Why Wash is 100% alive and mostly well.
POSTED BY: pastorbadger
UPDATED: Thursday, November 22, 2007 09:57
VIEWED: 83595
PAGE 15 of 30
Once again, trying to hold my tongue. But here's some info for those of you confused.
There is a deleted scene that has Mal instructing Simon & Zoe to put book front n' center because they should 'honor him" in that way. It was cut because it seemed a little out of place. The blooper with Mal talking about the head ornament and Jayne not stealing all their crap is just that...a scene that screwed up and Nathan carried it on like he usually does.
Finally, to the Wash issue. Since some of you don't believe me and what I've posted in the past, I submit this for your reading pleasure. Direct from the shooting script:
INT. BRIDGE - CONTINUING
There is a moment of quiet.
WASH
I am a leaf on the wind. Watch --
A massive harpoon CRASHES through the windshield and impales him to his chair. It's as thick around as a telephone pole.
Wash has time to open his mouth in surprise before he is dead.
ZOE
WASH!
She moves to him.
-----
Okay, there you go, DEAD. Sorry kid, that's direct from Joss' fingers to the script and then to film.
When in doubt, read the script before the cuts in the film.
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Y'all are forgetting Reavers don't eat dead bodies. Recall in the very beginning of the movie Mal shoots the guy two reavers are holding and they throw the dead man down in disgust. Mal just denied them their meal in that case, so there's no reason for the reavers to chew on Wash or Mr. Universe post mortem.
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Originally posted by RocketJock:Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
Hey, Spike was toasted to ashes and Joss brought him back with a necklace.
Sorry, but The 'Verse is not the Buffyverse. River's psychic abilities aside, the 'Verse does not work by magic. And while the 'Verse's medical technology is admittedly far advanced over our own, the suggested combination of circumstances necessary to preserve Wash's life are so contrived as to require the use of an Infinite Improbability Drive.
My point was not that some magical method not in keeping with the 'verse would be utilized to reinstate Wash... but rather that if Joss wants to bring back a character, he will find a way.
In the Buffyverse, magic is an acceptable form of resurrection. In the Ff/S 'verse, Joss would use a method that was in keeping with the circumstances/technology of that world.
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I'm beginning to think that if Joss had shown us Wash being dismembered and eaten by Reavers, some folk would still be trying to think of a way to bring him back.
Now you're just being silly... heh...
We who are open to the return of Wash are not total moon brains! However, a dismembered and eaten Wash would still have some leftover bits laying around somewhere... cloning with an accelerated growth rate and reinstatement of previously stored memory/personality would fix things up nicely.
11th Hour
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Originally posted by Kizyr:
Hold on. We're operating under different senses of the word 'believable'. The characterization and acting are completely believable, which is why both series are really good; I was referring only to the background setting.
...unless you really do believe there are vampires afoot. Then we'll just have to diverge on this subject.
Well, I used to date a vampire... but that's a subject for a whole nuther thread...
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Well, a lot of that is handled simply by the development of artificial gravity. Most of the advances we see in Firefly couldn't've happened without it: terraforming, inertial dampeners, hovercrafts, etc. But, like you, I'll willingly not pry too much into the nitty-gritty of it, 'cause relateability is a lot more important than absolute realism.
Artificial gravity is fine and dandy for ships and such... but applying this to an entire planet or moon? Just seems highly doubtful. The power consumption would be enormous, even superdupergiganimous ("really really big" in Future Talk). Plus, if the mechanism that drives the artificial gravity ever konked out, you'd have a planet wide disaster.
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'Sides which, if I start asking Joss science questions, I'm gonna make him cry.
Yeah... it makes me cry when Joss cries. However, Joss laughs when we cry. Does that seem right to you?
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Well it's a lot more than that... Educated folks even in the 1500s could still find a lot of the things we have right now conceivable, and there are plenty of things firmly within the realm of believability on a 500-year time frame--among them, fusion power and artificial gravity.
Yeah, how 'bout them two guys in the 1500s who believed in advanced technology! They were cool.
Meanwhile, 99.99999999% of the population was changing the straw on the floor in their house once every year or so, left their excrement in jars outside their homes, and looked at goose entrails to divine the future...
But you're right. Right now we can conceive of advanced technology that doesn't exist... but there's all kinds of technology that hasn't even occurred to us yet. Those advances will be based on work and discoveries that will be surprising... perhaps even the result of "happy accidents".
Though it's the unhappy accidents I'm most concerned with...
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The specific example here, though, is with bringing back someone from the dead. We've already redefined what 'death' is in the last century alone. It's not when you stop breathing; it's not when your heart quits; and it's not when your brain quits, even. So I'm sure there'll be a narrowing of the gap between complete death and our standing definition of death within the next few centuries... but for that gap to be 30-minutes or more?
I thought death happened when you no longer dug Rock 'n Roll?
Anyhoo, it is true that presently "death" has more to do with the amount of time the brain is denied physical support. But who knows? In the future a way could be developed that can revive brain cells. The Alliance obviously has been doing all kinds of experiments with brains... so all sorts of advances could have been made with brain sciences.
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I'm gonna wager that both of us would want the same thing, though... It'd be great if Wash came back in a way that seemed plausible, and not cheap. And while I can't think of a way to make it happen, I wouldn't put it past Joss Whedon or Tim Minear to come up with a way.
Totally agree with you on that there point pardner.
It all comes down to Joss and Tim being great storytellers. The plausibility of bringing back Wash lies in the fact that, if done right, it would hold fascinating story possibilities.
We all missed out on so many great stories involving Wash because of Firefly's early demise. Part of the vindication of getting the 'verse back is to reclaim what was lost. I STILL want those stories.
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Now if sometime down the line Joss or Tim wanna kNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
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Originally posted by Leebo:
Y'all are forgetting Reavers don't eat dead bodies. Recall in the very beginning of the movie Mal shoots the guy two reavers are holding and they throw the dead man down in disgust. Mal just denied them their meal in that case, so there's no reason for the reavers to chew on Wash or Mr. Universe post mortem.
I'm a relative nebie at forums. I say "relative" because I do know what the word "newbie" means. I also know what a lurker is. But what do you call someone who reads only the first post or two, then jumps to the bottom with an opinion that's already been discounted?
I know what to call them on this thread : "common".
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STEERING COLUMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it's my insanity that keeps me sane hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
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Originally posted by FlipDog:
When in doubt, read the script before the cuts in the film.
You do realize that sometimes the movie is changed after the script is written, right?
Also, if Joss Whedon wants to change it later, that's his choice. All we're saying here is that it wouldn't be that far fetched for Wash to still be alive.
STEERING COLUMN!
"We may experience some slight turbulence, and then... explode."
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Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
Artificial gravity is fine and dandy for ships and such... but applying this to an entire planet or moon? Just seems highly doubtful. The power consumption would be enormous, even superdupergiganimous ("really really big" in Future Talk). Plus, if the mechanism that drives the artificial gravity ever konked out, you'd have a planet wide disaster.
That much is true; it's actually opened up a nice area for Serenity RPG players to fill in. The RPG book, at least, mentions that grav fields might be hard to set up, but are pretty cheap to keep going (hence why hovermules are decently economical). I know some others theorized that the 'bombing' of Shadow might've also involved shutting off their gravity and destroying the atmosphere.
Regardless, yes, it is something quite inconceivable for now. It's reliant on there actually being a cheap means by which to control gravity; who knows, there might not be. Or there might {^^}.
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Originally posted by 11thHour:
Yeah, how 'bout them two guys in the 1500s who believed in advanced technology! They were cool. Meanwhile, 99.99999999% of the population was changing the straw on the floor in their house once every year or so, left their excrement in jars outside their homes, and looked at goose entrails to divine the future...
This line made me snicker (in a good way). What you said next was pretty much on-key, though: we are in general a more educated population; education and literacy aren't just in the hands of the elite. But yeah, certain things are still hard to imagine.
I mean, fifty years ago we were pretty good with figuring what kind of technology was cutting-edge. But, how many people would've figured that by 2005 we'd have widespread cellphone and internet usage? Meanwhile, I'm thinking that a fair amount of people in 1969 would've figured that by now we'd have landed a man on Mars. So yeah, predicting technology can get iffy.
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Originally posted by 11thHour:
Anyhoo, it is true that presently "death" has more to do with the amount of time the brain is denied physical support. But who knows? In the future a way could be developed that can revive brain cells. The Alliance obviously has been doing all kinds of experiments with brains... so all sorts of advances could have been made with brain sciences.
This is something I've actually been thinking on a bit. It's not wholly inconceivable... Now I'm thinking, though, that it'd be harder to mesh the finality of Wash's death with the prospect of him coming back, than figuring out a plausable scientific (Firefly-scientific) way to revive him.
But, I got enough faith in Joss and Tim to do it right, realistic-wise or plot-wise, if they do it at all. KF
~KF
Lord, I'm walking your way. Let me in, for my feet are sore, my clothes are ragged.
Look in my eyes, Lord, and my sins will play out on them as on a screen. Read them all.
Forgive what you can and send me on my path. I will walk on until you bid me rest.
~Haven Prayer
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You do realize that sometimes the movie is changed after the script is written, right?
I know all too well. Its part of what I do for a living. Furthermore, this is the 'shooting script.' Most things don't change (with the exception of deleting scenes, etc.) from the shooting script to a cut of the film. All I'm stating is when the script says someone's dead, usually that means they're dead.
And yes, it is too far-fetched for him to still be alive. No argument thusfar has steered the conversation in that direction. A harpoon the size of a telephone pole is much bigger than the original diagram drawn a few days back. Not to mention that it says, he is dead. Joss has said that he is dead. Alan has said that he's dead.
Though, I'll say it again...they also all say that Alan isn't finished as Wash. However, as of the end of Serenity, his character is dead.
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I detest having to repeat myself STEERING COLUMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BURMA
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