An analysis of the illusion of freedom
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Friday, April 24, 2026 16:13
VIEWED: 7512
PAGE 4 of 9
Quote:"The crux was that all that was promised for abiding by the rules was equal opertunity
I saw an interesting interview with Newt Gingrich where he said that Americans don't have a "Social Contract" like may exist in the rest of the world. I forgot what he called it but the crux was that all that was promised for abiding by the rules was equal opertunity
This sounds suspiciously like a social contract.
And this is one of the biggest fibs- because we DO have a social contract, we just don't acknowledge it. Because if we did, we might examine it, and if we did that, we might actually change it.---------------------------------
Free as in freedom, not beer.
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Quote:SignyM, you hit it spot-on.
Originally posted by SignyM:
Others engage in the illusion of freedom through the endless choices of consumerism, or gun ownership, or even physical fitness.
Everyone has their own recipe for sublimation, denial, or sheer perceptual transmutation.
Some, I suspect, even use the abusee mentality of "It's what we deserve".
It all makes sense 'till something happens, and you lose that four bedroom house and BMW.
It's all about the Benjemins Chrisisall
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For those in denial, this non-freedom is a non-issue.
It only becomes real when something happens to THEM.
These are the same people who claim that all is right with the US but choose not to go downtown after dark.
You can't reason with them, since they block out massive chunks of reality. They prefer to keep their vision tightly focused on the little things they want to see.
Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.
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Quote:We need to give out those special sunglasses from "They Live", what?
Originally posted by rue:
They prefer to keep their vision tightly focused on the little things they want to see.
Delerious Chrisisall
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The problem with this entire notion is defining the notion of "free." I would argue that men in a society are never "free" that the need to conform to group social and religious norms actually involve reliquishing some freedom. Further, if you are born into a society you never even get the choice of accepting it's norms, you are indoctrinated with them as a matter of course. Your only opertunity to redress that is to leave.
So when were you or your ancestors ever "free?" 1776? Not if you were black and even if you were white you in most states you didnt get to vote unless you owned property. During a monarchy? Not really, then a large number of the people that lorded over you did so purely based on their ancestry? Feudal times as a chattel made to work someone else's land? Guess not.
You may be right that democracy is a choice between two wolves but it is a choice, this isnt the wolf that claims to rule because God says so. If the other wolk is less hungry you at least get to choose him. It is what it is. If you want to be free, learn to fix diesel and two stroke engines and go live on a polynesian island, the fact that you will probably be the only person for 300 miles of ocean is about the best you can do.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
[
My impression is that you live in the UK. Is that true?
Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.
I'm English but I live in Texas
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Quote:Of course we are never "free". We're constrained by our need for air, water, food, and shelter. We're constrained by our inability to fly, breathe water, or burrow. If we live in society we conform to its rules. But freedom doesn't necessarily mean rebelling aginst all constraints. Choosing a total opposite in some way binds you to the thing you're opposing. Freedom may be the ability to CHOOSE the constraints that we live under, as opposed to having them placed on us.
The problem with this entire notion is defining the notion of "free."
---------------------------------
Free as in freedom, not beer.
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Define constraints, define others?
PN seems to have a problem with the idea that you should ban people from driving for DUI. I would prefer it if drunk drivers were not on the roads I drive on or near the people I love. If I -- and by I I mean myself and society--- decide to ban drunk drivers we have by definition curtailed the freedom of PN to have a few beers and drive home.
That's really the issue here. At a big or small level we make rules so that we can live together without killing each other. In most places the majority decides those rules, even if that means 1000 soccer moms fraid little Jimmy will be run down outvote PN in his wish to have a few beers and then drive. By definition when we make rules the folks that would break them won't like them, the people that wont will not see it as a curtailing of their freedom. I don't drink and drive, so laws that say I will be punished if I do have no effect on my freedom. That doesn't make me subservient that just means that for me it is not an issue.
When something comes along that outlaws something I might want to do then yes I get upset so in a way you are right to suggest that people dont worry about this stuff until it effects them but consider if you were consistant and opposed any law that restricted anyone from doing anything? Then you would have to back dealer's rights to sell drugs or pedophiles rights to chat up kids at school yards.
It is what it is.
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"At a big or small level we make rules"
That is the democratic ideal. OTOH I think Americans live in a system $ 1 = 1 vote. The rich have power over the laws the rest have to live by.
The issue is not whether or not people have to live by 'rules'. It's whether or not they decide on them or get them imposed.
Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fletch2:
Feudal times as a chattel made to work someone else's land?
I hear that in Feudal times the amount of time the lower classes had to devote to working the lords land instead of their own was less than what we know pay in tax, if that makes any sense. Maybe they were better off...
There's also the fact that people could become Freemen...
Chris:
Is they live that film with the aliens that you can only tell they're aliens with the glasses?
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
You should never give powers to a leader you like that you’d hate to have given to a leader you fear
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