friday, June 30, 2006 11:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Amiton:
Let's run with this for a moment. I presume that you're asserting that the percieved consituants are big corporations and the most wealthy. Whether it's acceptable as a line of thinking or not, do you see Bush (since he's who we do and likely will continue to focus on) looking at it that way because he truly believes in Reaganomics, trickle-down theory, and voodoo economics (since they favor such behavior)? Is he (possibly) acting in that way because he feels that it is the way to the better good of all Americans and the US economy? As errant as that thinking has tended to be over the years, is his personal road to hell being paved with golden bricks of genuinely *wanting* to be a good president to the people, even if he is screwing it up?

Amiton.

Yeah, that's basically what I was getting at (re: big corporations and the very wealthy). Look at pretty much every domestic policy that this administration has implemented. Figure out who really benefits. Figure out how much money they donated through lobbying efforts (the return on investment is staggering). Figure out what the costs are. Figure out who shoulders the burdens of the majority of those costs. Figure out the long term implications of those policies. Or, figure which small coalition of the Republican base that the policy is designed to appease.

The domestic policies can basically be broken down into: industry should regulate themselves, the many who don't have should give to the few who do have, and some token bones tossed to the rabid among the faithful. In the first two instances it is a case of legislating for the powerful minority against the weak majority. And everyone pays the costs.

In response to your question about Bush's personal motivations, I don't think that he is aware of the true effect his policies are having on the vast majority of Americans. And, even if he is, I don't think that he cares. There are life experiences, familiar to the vast majority of Americans, that he has never had. He has never had to work a day in his life. He has held jobs, but never through necessity. He's never had to go without health insurance because he couldn't afford it. He's never had to suck it up and take it when the actions of a corporation impact his life (whether it's through negligence or pollution or whatever) because he didn't have the resources to stand up to the deep pockets of the corporation and their team of highly paid lawyers. He's never had to decide which bills to pay, or feed his children crap food because it's cheap, or not be able to afford medication when they're sick, or make any of a number of decisions that those who are living paycheck to paycheck often have to make. It's not even on his radar screen. Good for him - I wish more Americans could enjoy that standard of living. Bad for us. Some people can grow up in an environment like Bush's and still empathize with those less fortunate. For whatever reason, Bush can't. He is, by his own admission, not curious (read: doesn't feel the need to learn).

Unlike most Americans, he has always operated with a safety net. And so, I believe, he just has no clue how the rest of us live. His comment at that dinner of wealthy donors was telling, "Some people call you the elites; I call you my base." It was a joke but, like many jokes, revealed the underlying beliefs of the joke-teller. Anyone below that elite line doesn't matter. I think that the vast majority of Americans are non-factors in his thinking process. Until it comes time for a photo-op.

* edited to add a few sentences

CITIZEN

Saturday, July 1, 2006 1:25 AM

An ass is but an ass, though laden with gold.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
And as you know, these are open forums, you're able to come and listen to what I have to say.

VETERAN

Saturday, July 1, 2006 1:28 AM

Soupcatcher,

I would add one thing to your analysis. George Bush has a strong desire to make his mark on history. He wants to be remembered as one of the greats. I think this desire drives a lot of his foreign policy.

RUE

Saturday, July 1, 2006 2:02 AM

Oh, just one more thing to add ... the republiCONs seem to think their days are numbered. They are speeding up their pillage and it's now shamelessly, breathtakingly naked.

The Senate just approved offshore OIL drilling, killing the 24 year old ban.

KANEMAN

Saturday, July 1, 2006 2:42 AM

Excellent... we should have been drilling for the last 20 years...wouldn't be in this position now.
The prez and crew don't need off shore oil, they just steal it from the middle east..right?
Where is all this stolen oil? Send some my way.

RUE

Saturday, July 1, 2006 3:03 AM

Excellent... Where is that emoticon for Mr Burns when you need it ?

CANTTAKESKY

Saturday, July 1, 2006 3:46 AM

Quote:
do you believe that the individuals that we have in government are acting with malicious intent toward the American public?

Yes.

Not all individuals of course. But I believe there are people in power who KNOW full well they are hurting people in order to achieve their personal, selfish objectives -- and frankly don't give a damn. These folks are not just found in government, but also in corporations, universities, foundations, and professional associations. Many of these powermongers have formed alliances with each other to get what they want, and they don't care that peons die.

Then there are the misguided folks who THINK peons have to die for the greater good. Like VICKI in the I,Robot movie.

Then there are folks who enjoy having the power to send peons to death. This is evil for the enjoyment -- serial killer style. Why kill 24 one by one when you can send thousands to their deaths? A smart, charismatic sociopath would definitely find a way to climb up the power ladder to kill through policy.

Whether the Bush admin is misguided or unconscionably selfish or downright malevolent or visionary is in the eye of the beholder.

Can't Take My Gorram Sky

CITIZEN

Saturday, July 1, 2006 11:25 AM

People who want power and are capable of attaining it tend to want it for selfish ends, which is why the person most suited to rule would be the last one who wanted to do so. You can keep this under some sort of control with the carrot and the stick (usually) i.e. you make them play right and by the rules by dancing the spectre of not getting re-elected before them.

Unfortunately it seems that sometimes such sociopaths can get a hold of the stick and turn the tables so to speak. Instead of dangling the carrot of re-election before the sociopath, the sociopaths re-election becomes assured, while they dangle carrots before the populace to get them to do act and think how those in power desire.

Re-election works for those in power, because they want power, fear works for the masses because they want to feel safe, they want they're children to be safe, they want they're families and friends to be safe. Powerful people want power, everyone else wants safety.

So when the stick is held by the sociopath in charge, rather than by the masses the carrot is fear rather than re-election. The current American administration seems to know this as well as those who came before.

Quote:
Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials:
"Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."

Quote:
Spouted earlier by someone who’s bought the party line hook line and sinker:
For all you pansy ass appeasers to Islamic Fascism...

The sociopathic system really does work...

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

PDCHARLES

Saturday, July 1, 2006 12:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Veteran:
Soupcatcher,

I would add one thing to your analysis. George Bush has a strong desire to make his mark on history. He wants to be remembered as one of the greats. I think this desire drives a lot of his foreign policy.

BINGO! And right on, SoupC.

Let’s not forget Rummy-Wummy either. He is a mustache-twisting, monger if I have ever seen one. Just look at some of these guy’s mannerisms while their in the “pulpit”. Scary…

It is about political survival and power mainstay. Most of these puppet masters have been in the game a long time and waited out the cycles to get to point where their ideals can be forcefully implemented. …and this means attacking where they can or want; not where they should. A stagnant, old plan thought up years ago and “gosh darn it we’re gonna show them”. This means an aged view of the world power picture and means neglecting our real issues.

Fear doesn’t seem to work as well in the middle east as it does here, until the bomb is on their doorstep. …and we still don’t see the expected results. The Admin. truly believes that history will show that, if not for them, America would be out of resources and out of power in a short time. …or they are the last crusade. Hard to tell. It seems the American people are an afterthought.

Oil is Oil… Gold is Gold… Power is Power… Cronies are Cronies…

And RUE, it is a shame that IRAQ is Big and FEMA is little. Not saying this is your view. I watched FEMA help thousands in eastern NC during Floyd of ’99. People in the northeast are gonna be needing them as well. This problem is not gonna go away. So, to the topic, THEY DON’T CARE. They have an “Ark” called unlimited money and resources.

FIRST PAGE PREV PAGE 1 2 3 4 NEXT PAGE LAST PAGE