Angel, Buffy, or Firefly. Choose only one.

POSTED BY: OPPYH
UPDATED: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 19:16
VIEWED: 20356
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RUGBUG

Thursday, June 15, 2006 2:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by deepgirl187:
Why is so much emphasis being placed on the length of the series? Maybe Firefly wasn't as long as the others, but that doesn't change the fact that it was a high-quality, well-acted series.

deepgirl: that also doesn't change the fact that Buffy was a high-quality, well-acted series as well. Both were ground-breaking, with the reverberations of Buffy still being felt today. Most of the shows with strong women kicking arse had a chance to succeed because Buffy paved the way. Firefly broke ground, but it never reached the audience of Buffy. It just didn't have the chance to. It also didn't have the chance to go through growing pains.

There's seven seasons of Buffy. Yes, some of it sucked (Go Fish was pretty lame, but still had some charm). Some of it was brilliant (Hush, The Body, Once More with Feeling). And most of it was very good. Firefly was Very Good. It never sucked, but it also didn't have a chance to be brilliant. Give it 6 1/2 more years and it invariably would've sucked ocassionally, been very good most of the time and been brilliant once in a while.

Now, if we were going to compare based on first seasons alone...Buffy would come after Firefly AND Angel. Buffy's first season was similar in length to Firefly: It was 12 eps long. To compare it with Firefly would be ridiculous. Firefly blows it out of the water. But Firefly was also built on Mutant Enemy's wealth of experience from Buffy and Angel. ME honed it skills on the other two and came out of the gate stronger for Firefly, thus a fantastic 14 episodes. It stands to reason that its first season would be better (if ME had learned anything), but had it continued, it would've experienced the same problems that most other series face.

So, in that sense, length does matter.

DIRTWEED

Thursday, June 15, 2006 2:51 PM

Tried watching Buffy and Angel several times. Just wasn't my thing.

Firefly. Actually when my friend was going to show me my first ep of Firefly he told me it was by the guy that did Buffy....I refused to watch it. He tossed it in anyway....glad I decided to stick around!

Dirtweed

TAYEATRA

Thursday, June 15, 2006 3:29 PM

I think I might just quote all of Rugbug

Quote:
Originally posted by RugBug:
deepgirl: that also doesn't change the fact that Buffy was a high-quality, well-acted series as well. Both were ground-breaking, with the reverberations of Buffy still being felt today. Most of the shows with strong women kicking arse had a chance to succeed because Buffy paved the way. Firefly broke ground, but it never reached the audience of Buffy. It just didn't have the chance to. It also didn't have the chance to go through growing pains.

There's seven seasons of Buffy. Yes, some of it sucked (Go Fish was pretty lame, but still had some charm). Some of it was brilliant (Hush, The Body, Once More with Feeling). And most of it was very good. Firefly was Very Good. It never sucked, but it also didn't have a chance to be brilliant. Give it 6 1/2 more years and it invariably would've sucked ocassionally, been very good most of the time and been brilliant once in a while.

Now, if we were going to compare based on first seasons alone...Buffy would come after Firefly AND Angel. Buffy's first season was similar in length to Firefly: It was 12 eps long. To compare it with Firefly would be ridiculous. Firefly blows it out of the water. But Firefly was also built on Mutant Enemy's wealth of experience from Buffy and Angel. ME honed it skills on the other two and came out of the gate stronger for Firefly, thus a fantastic 14 episodes. It stands to reason that its first season would be better (if ME had learned anything), but had it continued, it would've experienced the same problems that most other series face.

So, in that sense, length does matter.

With one exception. I really do think that Firefly already achieved brilliance, consistently.

Still, as much as it would break my heart to lose Firefly, I would pick Buffy.

For the record... I hate SMG after about mid-season 3.

*****
Taya
*****
I'm going to S3!!!
(*Insert hysterical celebration dance here*)

INDIGOSTARBLASTER

Thursday, June 15, 2006 3:58 PM

LOL! Thanks, Chrisisall :)

Indigo S.

MONKSDAD

Thursday, June 15, 2006 4:08 PM

i never saw buffy or angel before i got the dvd's for firefly. after seeing all of firefly (watched a couple eps when it originally aired) i borrowed buffy dvd's and i just cant get into it. i like the movie with dylan mckay (luke perry) but the show just doesnt do it for me... so FIREFLY without a doubt is my pick

"And I think calling him that is an insult to the psychotic lowlife community."

RUXTON

Thursday, June 15, 2006 6:41 PM

RugBug,, very well stated. Without Buffy there COULD NOT HAVE BEEN Firefly.

Unfortunately, most forum members on this thread seem to have not had the joy of watching Buffy/Mutant Enemy/Joss Whedon stretch and grow. As you noted, and as I tried to note above, Buffy was the FIRST show of its kind and many copycats came after it, in many genres, including cop shows. The observant could see that Joss/Buffy was being ripped off all along the way. Stolen ideas, stolen themes, even stoled phrases popped up all over TV, only AFTER Buffy aired. It was one of the very few truly ground-breaking TV series ever, and to my mind the very finest.

And of course I fell totally in love with SMG right from the very first second my aging eyes fell on her, at the very first time she appeared as Buffy, the very first time it was aired.

Without seven seasons of Buffy there would be no Firefly, no Serenity, and this forum would not exist. Newcomers don't/can't understand this, and so cannot give due credit.

CHRISISALL

Thursday, June 15, 2006 6:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ruxton:
It was one of the very few truly ground-breaking TV series ever, and to my mind the very finest.

Newcomers don't/can't understand this, and so cannot give due credit.

I was a dumass never to have watched it when it was first broadcast.
But that's not an isolated incident.

I guess Brisco's cancellation had a lasting effect on me....

Late to all parties Chrisisall

DEEPGIRL187

Thursday, June 15, 2006 6:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ruxton:
Without seven seasons of Buffy there would be no Firefly, no Serenity, and this forum would not exist. Newcomers don't/can't understand this, and so cannot give due credit.

Maybe us newcomers haven't been Whedon fans as long, but is it really fair to say that we don't understand and cannot give due credit? Yes, I will agree that Joss had to grow and change as a writer to create Firefly, and that process included creating Buffy and Angel. I see Firefly as superior for my own reasons, just like you see Buffy as superior for yours. I understand just fine, thank you, and all of us "newcomers" are entitled to our own opinions.

**************************************************

Jayne: You wanna go, little man?
Wash: Only if it's someplace with candlelight.

INDIGOSTARBLASTER

Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:04 PM

Hmm... this brings up an interesting point. Is Buffy better for being more ground-breaking, or is Firefly better in an absolute sense, having had after all the benefit of Buffy's shoulders to stand on?

It's sort of like arguing over whether Newton or Einstein was the better physicist.

Nope, can't do it. I don't have an objective argument that works for me, one way or another. I can only reiterate again that, for me, right now, Firefly is the one for me.

Indigo S.

DIRTWEED

Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ruxton:
Without seven seasons of Buffy there would be no Firefly, no Serenity, and this forum would not exist. Newcomers don't/can't understand this, and so cannot give due credit.

Well you can't quite lump everyone into that category. I totally understand that Buffy had to be a hit for Whedon to keep working and not end up as a greeter at Walmart.

It's just that not everyone liked Buffy and/or Angel. I for one am glad he switched gears a bit.

:D

Dirtweed

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