Chrisisall, come save me! Let's talk Plot Holes.
POSTED BY: mima
UPDATED: Wednesday, October 5, 2005 16:14
VIEWED: 14937
PAGE 3 of 5
When Mal first bumps into Simon after yelling at Kaylee about crashing he says "Guess I need to get innocked 'fore we hit plenetside" so i figure it's a simple protective injection against strange diseases.
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13. mr. universe clearly lived on some sort of a compound, richly equipped. where are all the people? why was the compound intact after the operative left it? as in, at haven, everything was destroyed.
The novelization of the movie answers that...
Mr. Universe told the planet in an official Alliance message (cuz hes an uber hacker...so he can do that) that they were un-terraforming...so they evacuated with everythings still intact. My Universe swooped down and obtained the planet. That cloud covering it keeps any suspicious people away...since it was officially de-terraformed and no longer was habitable.
Just read the book..lol
~~~~~~~~~~
"There is a sense that this is still not over. It's hard to put a finger on what's so special about this project and about this group of people, but it's just one of those things you have to trust in, and relish. I am very, very proud."
---Jewel Staite on "Firefly" and "Serenity" in "Finding Serenity" (essay collection by Jane Espenson)
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Oops, I see I misinterpreted question 7, about leaving someone aboard Serenity. I read it as applying to their final landing on Mr.U's planetoid, but it was actually about the visit to Miranda. (I'm not the only one to make the slip, it seems! Welcome from another recent delurkee, Browncoatish.)
I agree that was probably for dramatic reasons. Of course, it's not the first time they've left the ship unguarded on potentially unfriendly territory (see "Heart of Gold"). Presumably they locked the door this time, at least!
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Originally posted by DonCoat:Quote:Well, I don't claim to be an expert, but I thought the movie took place (will take place?) 8 months after the series ends (with Objects In Space). That's why I suggested 12-18 months from "Serenity" to "Serenity" .
I believe it's only been 8 months, not 18, since Serenity took the pair in.Quote:It looked to me as though Mal deliberately attacked the Reavers by nailing them with the cannon -- the idea being to draw the rest of the flotilla after them. Er... but maybe you meant they couldn't be sure there was a whole fleet of Alliance warships on hand. I guess I don't have an answer for that. Maybe Mal was practising Book's admonition to Believe?
My question is what the hell they would have done if the Alliance WASN'T there... they would have still had a fleet of pissed off reavers after them.
There is a line in the movie (after the incident at the maidenhead) where Mal says they've been on the ship for 8 months. (I think the timeline doesn't quite match up right, myself, and we had been told that the film was 6 months or so after the series ends. Somewhere someone is wrong, but I'd say the script is the one to go with).
As for the PO'd reaver fleet: I know the how and why that the movie showed. I know Mal thought there was a fleet of alliance warships at MU's place. I was just wondering what Mal would have done if he was WRONG :). Then again, Serenity seemed to be faster than the other ships (After all, none of the reavers caught up with them on the way to MU's place. The space battle slowed Serenity down some), they could have probably made it to MU's place and transmitted the signal before they got eaten alive. I'm sure MU would have appreciated that.
"Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government."
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Originally posted by mima:
9. zoe's questioning of mal after the mule chase.
i was like "whaaaaat?"
Which part? If you mean her talking about how Mal shot the guy, etc., I think that was simply explaining to the non-Browncoat audience. It explains that reavers are awful, that Mal was actually *helping* the guy by shooting him, etc.
If you mean about Mal kicking the guy off the mule in the first place, I don't really know, but probably the same reason, just more explanation. If you mean something entirely different, sorry.
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12. the operative would not leave mr. universe alive. he would not have been able to live long enough for that message.
Agreed. He should take his own life for a mistake like that (uh, by his code, not mine...).
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17. how was the operative able to control his little escape pod with enough accuracy to get back to mr. universe's home. and enter so easily/sneakily into an unknown building.
Unknown?! He was just there like 20 min. ago killing Mr. Universe! (Am I misunderstanding?)
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21. (from my husband) why was there no scene of emotional impact from the crew over wash's death?
Easy, because THEY'RE NOT REALLY DEAD! *keeps repeating over and over again to himself* Seriously though, it could be something tricky that will be explained in the sequel, but that's the topic of another thread. That kinda bothered me too though.
"Well...here I am...."
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Great thread. Most people already responded how I would to the questions about plot holes. Forgive the repetition, but I wanted to respond to all the original ones with my own words.
3: (Why didn't they just broadcast the feed to Mr. Universe from Miranda?) Remember when Mr. Universe says the ion cloud would play "merry hob" with their radar, I wonder if that would affect any recorded transmission, even if they were able to communicate person-to-person. And yeah, Serenity didn't look like it had that little disc player thing. I mean, it would have probably been in the cockpit, no? I never saw anything like it. Remember, the Firefly is old, way older than the catastrophe on Miranda.
4:(How did Serenity get off Mr. Universe's planet after it was all torn to bits?) Some of the Alliance ships are HUGE facilities, anyone remember the vertical green and black one from the series? That was like a whole small moon. I would not be surprised if they had enough stuff to refit the ship. Getting to it would have been hard. They may have used some gigantic mega-power crane to rip off the top of the facility to get to the ship and be able to pick it up.
5: This has already been covered but yeah, I thought the Op's arms were dislocated below the shoulderblades,although apparently they were broken, and Mal did this so that the Op wouldn't be able to reach anything and would have trouble getting up before watching the entire holocast.
6: The person who typed up the comparison of the Operative to a samurai answered this question beautifully, so I feel no need to add.
7: On Miranda, I think no one stayed with Serenity because they really didn't know what to expect on the planet and I think they were all scared as hell and wanted to stick together. Usually Wash stays with the ship but it seemed like he was tracking the beacon, maybe the others couldn't do it so well?
8: (Why didn't they put on their space helmets after the thought someone might have been killed by poison): I think when they found the first corpse and were talking about poison they didn't mean in the air, but something ingested. Also they had a lot of little scanners to test and see if the planet was free from toxins, radioactivity et cetera. Who is to say it couldn't scan for other dangers in the air as well?
9: (Zoe questioning Mal after the mule chase) I think she was reminded of so many others in their platoon who were killed who they would have never left. Remember, she never questions Mal unless she thinks something is really out of place. Also, Mal is a lot darker at the start of the movie (and why wouldn't he be, look what happened to them in the comics) and I think Zoe is trying to make sure he is making balanced decisions.
10: (Serenity facing a way that would seem difficult for the Reavers to shoot harpoons at, etc) This one, like many, I think is a valid question but I would have to watch the scene again frame by frame to be certain.
11: (About the Reavers still being able to reason a bit) Admittedly, I thought some of them were really just looking like orc zombies, although they were still scary because of their uncontrollable rage. They only seem to use reason occassionally when they are not in contact with other people, and I think Reavers probably kill each other very,very often. But when it's a mass attack you get a feeding frenzy,and all reason goes flying out the window.
12: (The Operative wouldn't leave Mr. Uni alive) Well, I think he was a little distracted, Mal was starting to actually get to him and make him angry. Also, I think he thought if by some chance the sword hadn't instantly killed him, that the Alliance people he left behind to destroy communications would have finished him off had Mr. Universe regained consciousness. They were not very thorough. After all,they didn't even touch the LoveBot.
13: (Where were all the people on Mr.Universe's planet) Again, the novelization covers this, but... from the movie we can tell that Mr Universe is a hermit who much prefers reading and sending and playing with the s
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Couple further thoughts about...
22. The mule wasn't damaged worse because it and Serenity were going the same direction. Serenity was just going somewhat faster. It would have been impossible to do the maneuver if the mule had been closing on Serenity; that's why Wash told Zoe to swing around.
Why didn't the Reavers follow? Here's my speculation: only that one shuttle full of Reavers ever saw the BDHs. With their blood up, they just took off after the mule, and never communicated to the rest of the raiding party. Then, the collision with Serenity caused the shuttle to crash, killing the remaining Reavers in that group or at least knocking out their comm and transport. The rest of them went on with their merry raping-to-death spree, never realizing that part of their number was missing until Serenity was well away (if ever).
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Originally posted by Browncoatish:
NOT cheesy! The whole movie led up to him behaving this way.
I think the Operative thought of himself as a pure Samurai. He was unwaveringly loyal to his soveriegn (the alliance) and repeatedly mentioned that his purpose, or job, was everything to him. He had no name, no rank, no place in fair society, only purpose. A VERY samurai perspective. He also seemed legitimately affected and insulted when Mal called him an "assassin", as a Samurai surely would.
I think more to the point is that he's an idealist. The Alliance isn't the ideal, it's the world without sin thing. The Alliance is just who he thinks can bring that world without sin forth.
He said to Mal that they were both monsters and had no place in the world without sin he was working towards. Mal not only showed him that the Alliance had tried to make a world without sin and it resulted in suicidal apathy as well as psychotic Reavers who are monsters well beyond what Mal and the Operative do. The Alliance just covered it all up and even the Operative didn't seem to know what happenned on Miranda. When confronted with such, any illusion he might have had about the Alliance being the hope for such an ideal was probably cracked if not completely shattered.
I never really questionned why he had a change of heart after finding out what the Alliance did at Miranda. It just made sense that he would given his ideal and what the Alliance did.
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Browncoatish - really nice first post. I totally agree - "There is nothing left to see", the operative is totally heading for the ritual suicide thing.
As for the "why didn't they just fax it" to Mr. Universe, well, others have pointed out they may not have had the tech - but also maybe the full on holagram would have had necessary veritas to not be blown off as a fake.
Most importantly, however, the Alliance was there, just faxing it would not have worked. Now as to why it was not tried, technology cooperating, Mal is paranoid enough to want to deliver it personal, and they were not far, and they sure did not want to stay where they were anyway.
See how I'm not punching him, I think I've grown!
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Originally posted by Tomanta:
There is a line in the movie (after the incident at the maidenhead) where Mal says they've been on the ship for 8 months. (I think the timeline doesn't quite match up right, myself, and we had been told that the film was 6 months or so after the series ends. Somewhere someone is wrong, but I'd say the script is the one to go with).
Did you mean the script is the one to go with being wrong or right?
You are right that there is a line that says the movie takes place 8 months after the episode Serenity. If the movie takes place 6 months after OiS, then the entire series takes place in only 2 months. This is hard to believe, especially since half a year takes place between OMR and Trash.
Even if months and years have a different meaning, its still hard to accept.
I think the 6 months later is wrong. Its more believable to think that the movie takes place 2 months after OiS than 6.
I'm not sure where the 6 months came from, but the novel supports it.
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