Why Wash is 100% alive and mostly well.
POSTED BY: pastorbadger
UPDATED: Thursday, November 22, 2007 09:57
VIEWED: 83595
PAGE 16 of 30
Not to mention that the script for Wrath of Kahn said Spock was dead. Star War's script said Obi Wan was dead...
And they were! Gad. It's like no one ever heard of resuscitation.
STEERING... No, wait. Someone already covered that. Never mind. ;)
Seems pretty clear that we should vote on this. Take a count, so Joss can easily access fan opinion on the subject. Of course, this isn't a yes or no question. There are degrees of faith involved here.
Enter you vote :
A) Wash MUST stay dead! Resurrection is the work of the devil, and “thou must not suffer a witch to live”. If I see Alan in the credits of the next movie, I’m bringing rope and kindling to the theater.
B) Wash SHOULD stay dead. No matter how you allow him to survive, it will cheapen the franchise, and I’m the kind of person who worries about cheapening franchises, subtext and social relevance in movies.
C) It’s O.K. to bring Wash back, IF it’s done in a clever and convincing manner. No visits to the Sacred MacGuffin or time travel or mind-melds… It must be elegant and believable in the real universe, the Firefly ‘verse, and the universe in which I live.
D) PLEASE bring Wash back in any way you can! If I can suspend my disbelief enough to believe in artificial gravity, or enough to believe that Jayne has a statue in his honor, then I’ll swallow whatever Joss dishes out and be grateful for it. Pander to me!
E) There IS NO FIREFLY without Wash. I won’t go to see any movie with less than the perfect cast. Well…I’ll probably still go, but I won’t buy the DVD. Who am I kidding? I’ll probably still buy the DVD…but I’ll keep it in a box in my garage with the Jon Pertwee “Doctor Who’s” and the George Lasenby “James Bond”! So there!
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E
p.s. glad to be of help PastorB
it's my insanity that keeps me sane hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
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I hope Wash is still alive. I trust Joss to do the best possible thing. One possibility that no one has mentioned is the blue hands guys. They weren't really mentioned much in the movie, but we know they are out there. They are just as interested in getting River back as anyone, probably more so. They may very well have been the ones to find Wash, and we already know that they are ruthless. They probably are lurking right behind the alliance ships, tracking the crew. They would not trust anyone to take care of the problem. Wash would be a good back up plan. Save him, hold him hostage as bait. Why keep chasing River all over the 'verse, when one hostage will bring the crew to them?
Rae
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rae:
I hope Wash is still alive. I trust Joss to do the best possible thing. One possibility that no one has mentioned is the blue hands guys. They weren't really mentioned much in the movie, but we know they are out there. They are just as interested in getting River back as anyone, probably more so. They may very well have been the ones to find Wash, and we already know that they are ruthless. They probably are lurking right behind the alliance ships, tracking the crew. They would not trust anyone to take care of the problem. Wash would be a good back up plan. Save him, hold him hostage as bait. Why keep chasing River all over the 'verse, when one hostage will bring the crew to them?
Rae
Unfortunately, I've heard that the "hands of blue" were taken care of in the graphic novels that cover the time between the end of the series and the start of the movie. I haven't read them myself, but the word is that they're gone. I don't know enough to say if it's likely that they'd just be replaced.
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Hi guys!
This is my first official browncoat action apart from buying the DVDs and trying to convert my friends - but (unfortunately), I've just seen both Firefly and Serenity for the first time about 2 week ago (but fortunately in the right order off the DVDs).
But I guess you're more interested In Wash than me, so here goes...
Most of you fail to mention that one of the main reasons why Wash was killed off is that from this point on the audience beliefs that anyone - or EVERYONE - may die. It did a very good job for Serenity as such.
Now, if there won't be a sequel, all is well, storytelling-wise. (Not emotinally-stable-wise for the fans, though.)
Noooow, if there is going to be a sequel in any form, things get more complicated.
WASH IS DEAD. In this case, which is far more believable, there will be the problem about Zoe that was mentioned earlier in this thread. She is defined by two persons - Mal and Wash. Now Wash is no more, so half of her "personality" is gone, and she'd be a very dull character (and therefore the most likely to be killed off next), especially since it was that mixture of loving, caring wife and stone-cold soldier that made her so interesting (Her legs help, too). Since Mal has already taken the role of the haunted struggling ex-military cynic, maybe she would channel her love to the crew as a whole, becoming a mother figure, which would also fill the void Book left to a certain degree.
WASH IS ALIVE!
The Serenity crashes. A Reaver ship obviously gets there first, since Wash is impaled by a harpoon. The crew leaves Wash for dead and hurries into the station.
The Reavers are on their tail, not interested in Wash since he's dead meat.
The Alliance is busybusybusy destroying the whole Reaver fleet - this must have happened one way or another, since Reavers never quit and the Alliance obviously came out on top of the tactical situation, allbeit too late. At least one alliance ship makes it to the landing bay in the middle of all this, finds Wash, waits for back-up (not really keen on having to go through Reavers to get to their targets when the latter might do their job for them and get decimated in the process.) and "save" Wash for questioning.
( I DO think they have the technology, since the Alliance fixed Book, and in almost every episode, someone gets shot or stabbed (well, mostly Mal) and they seem to be fine at the end of the episode, and that's with just the crappy medical equipment aboard the Serenity. )
The Operative finds an alternate route while the Reavers are now trapped - in the untruest sense of the word - between our crew and the Alliance. (The Alliance choses an alternate route that requires them to remove a wall). Just to wrap it up a bit.
So, Wash lives. It's still cheesy, although possible. So we need a twist. Like maybe it ISN'T that easy to repair damage to the spine, and Wash would be confined to a wheelchair.
Let's face it, he was just sitting around all day, anyways, so it wouldn't affect his role in the series that much - except for making it more interesting.
( I'm strictly speaking from a storyteller's POV, of course, since I love Wash, but face it, without conflict and suffering, there really is no story, in any genre, period. Of course, the Teletubbies prove that it can still be successfull, but, well, erm... Teletubbies.)
Anyways, this compromise is the most interesting way to go with Wash, imho. Not dead, but in a wheelchair. Fair enough.
But despite of what I think or wish or write on men's room walls, the way it's most likely going to go is that Wash is indeed dead and Zoe becomes the Crew's mother now that Book is gone, just like River is most likely the pilot now that Wash. Is. Dead. Extinct like the dinosaurs he liked to play with, if you like.
E's not pinin'! E's passed on! This pilot is no more! He has ceased to be! E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker! 'E's a stiff! Bereft of life, 'e rests in peace! If you hadn't nailed 'im to the perch 'e'd be pushing up the daisies! 'Is metabolic processes are now 'istor
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Nice monty python refernce but still STEERING COLUMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it's my insanity that keeps me sane hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
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Quote:
Originally posted by Guywhowantsafireflyofhisown:
Nice monty python refernce but still STEERING COLUMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it's my insanity that keeps me sane hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Now, let's be fair. Agatsu is saying that it's perfectly possible for Wash to have lived, at least medically.
While I disagree that he needs to die and stay dead, because Book still stays dead and that fullfills the requirement that we believe anyone could die at any second, I do agree that it's apparent that River is meant to fill Wash's job, if not his place in the family. (Whew, what a sentence!) Zoe's changing role in the family is beyond my interpersonal skills to predict, so I let it pass without comment.
Although, I would have gone with the "Bring out yer dead!" sketch from 'Grail, instead of the dead parrot reference. Perfect metaphor for this thread.
Pastorbadger: Bring out yer dead!
Random Thread Skeptic: Here you go.
Wash: I'm not dead yet!
Pastorbadger: What?
Random Thread Skeptic: Never mind him.
Wash: I think I'll go for a walk.
Random Thread Skeptic:You're not foolin' anyone, you know.
Pastorbadger: I can't take him if he's not dead.
and so on...
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Insane people never say they are insane. For them, everyone else is insane. So I'm not scared of people saying they're mad, because they aren't. And I can prove it, too!
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "or you wouldn't have come here."
See, Alice is insane! She thinks she's sane and the world around her mad, but SHE's totally coo-coo and MADE UP the world around her. (The Cat doesn't count as mad since she's just a figment of Alice's twisted mind, and in reality most likely perfectly sane, as far as cats go.)
A guy named American McGee picked up on that insanity concept and made a great PC game called "American McGee's Alice" a few years back, a GREAT and twisted game that's gonna be made into a movie in the next few years and potentially not suck. Actually, I was thinking that Summer would make an EXCELLENT Alice for that movie, but the last I heard they have their eyes set on Sarah Michelle Gellar. Not a wise choice imo.
What was my point again? Quick, I need a point to end this!
Right, you're not insane unless you're a figment of my imagination, which would mean I'd have to be insane in the first place, which I ain't - a statement which of course means that I potentially AM. Unless I disembowel you with a spoon or you see me standing 3 weeks in line to see another SW Episode, you'll never know.
What does all of this have to do with Wash?
He, well, ehm, he's insanely dead. Impaled by a Reaver harpoon. Nasty business. Almost as bad as being impaled by a steering column, but that would be silly.
Do we have prove it's a Reaver harpoon? It could have been the tip of some giant park cleaning guy's leaf-impaling-thingie, you know, and Wash had better kept his mouth shut about being a leaf on the wind, because leaves tend to get stabbed by those all the time after they land.
He was a leaf with its ass dead on the ground, and no god-fearing park-cleaning-guy with a stabby-thingie to pick up leaves with will let an opportunity like that go by. As an experienced pilot, Wash should have known that.
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Well, I think both Monty Python quotes fit the situation in their own way. "THIS IS AN EX-PILOT!" is an excellent tool to crush the futile hopes of optimistic Wash-Lovers (which is exactly what I needed it for), while "BRING OUT YOUR DEAD!" reflects the audience's feelings towards yet another "I didn't REALLY die in the last movie."-Scenario.
You don't have to disagree that Wash has to stay dead, because I would prefer him alive as well (yet in a wheelchair to damp down on the happy-happy.). I just ASSUME that Wash is gonna stay dead, but to be honest, it's not really in my jurisdiction. 
And about Zoe... what else would you do with her now that Wash is gone?
Let me rephrase that.
In which direction could her character go that still keeps her interesting?
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Quote:
Originally posted by pastorbadger:
C) It’s O.K. to bring Wash back, IF it’s done in a clever and convincing manner. No visits to the Sacred MacGuffin or time travel or mind-melds… It must be elegant and believable in the real universe, the Firefly ‘verse, and the universe in which I live.
C), that be my vote. Happily residing in the land of "It's perfectly plausible to bring Wash back in a believable and tasteful manner even though I know darn well that Joss likes to make us cry."
Quote:
E) There IS NO FIREFLY without Wash. I won’t go to see any movie with less than the perfect cast. Well…I’ll probably still go, but I won’t buy the DVD. Who am I kidding? I’ll probably still buy the DVD…but I’ll keep it in a box in my garage with the Jon Pertwee “Doctor Who’s” and the George Lasenby “James Bond”! So there!
Laughed so hard I scared my cat.... heh...
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