Firefly is an 'Outlaw Star' rip-off!!! (apparently)
POSTED BY: Daz
UPDATED: Tuesday, February 17, 2015 08:53
VIEWED: 39795
PAGE 4 of 6
Quote:Well said! Nothin' wrong with it, as long as it's acknowledged...
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
I don't know about Outlaw Star, but it will go on to my next-to-watch list, because Cowboy Bebop was awesome. Firefly is also awesome. This is another nifty idea that merits being done more that once.
COWBOY BEBOP - Homages & Influences - Sessions 1-13
http://rfblues.aaanime.net/Omake/Influences/
I went and looked up this Outlaw Star, and when I saw this...
http://usera.imagecave.com/cljohnston108/CowboyBebop_OutlawStar/17melf
ina.JPG
...I just went "Oh. My. GAWD!"
I have to say, though, regardless of who used it first, the idea of having the person curled up in the fetal position is a stroke of genius: Nobody would ever suspect there's a human body in there, because the container is not in the typical coffin shape!
Some other fun things I noticed...
•Mal & Crew refer to Serenity as a "boat", and the Bebop actually floats!
•The Bebop also has a great big, flat, aerodynamics-killer of a cargo door facing front (but the Bebop's is on top), and a roomy cargo bay (also a rotating ring at its midsection)...
•In Cowboy Bebop, A hyperspace gate between the Earth and the Moon exploded 50 years prior, partially shattering the Moon...
•In Cowboy Bebop, the Internet has evolved into the massive Solar System Web (SSW), accessed by nifty little book-like terminals.
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Cowboy Bebop rocks. Outlaw Star is ok.
I don't think FireFly is a rip off, I just think it's more like great minds thinking alike. It wouldn't surprise me if someone who was involved in the creative process had seen Bebop. It reminded me A LOT of Bebop, which is one of my favourite shows next to FireFly and the main reason I checked FireFly out.
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Quote:Absolutely!
Originally posted by philyburkhill:
I don't think FireFly is a rip off, I just think it's more like great minds thinking alike.
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Holy friggin crap! Similarities between unrelated media! Will the sky not crack and fall? Will sow take flight and fire rain upon us?
Come on people, do you honestly think seeing traces of a possible influence in a series means that much? I know naught a person who saw Spaceballs and said "What the hell? They totally ripped off Star Wars..."
I wrote a song a couple days ago and was surprised to find an entire sentence verbatim in a song that I listen to nearly everyday. I didn't steal the sentence, I was influenced subconsciously towards it. If Joss wrote for River to be in a box, he isn't going to change it just because it's been done before. Even if he did intend for the connection to Outlaw star, it wasn't maliciously. Whoever thinks he 'stole' the material shouldn't even be commenting on it, they obviously haven't seen both sides of the matter. I've watched both Outlaw Star and Cowboy Bebop and I can say firsthand that both are quality anime, but fail in comparison to Firefly's depth. Intentional or not, the only bad guys here are the people who can't get over themselves and weigh things proportionally here.
It sounds like Wikipedia needs a few more Browncoats to me.
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I remember reading how the idea for Firefly came from Cowboy Bebop. Again, very few similarities, apart from the 'space western' theme.
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As a fan of Outlaw Star (I'm currently rewatching it courtesy of Netflix), I can see where they see the similarities. The crew flies around on the universe's most advanced spaceship, aliens abound, there are magic using pirates and assassins, the crew is hunting for a mystical treasure, and in the first episode they found a naked girl (android really) in a box. Well, one out of five ain't bad.
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I'm probably doing the devil's work here giving him publicity and all but here's the latest version on the content first put up a couple months ago on the main Firefly article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Staxringold/Firefly
For the minority who are so inclined, this will cement their conviction that Firefly is not a homage to or even influenced by Outlaw Star. It is pure plagarism.
For the majority, if they are willing to waste their time in reading this tripe, they will see the ramblings of an anime fundamentalist determined to make the assertion that anime is the only art worth seeing and everything else is either derivative or pitifully inferior. The majority will laugh at the bad grammar, mispellings and the rather primary school quality of the arguments.
For the record, the primary influence for Firefly had nothing to do with Outlaw Star, Cowboy Bebop or anime at all. Not one single reference. The primary influence was from the book "The Killer Angels" which is an account of the Battle of Gettysburg. You can read about here on this very site:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/news.asp?newsid=234
Further, Joss has stated elsewhere that during the time leading up to Firefly, he didn't have time to watch other works let alone anime. When you're writing, directing, executive producing and constantly involved in the creative process of two hit TV shows at once, I doubt you would have the time either.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Daz:
For the minority who are so inclined, this will cement their conviction that Firefly is not a homage to or even influenced by Outlaw Star. It is pure plagarism.
Indeed it is. Pure plagiarism that looks to me like the ramblings of an adolescent. "The title of Firefly is the class of the main character's ship. The title of Outlaw Star is the name of the main character's ship." Where are my shackles? Joss must be detained.
And yes, I did laugh. "Both are aided for the majority of the series by someone other than the person who originally stole them..." Serious business, plagiarism is.
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Quote:Yikes!
Originally posted by Angelcrusherd:
Holy friggin crap! Similarities between unrelated media! Will the sky not crack and fall? Will sow take flight and fire rain upon us?
Quote:Ummmm, apparently not nearly as much as denying any traces of it.
Come on people, do you honestly think seeing traces of a possible influence in a series means that much?
Quote:Right, because Spaceballs was advertised as a parody of Star Wars.
I know naught a person who saw Spaceballs and said "What the hell? They totally ripped off Star Wars..."
Quote:Reminds me of the Bolton/Isley fiasco. Funny how the entire Isley Brothers version isn't available in any form (that I can find). There's just a tiny sample of them repeating the five-words, "Love is a wonderful thing", over and over...
I wrote a song a couple days ago and was surprised to find an entire sentence verbatim in a song that I listen to nearly everyday. I didn't steal the sentence, I was influenced subconsciously towards it.
http://ccnmtl.columbia.edu/projects/law/library/cases/case_threeboysbo
lton.html
I never saw any similarity, beyond the title.
Quote:And whoever thinks we're saying he 'stole' the material shouldn't even be commenting on it, because all that's being said is that there are some cool elements shared by these separate works. (At least, that's the direction I'm trying to steer this discussion towards)
If Joss wrote for River to be in a box, he isn't going to change it just because it's been done before. Even if he did intend for the connection to Outlaw star, it wasn't maliciously. Whoever thinks he 'stole' the material shouldn't even be commenting on it, they obviously haven't seen both sides of the matter.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firefly_(television_series)#Notes
"Some fans have compared Firefly to the anime series Outlaw Star in its style and execution (and certain story content and plot devices). Trigun and Cowboy Bebop also have a similar setting. Most of these similarites are very general, or common to the "Sci-Fi/Western" genre. See also Science fiction Western for a list of other fiction which combines these two genres."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_fiction_Western
Quote:
Intentional or not, the only bad guys here are the people who can't get over themselves and weigh things proportionally here.
No bad guys here. Just an honest brawl between folk.
Although, proportionally-speaking, the ones who perhaps need to get over themselves are those who interpret an acknowledgement of "general similarities" as an accusation of plagiarism.
Quote:It sounds like Wikipedia needs a few less panic-prone Browncoats to me.
It sounds like Wikipedia needs a few more Browncoats to me.
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I haven't denied any trace of similarity between Firefly and anything, but that's all it is. The kid who wrote the Wiki article might merely be comparing the two, however weird it might make him, which is why I don't care that it exists. And anything I do online is far from panic induced, I'm only online when I have nothing else to do. I don't appreciate any accusation that Joss isn't genuine, but as long as it stays at a comparison level, I'll keep laughing and keep my big boy talk elsewhere.
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