A jumble of posts about Firefly returning

POSTED BY: Succatash
UPDATED: Wednesday, January 7, 2004 15:18
VIEWED: 6363
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SUCCATASH

Saturday, January 3, 2004 10:52 PM

I'm not saying anything new, but everything I'm reading in various posts keeps giving me a nagging question I want to settle, beyond a doubt.

Here's what I understand: Universal purchased the movie rights, but Fox still owns TV rights. Any network to pick up Firefly would have to buy these rights. Joss cannot independenty borrow money and make a direct to DVD series because Fox owns Firefly?

But doesn't Joss own Firefly? He is the creator.

Does Fox own "Malcolm Reynolds" and "Serenity?" How sad that Joss's dream was sold on such a shaky deal. It's his idea, how can Fox sue him if he makes Independent Firefly since they obviously don't want it?

If Joss owns Firefly, why doesn't he just borrow some money and get it going?

KERNELM

Sunday, January 4, 2004 1:42 AM

In general, if you create something, it's yours. However, it's not easy to fund something like making a TV show on your own, so Joss has to have contracts with studios in order to produce his work, and in almost all cases, the studio retains the rights to the work. It's just like how in music, very few artists actually have control over their own work, since the contracts usually stipulate studio control of all IP rights. There's a few exceptions, such as when U2 bought the rights to their own music from Island back when Island was having financial difficulties.

As far as I know, Joss had/has a contract with Fox, so he didn't have much of a choice on who to sell his show to. And in any case, he likely wouldn't have retained control.

It doesn't matter whether or not Fox wants it. They own the IP, and they can do with it whatever they please. I'm not saying if it's morally right or wrong, but legally the copyright owner is the one who has all the marbles. If they won't want to sell their work, it doesn't mean you can just take it.

And besides, it's not a trivial thing to borrow money to produce a TV show. Banks don't risk tens of millions of dollars on "failed" TV shows.

MAKEROFPATHS

Sunday, January 4, 2004 1:51 AM

To add to KernelM's notes:

Look a the end of any show and read the following: Twentieth Century Fox is the author of this show for the purposes of . . . various copyright conventions. This little statement shows how the producing company imposes its authorship and therefore takes all rights as the author of the show. Of course, they give people like Joss millions of dollars -- you have no choice as the actual author. JMS of B5 fame pointed this out.

SUCCATASH

Sunday, January 4, 2004 2:04 AM

It seems to me that Joss should sell, borrow, whatever, to buy the rights back and then go Independent. Find a foreign investor, whatever.

Firefly shouldn't have to depend on +- 7 tv networks. Start with Direct to DVD and Pay-to-Download Internet services and then make the network execs form a line for syndication rights as Joss laughs his way to the bank.

I realize I'm saying nothing new. Except, let's all be clear the bottleneck is with FOX. Let's all be aware that the biggest problem of all is that Joss doesn't even own the rights to Firefly.

SUCCATASH

Sunday, January 4, 2004 2:06 AM

Okay, here's another question. Could Fox, in the future, bring back Firefly and have new actors and new writers, etc? Without Joss?

DESANGRO

Sunday, January 4, 2004 2:09 AM

If they did I wouldn't see it.

SUCCATASH

Sunday, January 4, 2004 3:20 AM

Are we all in agreement that Fox has the right to bring back Firefly, with aliens and sounds in space and laugh tracks? With all new producers and actors and call it Firefly?

I don't think Fox would do it, but it bothers me that they could if they wanted to.

RISKEVERYTHING

Sunday, January 4, 2004 3:33 AM

FOX has made it clear that they would not stand in the way of another station picking up the FireFly show. Why are you all ranting about it?

SUCCATASH

Sunday, January 4, 2004 3:39 AM

I'm not ranting. I'm trying to understand.

How much $ is FOX asking, is the question. If it were as simple as you suggest, Joss would have the rights to Firefly.

Lucas did it the right way, in my opinion.

When Lucas negotiated his deal with Fox to make Star Wars, the studio was shocked to learn that the hot director was not asking for a lot of money. Instead, Lucas wanted control. He wanted to have the right to the final cut of the film, 40% of the net box-office gross, all rights to future sequels and ownership of all the merchandising rights associated with Star Wars. At the time, science fiction films were not very profitable. Hence, Fox thought they were ripping Lucas off. Sequel and merchandise rights to science fiction films were worthless at the time. In the end, this deal would eventually make Lucas a billionaire and cost Fox an untold fortune in lost revenues.

http://www.supershadow.com/starwars/history.html

P.S. Yes, I know about Supershadow

CARDIE

Sunday, January 4, 2004 3:48 AM

Firefly is owned by Twentieth Century Fox the TV and film production studio, not by the FOX TV network. Even though they are part of the same media conglomerate, they are not the same. The Star Trek franchise is analogous. Although the various Trek shows have aired on NBC, in syndication, and on UPN, they have always been owned by Paramount (which bought its original production company Desilu.) (UPN and Paramount are now part of the Viacom media conglomerate)So, yes, Fox the studio could use the Firefly name on anything it wanted to, but I doubt they have any interest in that.

Few show creators could afford the millions of dollars to buy back rights from a studio, and I don't think we want Joss to bankrupt himself betting that direct to video Firefly could pay him back for that big a financial outlay.

Publishers and distributors generally own rights and copyright. It's not some big outrage, simply the price of getting someone else to pay the production costs and marketing. I've written or edited four books, and I don't have copyright to any of them.

Cardie

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