Objects In Space.

POSTED BY: Bishop
UPDATED: Saturday, January 31, 2004 04:45
VIEWED: 12725
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DRAKON

Saturday, September 13, 2003 4:50 AM

Take a look at the hands when you see them through Serenity's windows before panning over to Kaylee's telling everyone about River.

The light is coming from the airlock. The hatch does not open directly into space, all the air in Serenity would get sucked out. There has to be an airlock.

Also, something I just noticed today. Note the coloring of the planet behind Serenity at the beginning, when the camera passes overhead, and River's jackball at the very end. The coloring is very similar, like she is not holding a ball, but an entire world. :)

Also, in "The Message" when Simon and River are in the booth with the Alien, wife turned to me and said "Simon looks good in a Sandman uniform."

"Where is my damn spaceship?"

DRAKON

Saturday, September 13, 2003 4:55 AM

Quote:

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This isn't at all thought out, but I always just figured that Kaylee didn't speak up because she didn't have any guilty/angry/upset kind of thoughts in her head at the time. She's a very happy person.
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Take another look at Kaylee's facial expression while Simon does his line about "still being there" That is not a happy Kaylee.

"Where is my damn spaceship?"

SERGEANTX

Sunday, September 14, 2003 6:06 AM

I think its less a matter of happy or sad, than of duplicity. Kaylee is as pure as they come... no guilt, no secrets. That's why River didn't have anything particular to read from Kaylee.

SergeantX

"..and here's to all the dreamers, may our open hearts find rest." -- Nanci Griffith

PAUSTARK

Tuesday, December 23, 2003 6:59 PM

After reading these posts I am wondering if River was picking up the thoughts of those harboring their greatest weakness within their subconcious.

Mal "It Doesnt mean a dam" Perhaps he felt the fight for Serenity was doomed and never admitted it.

Inara "Im a big girl..etc" She feels she has a need to prove she is more than just a companion but someone who can really contribute.

Book: "I dont care of your innocent..." Maybe he did something in the alliance, protested his innocence and lost everything and that led to his being a Shephard which he thought would better him, but it did not.

I know there are others whose thoughts she read, but I think this is enought comment for now, besides, I have to get back to work!!

ZACHSMIND

Tuesday, December 23, 2003 9:51 PM

Something to keep in mind when attempting to interpret the telepathic surface thoughts River gets early in the episode, when the actor delivers the line directly to the camera, s/he is referring to River when the line is said. If s/he is looking away from the camera, it's not directed towards River, but is in fact a thought that's more about the situation in general. Also, we're given this glimpse into River's mind for story purposes, to keep up off balance as the story builds up to the first real tense moment of the episode: where the branch turns into a gun. However, this is probably what's going on in River's mind all the time.

Go back to Ariel. As Simon and Jayne are escorting River in her wheelchair, she interjects that she believes that intern is accidently killing that patient. She knew that because if the director had allowed us River's POV in that moment, we probably would have heard the Intern lacking confidence in what he was doing and the patient was perhaps dreaming but sensing something in his body chemistry was changing. River's picking up on this along with the convetional conversation we're hearing. We may think she's insane, but she's acting rational towards her subjective sensory input. It just seems irrational to anyone else because they're not getting everything she's getting.

Also I'm not convinced this psychic stuff is actual mind reading so much as her conscious interpretation of unconscious calculations of probability, but that'd take a bit of time to explain. I think Joss Whedon has a perfectly pseudoscience way to explain River's behavior that doesn't involve conventional definitions of ESP, I'll leave it at that.

Wash/Zoe- This one doesn't really bear any explanation, I don't think. ;-)

Actually I think it does. Which one was the ocean and which one was violin? We get no actual words here. Just emotion, and it's so overwhelming it makes River ill. "She feels everything," as Simon put it in Ariel, "She can't not." So she's not getting words there for a reason. All she sensed was raw passion which simultaneously attracts her and repels her.

Jayne- "I got stupid. The money was too good."

These are the exact same words Jayne said to Mal at the end of Ariel. In the scene he is looking directly to the camera. He says them right to River. He suspects she knows but doesn't know she knows. It's what he would say to her if he knew she knew.

Simon- "I'd be there right now."

Again, he's looking directly at River when he says it. So this should be something he'd say to River if he could, but doesn't know how she'd take it so he doesn't say it. We know because of how River reacts later, and what she says, that this realization between the two of them is painful for them both. It's River's fault that Simon has had to throw away his career - his life, to save his sister. However, it's not her fault any more than it's his. It was ultimately his choice. The real fault is with the Men In Blue Gloves, but they can't do anything about it right now. This also goes back to Ariel. River said this to Simon just before he saved that guy from the incompetent intern. Simon was talking about all the talented and well-intentioned people in any hospital, and River said "where you should be right now" so this may be an echo of her sentiment in Simon's head.

Book- "I don't give half a hump if you're innocent or not. So where does that put you?"

This line is not directed to River. Notice that when they cut away from the telepathic line, Book is looking almost directly at the camera as he's laughing, which after the previous shot feels just as eerie cuz now we see Book as two-faced. He's laughing on the outside and is being jovial towards Jayne, but that's not what's really going on beneath the surface. Deep down we've seen a slice of Book as a very scary and heartless man.

In that scene and for the rest of the series after Ariel, there were multiple times when Jayne seemed to purposefully attempt to ingratiate himself towards Book. The two of them started

KELSO

Wednesday, December 24, 2003 5:08 AM

Over the past few days I have begun to develop a bit of an obsession with this episode (watched it 4 times in 3 days).

I agree with most everything that Shewhohathapen has said.

Here is how I see it...

Simon and Kaylee look up for a moment as River's physical body walks by and then resume thier conversation. River's mental self (for lack of a better term) lingers for a moment until she is distressed by the thought she hears in Simons mind.

While watching both Zoe and Wash and Mal and Inara, she is overwhelmed by the waves of feelings that she experiances. When she runs away she is in fact withdrawing back into her physical self, which is when she discovers an object in her hand (which is symbolized by stepping on a twig). She studies the object for a moment but she does not associate it with the meaning that everyone else does... death. It is simply an object.

The theme running throughout the episode is the meanings that we imbue to objects. A room, a gun, mean different things to different people. River no longer experiances the world as we do. Some of the meanings that we generally associate with specific objects are lost to her.

There are a few things about the ep. that still elude me...

#1: Why does Early taste the ship? Is it that he suddenly felt that something was wrong? Perhaps he had experianced the ship with each of his other senses but suddenly realised that he had neglected one. Is there a deaper meaning here?

#2: How does Inara know that Early is tired? On the surface it would seem that she is simply trying to persuade him to give up this hunt and leave them alone... but I can't help but feel that there is a deaper meaning that Joss intended that is running under the surface.

Well, here I am.

MISGUIDED BY VOICES

Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kaythryn:
This isn't at all thought out, but I always just figured that Kaylee didn't speak up because she didn't have any guilty/angry/upset kind of thoughts in her head at the time. She's a very happy person.

Watched the sequence last night, and oddly, Kaylee stares straight at River when Simon speaks. Its a look that says quite a lot; that River is the reason that she and Simon get so close and then drive each other apart (note that its Kaylee on screen when River says "be who they want to be with")

"I threw up on your bed"

MISGUIDED BY VOICES

Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:29 PM

[quoute]#1: Why does Early taste the ship? Is it that he suddenly felt that something was wrong? Perhaps he had experianced the ship with each of his other senses but suddenly realised that he had neglected one. Is there a deaper meaning here?

Early simply doesn't seem to think as we think - he has to experience something totally, and acts on impulse as we see. Unlike River, who has blocks in her mind that break down at points, Early seems to have no such thing - he thinks it he does it. Hence he loved the dog but he hurt the dog.

Quote:
#2: How does Inara know that Early is tired? On the surface it would seem that she is simply trying to persuade him to give up this hunt and leave them alone... but I can't help but feel that there is a deaper meaning that Joss intended that is running under the surface.

Early clearly sees that its a ruse - suggests that Companions may have some method of speaking (perhaps a like the "voice" in Dune) that is persuasive, and Early recognises it early (sorry) enough to disrupt her.

"I threw up on your bed"

SHINY

Friday, January 23, 2004 5:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bishop:
ok, lets focus on what we do know..

the gun belongs to jayne. it was in his weapon area next to his bunk, and was stored unloaded(doesnt make much sense that it would have been unloaded, I think it was loaded, knowing Jayne, and that it maybe just wasnt chambered and this is what Mal was referring to when he said "loaded").

Well, he had to load one of his guns when the Reaver ship was approaching in 'Serenity', so we know that at least some of those guns on his wall are not left loaded at all times.

RIVER
Purple elephants are flying.
MAL
Good. Thanks for the update.

SHINY

Friday, January 23, 2004 5:21 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Misguided By Voices:
Early clearly sees that its a ruse - suggests that Companions may have some method of speaking (perhaps a like the "voice" in Dune) that is persuasive, and Early recognises it early (sorry) enough to disrupt her.

Perhaps the mystery vial is a drug that gives her this Dune-Like (or god help us Love-Potion-Number-8-Like) voice power...

RIVER
Purple elephants are flying.
MAL
Good. Thanks for the update.

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