X-3 The Last Stand
POSTED BY: Tayeatra
UPDATED: Sunday, April 5, 2026 17:34
VIEWED: 20212
PAGE 3 of 7
X-men3 was good but not great. It definitely suffered when Singer left the project and Ratner came on to finish it up.
Many times, there were lame lines of dialogue or cliches that just ruined the scene - these especially would occur at the end of a scene (i.e. "God help us all" and "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned"). In fact, most of the president's lines were just awful - they should've just taken some of GW's great quotes over the years and used them - at least there'd have been some humor (oh, and I actually like GW, but I can laugh at him)!
Adding/keeping lines in that get the point across or explain how a character is feeling shows that the director did not trust the characters or the actors portraying them. The other two movies, especially X2, trusted the characters. A look or expression would've gotten the point across just fine. Lazy directing.
Lame dialogue was not the only problem with the script - the fact that "The Last Stand" was just that for many of the characters represented lazy storytelling. You cannot help but inject drama into a story if you're killing off characters at every turn - that is lazy writing. That is using great characters for your own purposes. X2 didn't kill off anyone until the very end, and it made for a much more compelling story because it was not lazy writing. It was a carefully constructed script that really pulled you along, and you cared about what was happening.
The best thing going for the movie was the Phoenix storyline - that's when things finally picked up with the scene at Alkali Lake and then just when it gets going it slows down again with the lame Cure idea. I don't agree that the Phoenix and Cure storylines should've been separated - the Cure storyline wasn't strong enough to hold its own. Phoenix is what this movie was about at its core, but it kind of got lost with all the Cure stuff flying around. The movie lost its focus every time Cure elements came in.
Wolverine by and large carried the movie again, which was good. But his "Braveheart" speech was just out of character. Wolverine would say, "I'm gonna go kick some ass. For Wheels. Who's in?" Not the overly emotional piece of crap speech that he said.
Having said all of that, it still was a fun ride and a fun watch. It just needed some good script-doctoring (like what Joss did with the first X-men, adding a few lines that made it golden). It was a good film, but it could've been a great film. And it's focus that makes a good film great.
If someone could post the little scene at the end of the film, please do. If it negates all the deaths of the film, it would be another instance of lazy storytelling - hope that's not what it is.
Mengstrom
www.stillflying.net
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Quote:
Originally posted by HippieBrowncoat:
On a feminist perspective, i have to bring up Jean/Phoenix. It has long been a notion in our culture that women with power are dangerous and evil. Since they overpower men, they can not be controlled and are therefore bad. I know that X-men comics were written decades ago, and i am not arguing that Jean/Phoenix isn't a malovelent character; she is! Damn true! But here we are, 2006, seeing the same theme for the billionth time. In case you are doubting this, pick a Disney movie. (we've seen near all of them, or at least some.) For example, Cinderella. Made, 1950 something, right? Good girl is helpless, evil stepmother has all the power over the good girl till Prince Charming saves her. Powerful women have been villified in media throughout the decades.Select to view spoiler:
Mystique is quite evil until she saves Magneto and gets her power taken away. Then we don't see her until we learn that, sans mutant powers, she has gone to the authorities to stop the mutant uprising. And, lo and behold, at the end of the movie, bad girl Jean/Phoenix has to die (and it takes the best man to do the job). No chance of her controlling her powers and becoming a good character.
So, yay, another movie that subtly reinforces the ages-old myth that empowered women are bad.
Thank you for mentioning this, HippieBrowncoat. I didn't like the movie for reasons other people mentioned (no character development, stilted dialogue, plot holes) but the lack of a strong female superhero really bothered me. Sure, there's Storm, but she follows Logan more than she leads herself.
Select to view spoiler:
Rogue was my favorite character, and now she's lost her powers. She can't really be a member of the X-Men anymore, unless she's some kind of liaison to the human world. And Jean, what a pointless waste of an interesting character. Why couldn't she have learned to control her subconscious?
I haven't read the comics, but from what others have said, it sounds like the 1950s comics weren't as sexist as this 2006 movie.
Joss, I am counting on you to do Wonder Woman right.
http://serenityjune23rd.com/
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mengstrom:
If someone could post the little scene at the end of the film, please do.
After the credits...
Select to view spoiler:
There is a quick cut to the room where the patient Xavier was discussing to the students is being kept, the one that 'has no higher brain functions'... and we see, from the patient's perspective, the woman from the video walk in, and we hear offscreen, in Xavier's voice, "Hello, Moira..." and the doctor's eyes go wide for a moment and she responds "Charles...", before the scene goes black.
__________________________________
The best way to get rid of temptation is to yield to it.
- Oscar Wilde
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I saw it again tonight. I love midnight shows. I checked IMDb and it looks like Magneto is already in pre production, which is good news for me since that's my favorite character. Is it just me or is Ellen Page (Kitty Pryde/Shadowcat) hot?
I wanna be Mr. Baccarin!
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I must say that I both loved and loathed parts of this movie. As a movie goin' guy, the action and shiny effects really won me over (Wolverine's fight in the forest and that bridge scene were freakin' awesome!) but as far as the plot and script, I'm with many in that it was suffering.
As far as the plot goes, the idea of The Cure storyline I could've done without. Yes, it's a great saga but the main focus I believed should've been more on the Phoenix story. I think back to when I left the theatre after seeing X2 the first time, I nearly leapt out of my seat when I saw the Phoenix outline in the water. I wanted much, if not all, of X3 to be about Jean facing the dark part of her mind and seeing more of an intense conflict between her, Scott, and Logan. And where was my freakin firey Phoenix outline around Jean that I was sooooo looking forward to seeing the fx department create?! Huh? HUH?! Ok, gotta calm down. The other thing that ticked me off so much was
Select to view spoiler:
Why did they have to kill off Scott, Xavier, and Jean. I must agree with Singate that killing all three, even though Xavier is still technically "alive", really served little purpose to me. I felt very little remorse when Scott died (never was much of a Cyclops fan), Xavier's death didn't seem gut-wrenching enough, and Jean's just served nothing except to show the charismatic side of Wolverine. She coulda changed over dangit.
And, as far as the dialouge goes, I must agree that there were too many cliche' lines to be heard. The "May God help us" and "What have I done?" lines came off way too cheesy. These actors are pros and they know these characters well enough to pull off the scene without crappy dialouge.
To wrap up my rant, I just have to say "Why oh why did you leave the franchise Brian Singer?" I would've loved to have seen his vision of the Phoenix saga but instead we get Ratner's view. The guy's a good director, but he should stick to the Rush Hour movies IMHO. Hopefully Singer's view of Superman will help me overcome this superhero movie depression. And I must also say "Curse you Joss Whedon" for he has spoiled me with witty dialouge, suprising twists and a movie experience I will always compare other movies to from now on. Oh well, 'tis life. X-Men: The Last Stand was a good summer movie, but as a whole, it left me wanting and maybe (crosses fingers) we can have a 4th X-Men movie to write the wrongs of this one.
Keep flyin'.
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Good fun, but not a patch on the previous films. Along with the poor dialog we also get:
Select to view spoiler:
Too many characters. Angel, Beast, Multiple Man, Juggernaut all nice to see but ultimately could have been left out for more character work on the already existing character.
More Storm. It felt like they had a contract saying she had to use her powers for something every 10 minutes. Storm it's supposed to be sunny. Storm it's a bit misty, clear it up. Halle Berry likes to talk about how important Storm is in the comic books, but she still doesn't seem to understand her. I mean, did anyone like her enough to warrant her having such a big role?
Evil Xavier. Didn't buy that he'd do that to Jean. Maybe if Jean was going to kill everyone then yes, but as it just seemed to be him raping her mind and putting blocks simply because he thought she was too powerful seemed crazy. Especially when he didn't seem to know what was going on with her powers in X2. Totally out of character.
The lab being on Alcatraz.... Why? Other than to have the bit where Magneto rips the golden gate bridge up.
Magneto being chronically stupid. Moves the Golden Gate bridge to Alcatraz thens send in wave after wave of mutants. Here's an idea, drop the bridge on the facility. Or rip out the foundations. Or ask Phoenix to destroy it from your forest shanty town, she is pretty much all powerful.
Phoenix, the most powerful mutant ever kills Cyclops, kills Xaver then goes and lives in a shanty town. Doesn't really do anything for the rest of the movie. A complete waste.
Iceman vs Pyro. Could have been amazing, instead they just throw wave after wave of fire and ice at each other. Again, wasted opportunity.
After everything, after all the sacrifices made, turns out almost no-one's really dead and the cure didn't even work. Almost as bad as 'it was all a dream'.
Other, smaller points:
Why did no-one really care Cyclops was dead?
How did it become night so quickly?
For an army of mutants they sure didn't have many powers.
Magneto can smell Wolverine's adamantium from miles away but can't detect that the guns aren't metal?
Where were all the freak mutants? The reason the cure worked so well in the books was because so many mutants had awful, pointless or debilitating mutations. Nothing apparently wrong with any of the ones queing up for it.
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Pimping my fanfic:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=8267
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I've found it very reassuring that others are sharing my viewpoint here. I wasn't sure if I was initially being too critical.
The one thing no-one else has mentioned has been whether or not they feel there are some important cut or deleted scenes. ChronictheHedgehog mentioned that it became night very quickly... I feel there may have been a cut there. Other deleted scenes may IMHO have contributed to the somewhat stilted dialogue... (cut the main text but leave the cliches- drawing attention to cliche overuse).
Select to view spoiler:
It's interesting that some people see the cure as being temporary only for Magneto. When I saw it I took it to mean that the cure would wear off on anyone over time. I mean, there is no time-scale for the Magneto chess scene. Maybe I just wanted to know that Rogue wasn't powerless, she used to be one of my favourites back in the comics and cartoons.
On a side note. Right there with you EmmaRigby. If they write Gambit off one more time after we were promised an appearance in X2, I am going to get very upset. He's not just about blowing things up! He's a complex character that massively impacts the Rogue storyline, his powers are cool, he has witty dialogue and, dammit, he's hot!
*****
Taya
*****
I'm going to S3!!!
(*Insert hysterical celebration dance here*)
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Well, after thinking about it, I've decided in my mind that while X3 wasn't on the level with X2, at least it wasn't BATMAN AND ROBIN.
My main problem with the movie (other than too many characters, some cheesy one liners and character conclusions that were let downs) was that it seemed a bit rushed. With the first two movies, there were at least some moments that breathed. It took it's time in developing it's characters and themes. Like in X2, there was the scene between Stryker and Xavier where when Xavier says that mutation isn't a disease, Stryker immediately yells at him "YOU'RE LYING!" In that one interaction, the entire point of the X-Men mythos was revealed. But with X3, it seems as if everything was rushed to get to the big action set pieces, which while they rocked, lacked some of the emotional heft the first two had. It had scenes that dealt with the big issues, but it was done in point form and had none of the nuance the first two had.
I liked both the Cure sub-plots and the Dark Phoenix sub-plot. I just think it would have been better if they focused exclusively on one of the two and not mashing both together. Have a "Cure" movie and a "Phoenix" film.
Also, one of the smaller things that bugged me. In the flashback, you saw Xavier and Magneto twenty years younger with the real actors youthesized through CG. While it looks OK, they both sound like old men. They should've told the sound designer that they needed to make them sound twenty years younger and not the old men they really are.
Oh, adn the reason why Cyclops was killed off was because he was defecting with Bryan and his crew over to SUPERMAN RETURNS as well.
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"There's only one "Return" ok, and it ain't "of the King", it's "of the Jedi."
"Maybe we should start calling your friend 'Padme' because he loves 'Mannequin Skywalker' so much, Right? (imitating robot) Danger...danger...my name is Anakin...my shitty acting is ruining saga."
Excerpt of internet teaser for CLERKS 2.
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"Also, one of the smaller things that bugged me. In the flashback, you saw Xavier and Magneto twenty years younger with the real actors youthesized through CG. While it looks OK, they both sound like old men. They should've told the sound designer that they needed to make them sound twenty years younger and not the old men they really are."
I don't agree with this. Take a look at Star Trek, the Next Generation sometime. There's Patrick Stewart, Season One was in 1987 (19 years ago!) and Patrick Stewart sounds pretty much the same as he does now. And I've gotta say, he stays in awfully good shape. I think he's in better shape than I am.
Now, I did have a serious problem with Xavier in this flick.
Select to view spoiler:
Xavier says to Wolverine, "I don't have to explain myself, most especially to you." What a rediculous thing for him to say! Xavier is a big proponent of explaining himself. He's a teacher (professor) and he spends a lot of time with children helping them to understand philosophy and the reasons to do things. Why would he say such a rude and angry thing to Wolverine? Bah.
--Anthony
"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner
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Yeah, it did bug me a bit that Xavier seemed to be a bit on the bad guy side. Mind you, Joss turned him slightly into a bad guy as well in his X-MEN comics, so I guess it could happen.
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"There's only one "Return" ok, and it ain't "of the King", it's "of the Jedi."
"Maybe we should start calling your friend 'Padme' because he loves 'Mannequin Skywalker' so much, Right? (imitating robot) Danger...danger...my name is Anakin...my shitty acting is ruining saga."
Excerpt of internet teaser for CLERKS 2.
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