I told you so
POSTED BY: rue
UPDATED: Saturday, July 1, 2006 01:06
VIEWED: 11164
PAGE 10 of 15
Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
But more importantly, if Saddam had WMD why didn't he use them?
He did use them...oh, you mean this time.
He had planes and didn't use them. He had troops and used them poorly.
I suspect, and I could be wrong here, but I really suspect that Saddam was in fact NOT a military genius. This is pure speculation, but from what I saw of his career against Isreal, Iran, Kuwait, and the US...he has the military IQ of a chimpanzie...and not one of the smart ones smoking and such, sure he might type 'War and Peace' but he's far more likely to just toss crap at you. (Which is why he was so popular with the French and not a few liberals).
H
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But he didn't get even ONE off??? Even tho he had a "massive stockpile" that was a presumed credible and imminent threat to somebody? And we never found them afterwards even tho they were supposedly ready to go?
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Quote:REALLY! Unless you are using the royal 'we', or you are including the voices in your head, 'we' never thought so. And Hussein's 'big guns'? Which ones? The rusty degraded paper-weights?
We know Saddam was reaching out to Al Queda, we know Al Queda was reaching out to Saddam.
Quote:Neutralized their command and control - you mean the US got ObL. And disrupted the sources of funding.
But we had already neutralized most of their command and control
Quote:90-95% of insurgents are Iraqis, generated by the US.
thousands of militants marching to the "sound of the guns"
Quote:In case you're wondering, the US estimates appx 2/3 of Afghanistan is back under Taliban control, with the warlords paying opium protection money. The Taliban and mirror organization al Qaeda - are well-funded, well-armed, and eminently capable. And unlike you, when they think long-term, they look beyond 5 years.
Now it appears that the Taliban is faltering
Quote:And Iraqis standing behind the US Marines, with guns. And the Iraqi government offering amnesty to anyone involved in 'legitimate resistance', and telling the US to get out. As for 'democracy' (previous post) - if it is legitimately elected by the people, I guess it's a democracy, though not in the western mold. But Iraq looks to be headed towards a theocracy with Sharia law.
although with the US Marines standing behind them saying "you can do it!"
Quote:Do you believe that Iraq is anything more than a pimple on the ass of al Qaeda? It has bigger things in mind.
Our best bet is to keep up the pressure to break them before they can adopt any sort of coherant unified strategy
So your argument breaks down like this:
1) it was to keep (non-existant) WMDs from the hands of the
2) non-cooperative parties in order to
3) destroy the (resurgent and very healthy) Taliban and al Qaeda (who still have their leadership and funding intact, and are coincidentally bright enough to have a strategy but so stupid they're diverted by Iraq)
4) so the US can keep up 'pressure' on and be distracted by it's own effing decoy.
Brilliant.
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Well, I'm still trying to make sense of Hero's WMD argument. Best I can tell, it goes like this:
Saddam had an active weapons program and a "massive stockpile" of WMD and medium-range missiles (120 miles range specifically) - enough to be a credible threat to Israel or Kuwait, if not to the USA directly. He was in the process of feeling out AQ in order to potentially transfer either some items or at least some knowledge to AQ in order to create extra difficulties for the USA. Bush invaded in order to interrrupt those plans. And Saddam, not being militarily gifted, did not manage to fire off even one canister, despite having a massive stockpile of deployed weapons. But Saddam was so clever that he managed to hide them in ways that we can't find anything but 15-year-old duds. Alternately, he shipped them off to Syria instead of using them to defend Iraq.
Hero, that isn't even an internally convincing story.
The magic eightball says: Try again.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Saddam had an active weapons program and a "massive stockpile" of WMD and medium-range missiles (120 miles range specifically) - enough to be a credible threat to Israel or Kuwait, if not to the USA directly. He was in the process of feeling out AQ in order to potentially transfer either some items or at least some knowledge to AQ in order to create extra difficulties for the USA. Bush invaded in order to interrrupt those plans. And Saddam, not being militarily gifted, did not manage to fire off even one canister, despite having a massive stockpile of deployed weapons. But Saddam was so clever that he managed to hide them in ways that we can't find anything but 15-year-old duds. Alternately, he shipped them off to Syria instead of using them to defend Iraq.
You make so much more sense when you're making my argument correctly. Hiding your light under a bush is far easier then shining it for the world to see. So much easier to hide it then to use it properly and I really suspect that the invasion caught him by surprise, its swift success surprised him again, and just for bonus, the fact we've stayed the course is surprising him still. I suspect when he feels a sudden jerk at the end of a rope, he'll be in for a surprise. Man's never had a sense of perspective.
He hid or shipped out the country a large portion of his arsenal of very expensive conventional weapons in 1991. But in 2003 he'd leave it all to be discovered. Lets not forget the numerous conventional weapons caches located in schools and mosques, missiles, planes buried in the sand, why not hide other things too...case in point the 500 artillery shells that we did find (and lets face it, they arent exactly forthcoming with this stuff so who knows what else they found and haven't declassified yet).
H
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Quote:Well then, what IS your story? That Saddam had a whole stockpile of brand-spanking new weapons in 2003 and was too stupid to use them, but was so smart about hiding them that despite having a massive stockpile we can't find evidence of it anywhere, although we've found old stuff and lots of convential weapons? That our military actually FOUND new-vintage WMD but is keeping it a secret, although that would lay to rest the doubts and objections of the entire world?
He hid or shipped out the country a large portion of his arsenal of very expensive conventional weapons in 1991. But in 2003 he'd leave it all to be discovered. Lets not forget the numerous conventional weapons caches located in schools and mosques, missiles, planes buried in the sand, why not hide other things too...case in point the 500 artillery shells that we did find (and lets face it, they arent exactly forthcoming with this stuff so who knows what else they found and haven't declassified yet).
Tell you what Hero- you lay out your story point by point... Pretend you're talking to a skeptical jury, make your best case. That is, if you have one.
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So far, Hero has not made a case for WMD.
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Still waiting....
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Zero,
How many people in the Bush administration have been in military combat? There was Powell, but he got out. And then there was .... I can think of ... none. Pehaps you can come up with a name or two. Otherwise, I'll say that republicowards are always ready for others to die, as long as they get more $$$Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Liberals, always willing to give you the shirt off of someone else's back.
Can I throw one in ?
Retired Marine General Anthony Zinni.... who resigned from a " super Ambassador " position in the Middle East after publicly stating that Bushs foreign policy ideas were " insane "
I wonder if we will ever really know why Powell resigned...
" Over and in, last call for sin
While everyone's lost, the battle is won
With all these things that I've done "
The Killers
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/killers/allthesethingsthativedone.html
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