Which episodes should I watch?

POSTED BY: VisitingMyIntentions
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 15, 2006 11:49
VIEWED: 7537
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TORTIMER

Tuesday, January 24, 2006 2:11 AM

I feel similar to the OP. Buffy is one of my all time favorite TV series. I do like Angel but nothing even close to as much as I like Buffy.

AMYEL

Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:53 AM

Wesley becomes so awesome, you just have no idea. His silliness goes away very quickly after he shows up in L.A. If you think you'll never forgive him for what he did to Faith, you have to watch Five by Five. Faith deals with that in her own special way. She teaches us all about the five basic torture groups. Lots of things to learn and know. ;-) That episode starts Wesley on his path to becoming a badass. Wesley is just so screwed up and nothing ever goes right for him. How he never actually outright killed himself is a miracle. He also had the uncanny ability to get hotter the worse his life became.

But anyways, I wouldn't judge Angel, Cordelia, and Wesley by their characters on BTVS. They change a lot. I hated Angel on BTVS because he was the boring, kinda stalkery, letch of a too-old-boyfriend, but once he had his own show he got a lot better. Boreanaz's acting gets better around actors in which he has good chemistry--especially Darla and Spike. Angel is such a prick, but also a complete loveable dork. I like how he has complexity and a lack of complexity all at the same time.

As for must-see episodes, I would definitely recommend the previously mentioned Five By Five/Sanctuary arc (it's kind of like the sequel to Who are You/This Year's Girl), the Angel/Darla episodes of season 2-- Dear Boy, Darla, The Trial, Reunion, Redefinition, and then throw in some Reprise in there for good measure because it's sort of hot. I would also say Lullaby from season 3, but then that would just confuse the hell out of anyone who hadn't seen anything that came before it in that season. And then it's mandatory to watch anything where Angel/Spike have a scene just to themselves in Angel season 5. Their "alone" moments are gorgeous... not just in a homoerotic sort of way (though that is kinda sexy), but the actors work so well together and the characters have a very fascinating relationship that deals with history, jealousy, sibling rivalry, and understanding.

Angel does choose to be mopey and broody. The issues of guilt and redemption are huge themes on the show. It plays off his human (and green demon) friends, who in contrast, have not murdered thousands of people for fun and don't feel the need to redeem themselves by being heroes; they genuinely want to do good. In season five it gets especially fascinating when Angel is sort of compared/contrasted with Spike, who is much more pragmatic in his approach to redemption.

I love all of Joss's shows for different reasons. For Angel... for me it's all about the hot vamp action, plus Wesley.

VISITINGMYINTENTIONS

Monday, January 30, 2006 1:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by amyel:
Wesley becomes so awesome, you just have no idea. His silliness goes away very quickly after he shows up in L.A. If you think you'll never forgive him for what he did to Faith, you have to watch Five by Five. Faith deals with that in her own special way. She teaches us all about the five basic torture groups. Lots of things to learn and know. ;-) That episode starts Wesley on his path to becoming a badass. Wesley is just so screwed up and nothing ever goes right for him. How he never actually outright killed himself is a miracle. He also had the uncanny ability to get hotter the worse his life became.

Hotter? Really? Because I found fluttery condescending control freak much more endearing than broody condescending control freak (that goes for Angel as well). I don't understand, having only met Fred in season 5, why she would go for the guy. I don't know what history was between them, but I understand she was previously involved with Gunn. If she has to be romantically attached to anyone, why not the hot warrior-lawyer who knows his Gilbert & Sullivan?

Quote:
But anyways, I wouldn't judge Angel, Cordelia, and Wesley by their characters on BTVS. They change a lot. I hated Angel on BTVS because he was the boring, kinda stalkery, letch of a too-old-boyfriend, but once he had his own show he got a lot better. Boreanaz's acting gets better around actors in which he has good chemistry--especially Darla and Spike. Angel is such a prick, but also a complete loveable dork. I like how he has complexity and a lack of complexity all at the same time.

I didn't really see Angel change much at all (except for stopping dating underage girls). I must admit, juxtapose Cordy with Angel and you really get to appreciating her a lot more. She and Harmony both get to shine a lot more on the new show.

Quote:
As for must-see episodes, I would definitely recommend the previously mentioned Five By Five/Sanctuary arc (it's kind of like the sequel to Who are You/This Year's Girl), the Angel/Darla episodes of season 2-- Dear Boy, Darla, The Trial, Reunion, Redefinition, and then throw in some Reprise in there for good measure because it's sort of hot.

I've seen the Faith stuff (wasn't too impressed, sorry), but thanks for elaborating on which episodes cover the Darla arc. I was curious about it, but the only one I knew of was the obviously titled "Darla."

Quote:
I would also say Lullaby from season 3, but then that would just confuse the hell out of anyone who hadn't seen anything that came before it in that season. And then it's mandatory to watch anything where Angel/Spike have a scene just to themselves in Angel season 5. Their "alone" moments are gorgeous... not just in a homoerotic sort of way (though that is kinda sexy), but the actors work so well together and the characters have a very fascinating relationship that deals with history, jealousy, sibling rivalry, and understanding.

I've finished S5 now, and I loved all the Angel/Spike (although not in a particularly slashy fashion..."except for that once" ;). I think at times they rather flattened Spike's character, but it was enjoyable nonetheless. Actually, my favourite not ex-BtVS character was Illyria. It's sad she had so little time to develope. So how 'bout another season, then, eh?

"it has some sweet character deaths -- I mean moments!" - Joss Whedon

AMYEL

Monday, January 30, 2006 10:46 PM

Hotter? Really? Because I found fluttery condescending control freak much more endearing than broody condescending control freak

His smoldering hot pain (aka the Scruffy years) took place in the latter half of season 3 and then most of season 4. (Personally, I'm not a big fan of those seasons, but WesAngst makes it worthwhile for me) Since you've seen season 5, you know that Angel had his friend's memories modified... so Wesley's angstiness was taken away quite a bit. Once he gets his real memories back he just goes sort of crazy, so that's not really his hot self either.

I don't understand, having only met Fred in season 5, why she would go for the guy. I don't know what history was between them, but I understand she was previously involved with Gunn. If she has to be romantically attached to anyone, why not the hot warrior-lawyer who knows his Gilbert & Sullivan?

Wesley and Fred have known each other since late season 2 (that's when Fred shows up). They never got together before because Wesley sucks at timing. First he was sort of freaked out by his actions during the events in "Billy" (a great Wes-centric episode), and then later Fred got REALLY freaked out by Wes's actions later on in season 3. Then their memories were modified, which made it easier for them to get together in "Smile Time."

Fred not being with Gunn anymore was due to events surrounding a murder that happened in "Supersymmetry." What it really was was that they had idealized each other and once that pedestal they had put each other on came down, they sort of fizzled after that.

GARYPRYKE

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 1:07 PM

Just start at Season 5 because it is a very good jumping on point for anyone (including people who've seen neither Buffy nor Angel). If you watch any of Season 4 your head will explode unless you start for Season 1. Please do not test this theory, once your head gets all exploded you're screwed.

KWICKO

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 4:23 AM

I'm no doubt a sucker, because Angel pulled me in pretty early. I say this having NEVER had the desire to even see the show when it was still on the air. I only came to Angel after getting hooked on Buffy - again after that show was over. I remember thinking and saying that "Angel" was one of the stupidest show ideas I'd ever heard when it came out - and feeling much the same about Buffy.

Then I caught a few eps of BTVS on the FX network in syndication last summer, and the wit and writing just sucked me right in, like few other shows ever have. In the space of a few short weeks, I was buying Buffy seasons on DVD, then decided I *had* to see Angel just to stay current on the Buffy stuff. That's what I told myself - "I'll just watch this so I don't miss anything in the GOOD show." Yeah. Right.

By midway through S1 of Angel, I was hooked into that world as well. Watching Angel wasn't a chore; it was a reward! I looked forward as much to the next disk of Angel as I did the next one of Buffy. Some episodes of each were harder to get through than others, but all were entertaining, and some were brilliant. And at the end of each series, I wanted more. Actually, I thought Buffy had a pretty great finale. And the Angel finale was AMAZING, even though they thought they were coming back for another season at the time. I'd like to see more of the Buffyverse, but if it all ended with "Not Fade Away", it was a hell of an note to go out on.

For me, it was all worth it, every single minute. Towards the end of Angel S5, there was a moment that just seemed to sum up perfectly the relationship between Spike and Angel. It's a sort of "Last Supper" scene, with all the major players meeting around a conference table in Angel's office. Angel says, "One of you will betray me..." And immediately Spike's hand shoots up, volunteering! :) No words were even necessary for Spike; we got to see the penultimate snapshot of their "friendship", and where it had led them.

Mike

A baby seal walks into a club...

GARYPRYKE

Wednesday, March 15, 2006 11:49 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
And the Angel finale was AMAZING, even though they thought they were coming back for another season at the time.

At the time the episode was being written they knew they weren't coming back. If you examine the plot you'll notice that the whole idea of Angel having his destiny taken away from him is kind of like the Show having it's destiny taken away since there would not be a Season 6. I have read some Joss thoughts on Season 6 and what would have happened if you want to know.

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