An analysis of the illusion of freedom

POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Friday, April 24, 2026 16:13
VIEWED: 7512
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RUE

Saturday, February 18, 2006 6:38 AM

Do you want to be an a**hole by presuming you know them?

I do know them. They are people who've been on this board a long time. Their views, jobs, and to some extent their personal lives are known to me.

You on the other hand know jack about me.

I work on city commissions - for free. I'm a union steward - for free. I spend a great deal of my 'free' time caring for ill family members who ultimately are not my legal responsibility. I hold down a full time job. I give to causes I believe in. I vote in every single election. I put my money, my time, my life where my mouth is.

And you - well, now I know you're just an asshole.

Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

FLETCH2

Saturday, February 18, 2006 7:15 AM

So which of the many hats you wear makes you the judgemental jerk?

I knew a guy once who matched your resume almost exactly, counciller, union rep, small town politician. He was without doubt one of the most corrupt individuals I have ever known and every one of those "noble public works" either lined his pocket or was a way to enhance his standing so you will forgive me if I don't immediately fall to your feet in shame.

The point, which you miss or ignore is that people will tolerate almost any system that doesn't actively persecute them. Why? Because most regular human types have a need for stability because it takes a long time to raise children. As long as the system you live under lets you clothe, feed and educate your children anything extra is just gravy. If these folk let you down because they fail to follow your lead on what constitutes "freedom" for you well that's just too bad. They have important things to do sorry.

There is one title a man can have that is far greater than any of your "great works" hell it's more important than President of the US F*** A. That's the title of husband and father. If doing that job and providing for the family means the guy doesnt share your love of abstract freedoms or sells out to "the Man" well sometimes that's just the cost of doing the job.

If that means that they let you down, if that means they are the sheep in your little scenario then whoop to you.

You can dump a skunk in rose oil and he still stinks. You can have any honorific you like and you are still a Jerk.

RUE

Saturday, February 18, 2006 7:27 AM

I don't get paid for most of what I do - except for my regular "real" job which supports the household. I'm not a politician, I'm a yeoman. I don't get honorifics. I don't get influence, take bribes, or get or make deals.

My family BTW adores me - because I am always, always there - in my book family comes first.

My energy level takes a beating b/c I take up more than I should. Not b/c of what it gets me but b/c I don't believe in criticizing, I believe in action.

I don't look down on those for whom managing day to day is all-consuming. I was that once and that could have been my entire life. I acknowledge I have had advanatges that others don't - mostly a family that revered education and told me I was smart enough to learn. And white skin.

I look down on the bastards who bleed people every day as part of doing business. And I despise the bastards who support the leaches.

BTW - I am now a chemist, not a legal/political schmoozer.

Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

FLETCH2

Saturday, February 18, 2006 7:49 AM

I'm not implying anything about you, just saying "good works" is not always the same as "good man." Learnt that lesson early. I don't think that our backgrounds are that dissimilar and if I misinterpreted your point then I apologise. However, I can't stand some of the pseudo interlectual claptrap badmouthing the average Joe for not being politically active enough. A lot of these guys are busy doing things for their families and to my mind that's a valid reason. If you have the time and energy to do more, good for you. If politics stinks it's because bad folks run it and by all means complain, protest and educate but don't blaime your fellow citizens if they just want to pay the next round of bills and raise their kids.

PIRATEJENNY

Saturday, February 18, 2006 10:00 AM

Quote:
Sure we can badmouth the government and not get hauled off to prison, or get beheaded for our views, but it depends on how high your status, and even what your race, or gender is, or political leanings are that determines your "unspoken level of freedom.

I totally agree with your whole post!!

I spend the majority of my time between a full time job and school, and I could think of 20 things off the top of my head I would rather be doing. I'm not free and your probably not free either, People with money have more choices , which equals more freedom. The reality of the situation and I think this is espeically true for most Americans who are brainwashed from the time they are old enough to walk to think we are free, but really the less money you have the less power and the less choice you have ,which equals less freedom. most of us are so busy working and consuming that we don't give our freedoms or lack of freedom any real consideration.

I think part of the real illusion for most Americans is that many people in this country enjoy a higher standard of living,(then say a person in a third world country such as Mexico, even people living in the inner city ghettos and rual areas have a t.v and access to running water and electricity for the most part. As the standard of living, for the middle class in this country startto decline people will start to take a closer look at their freedoms.

SIGNYM

Saturday, February 18, 2006 3:51 PM

Quote:
The point, which you miss or ignore is that people will tolerate almost any system that doesn't actively persecute them. Why? Because most regular human types have a need for stability because it takes a long time to raise children. As long as the system you live under lets you clothe, feed and educate your children anything extra is just gravy. If these folk let you down because they fail to follow your lead on what constitutes "freedom" for you well that's just too bad. They have important things to do sorry.

There is one title a man can have that is far greater than any of your "great works" hell it's more important than President of the US F*** A. That's the title of husband and father. If doing that job and providing for the family means the guy doesnt share your love of abstract freedoms or sells out to "the Man" well sometimes that's just the cost of doing the job.

Fletch, you're normally an insightful person but I really have to disagree on this point. There is no cost to thinking differently. No fee, no arrest, no argument, no lost wages, no unattended children.... no problem. Sure we may be forced to participate in the system and in many ways we may not be free to express our views, but nothing says we "must" believe in it.

And, speaking of work- I have a work emergency and I have to go.

---------------------------------
Free as in freedom, not beer.

SIGNYM

Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:14 PM

To continue- but it's so much easier to sit on the couch and gain insight from that cyclops that most people give a place of honor in their living rooms. I swear, if an instant tragedy were to befall much of the world and archaeologists were to dig us up afterwards, they might wonder about that "shrine" in the largest room of many houses in thew world- the one that family members spend hours in front of every day.

I have a special gripe about TV. Sure it occasionally brings us great shows like Firefly but it's a choke-point of information. Not only can it be - and is- easily manipulated to present an narrow (wealthy, ultraviolent, non-working, superficial) view of the world it prevents us from going out and finding out for ourselves because it is so seductive. And yet strangely, altho people watch TV to "unwind" and "relax", the more people watch TV the more agitated and depressed they feel, and the harder time they have falling asleep no matter WHAT the content. I used to think that Marshall McLuhan (The Medium is the Massage) was full of bull but now I think of TV as velvet handcuffs or a mass drug.

So add TV to the "illusion of freedom": it makes you feel that you can choose your experience but it modifies you instead.

---------------------------------
Free as in freedom, not beer.

CHRISISALL

Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
So add TV to the "illusion of freedom": it makes you feel that you can choose your experience but it modifies you instead.

I agree. The only shows I ever watch (Infrequently) are on PBS, usually science-related. The only other use I have for cyclops is to play my Firefly and Dark Angel DVD's

.

And my son likes Cyberchase Chrisisall

DREAMTROVE

Saturday, February 18, 2006 6:33 PM

Fletch,

While I try to stick to annoying you on my own behalf, and I'm grateful that you've given up paying much attention to what I post, I'm going to briefly butt in here and say "Stop beating up on Rue."

GEEZER

Saturday, February 18, 2006 9:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Fletch,

While I try to stick to annoying you on my own behalf, and I'm grateful that you've given up paying much attention to what I post, I'm going to briefly butt in here and say "Stop beating up on Rue."

With all respect to Rue, she has never had any problem "beating up on" people her ownself, nor any hesitation to do so (please note who threw out the first "a**hole" above). I could show you my own contusions, but...

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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