IMMIGRATION
POSTED BY: impression
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 2, 2006 20:49
VIEWED: 17082
PAGE 3 of 8
okay river6213...you seem to be a lil pent up on the whole situation and first of all...mayflower or no....those illegal aliens u keep referring to...your ancestors..so take some blame...secondly...spaniards landed america first...check ur history...thirdly...if u knew anything about religion and anything about the spaniards, the english, and anyone else coming over to america...a lot of the stuff they did, they used religion to make them look better but they barely did anything in the name of God, to the peasants of their mother land's, it looked noble and justifiable..much the same way bush thought WMD that didnt exist was enough reason to go over to Iraq...they were hiding behind one reason for another, exploitation of God will send them to the bad places of hell only reserved for those movie talkers...oh and by the way, the native americans fought with the french and owned slaves...and not every mayflower alien lived in the south...some white folk fought to actually free the africans because they honestly believed it was wrong....and the whole native american reservation thing...yeah once long ago it was a tragedy for them..but you know how quickly they jumped onto american technology and advancement...and the reservations now....casinos and gambling and stuff...seems to me like they have decided for themselves to move quite a bit a way from their own culture....and everyone in the western hemisphere outside of the native americans can be considered illegal aliens but i have to post this question...lets say origian starts in the middle east(not talking only Iraq because geography was different then) like it states in the Bible and other religious books...people spread out over time....North America was once completely empty until, wait, uh people crossed over from asia into northern canada and started populating the world, so yeah they may have found the land, but life makes it necessary to find new land, so both they and the Mayflower people were searching for land correct, so arent even the native americans either illegal aliens or was it just lifes theory of the strong survive and if so, you gotta be considering yourself for even being lucky enough to be here that your ancestors found it worthy enough to take the time and make a way of life for you, even though there were hardships along the way that i neither think were okay or think would have made this country what it is if they didnt happen....the past has happened...people need to get over themselves and if your going to point fingers...point fingers from every angle and understand from every angle.
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actually evidence points to the vikings landing here first
"And I think calling him that is an insult to the psychotic lowlife community."
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SASSALICIOUS made a point of this in their thread, but I had a few things to add.
People who are in opposition to illegal immigrants on this thread have had some interesting points, but consider this. How many people are willing to do the jobs that illegal immigrants do and for the same amount of money that they earn? Does anyone here want to earn two dollars an hour picking fruit? Cleaning other people's bathrooms? Taking care of their kids? If people that want to pick up the slack that would be left after all the illegal immigrants are gone, then by all means, keep up this 'throw them out with the bathwater' business. The truth of the matter is, illegal immigrants fill an important spot in the American economy that no one else is really willing to fill. Until that changes, no one has the right to say anything.
At last.
We can retire and give up
this life of crime.
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I say we do what Mexico does to its Illegal Immigrants. Take their money, possessions, land (if any), and then throw them either A. across the border or B. in jail.
Ok I don’t really think we should do that, but that’s what good old Mexico does… Oh and in Mexico if you are born in another country and take the time to become a citizen in Mexico, BY LAW you can’t own land. Just some food for thought.
oh and DEEPGIRL187 they take plenty of jobs that pay well, that many LEGAL Americans would be willing to take.
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They don’t mention that Code Pink has had a major part in the organization of today’s events.
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I'm confused on a few things, and I will say up front that I'm one of the people that is rather upset about the support of illegal aliens in this country.
First, why is is such a bad thing to deny these individuals rights in the US? The fact of the matter is, for whatever reasons - good or bad, that a conscious decision was made to take residence in the US in violation of American law. Period.
Second, why is blanket forgiveness for this a "good" option? Again, these people are in the US in blatant violation of US law. There are huge numbers of people patiently waiting in line and paying thousands of dollars and waiting *years* while being forced to continue to live outside of the country because they are making the responsible choice of trying to immigrate into the US in accordance with US law. There isn't a *single* illegal immigrant in the US that doesn't know that the punishment for being caught in the country illegally is deportation. It doesn't matter how long you've been in country illegally, and it doesn't matter how hard you've worked or how much you've paid in taxes. The law has been broken, and it was broken with intent and knowledge of the penalty. There's no way around that. So somehow the "proper" course of action is to punish those who adhere to the law, and reward the people who flagrantly disregard it?
Third, where did this concept that early colonists were illegal immigrants come from? We'll discard the idea that empires and colonization was a standard practice at the time, and there was no formal claim to the land that came to be the New England colonies. There was no country to begin with. There was no law established that would be violated to make them illegal. Even further down that road, indiginous Native Americans didn't have a concept of land ownership. The tribes were nomadic, particularly the Shinicock, Mohawk, Sioux, and Mohican people of the east coast of North America. They welcomed the new neighbors. I will grant that the colonists deeply violated that trust and did a lot of awful things. Perhaps the whole statement was meant as a metaphor? Just the same, though, it didn't really apply the way that it seemed to be intended.
I don't blame the illegal immigrants for taking their chances in the US, and I do agree that the US is largely to blame for the situation that is at hand now. I also agree that it is important to take action against the companies that hire illegal immigrants, and that action needs to be severe enough to actively discourage the practice. I do not, however, agree that somehow everybody should just look away and let the transgression pass. The illegal immigrants have to be held accountable for their actions. To turn a blind eye and just sweep everything under the carpet sends a very bad message, and there is no justifiable reason for it at this stage.
I'm sorry, and I don't want to be mean, but I haven't seen the enlightenment being espeoused by the supporters of the illegal immigrants. It could be that I'm just dense, but most of what I've seen hasn't really addressed the issue, it just tells the US to roll over and be taken advantage of.
Amiton.
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Quote:
Originally posted by impression:
okay river6213...you seem to be a lil pent up on the whole situation and first of all...mayflower or no....those illegal aliens u keep referring to...your ancestors..so take some blame...secondly...spaniards landed america first...check ur history...thirdly...if u knew anything about religion and anything about the spaniards, the english, and anyone else coming over to america...a lot of the stuff they did, they used religion to make them look better but they barely did anything in the name of God, to the peasants of their mother land's, it looked noble and justifiable..much the same way bush thought WMD that didnt exist was enough reason to go over to Iraq...they were hiding behind one reason for another, exploitation of God will send them to the bad places of hell only reserved for those movie talkers...oh and by the way, the native americans fought with the french and owned slaves...and not every mayflower alien lived in the south...some white folk fought to actually free the africans because they honestly believed it was wrong....and the whole native american reservation thing...yeah once long ago it was a tragedy for them..but you know how quickly they jumped onto american technology and advancement...and the reservations now....casinos and gambling and stuff...seems to me like they have decided for themselves to move quite a bit a way from their own culture....and everyone in the western hemisphere outside of the native americans can be considered illegal aliens but i have to post this question...lets say origian starts in the middle east(not talking only Iraq because geography was different then) like it states in the Bible and other religious books...people spread out over time....North America was once completely empty until, wait, uh people crossed over from asia into northern canada and started populating the world, so yeah they may have found the land, but life makes it necessary to find new land, so both they and the Mayflower people were searching for land correct, so arent even the native americans either illegal aliens or was it just lifes theory of the strong survive and if so, you gotta be considering yourself for even being lucky enough to be here that your ancestors found it worthy enough to take the time and make a way of life for you, even though there were hardships along the way that i neither think were okay or think would have made this country what it is if they didnt happen....the past has happened...people need to get over themselves and if your going to point fingers...point fingers from every angle and understand from every angle.
Do you know the actual reason why white people in the north were opposed to slavery in the south during the civil war era? They thought it made white people lazy, that it was making white people weaker. It had nothing to do with them thinking slavery is wrong.
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not saying I am "for" or "against", but tell me what "good paying jobs" illegal immigrants take? I live in a Gulf Coasst community and there are a lot of Mexicans here, don't know if they are legal or not, but will say they do sh*t jobs for barely minimum wage and they work like dogs. The people that hire them are taking advantage.
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Quote:
Originally posted by deepgirl187:
How many people are willing to do the jobs that illegal immigrants do and for the same amount of money that they earn? Does anyone here want to earn two dollars an hour picking fruit? Cleaning other people's bathrooms? Taking care of their kids? If people that want to pick up the slack that would be left after all the illegal immigrants are gone, then by all means, keep up this 'throw them out with the bathwater' business. The truth of the matter is, illegal immigrants fill an important spot in the American economy that no one else is really willing to fill. Until that changes, no one has the right to say anything.
This is part of the problem, though, deepgirl187. Nobody in the US should only be making two dollars per hour doing anything unless they are in a commission paying position or self-employed. The employers that are paying those wages need to be punished. Yes, there are consequences for such actions, one of which being an increased price per unit for agricultural goods (and other affected industries), and that in turn will have a ripple effect throughout the economy. That doesn't change the facts - those companies (or co-ops, or whatever level of employment) should never have been doing business that way to begin with. If they couldn't operate that way and stay in business, then they shouldn't be doing that business. If it cuts their bottomline, then I don't have much sympathy, especially considering the rediculous profit margins of bigger corporations. Capitalism is a tough environment, and it's one of the reasons I don't want to be a businessman.
The same argument applies to the other jobs listed as well...those are unskilled labor markets. There are people, American people, who will fill those positions if the pay and benefits are laid in accordance with US law. The problem again is with the employers who are trying to trim the corners and make an extra dollar by exploiting the fact that they can put someone in a position to take whatever is offered and has no recourse. Unemployment may be at 5% or whatever, but I'm sure many of them would take *legal* pay to do those jobs, and I'm almost positive that the majority of this nation's homeless would (mind you, I'm speaking of the truly homeless, not the people bankrolling money by panhandling and pulling government welfare even though they're able to do better).
Amiton.
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Why are we having this discussion on this site? I understand many of you are passionate about this topic, but this kind of talk is downright exclusive (as opposed to inclusive). I am tempted not to come back, which would be a gorram shame, us UK Browncoats need to be kept on side. I could spend a long time talking to you about migration, but I'd need to look you in the eye...remember Mal an co are "illegal" and most definitely migrant workers...
there was no end...
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