How Universal treats you, its customers
POSTED BY: SebastianFelis
UPDATED: Friday, September 16, 2005 19:32
VIEWED: 24499
PAGE 2 of 11
> I'm not sure what I'm missing here, so help me out.
Happily.
> It looks like a standard disclaimer to appear on video to me
And to me. Difference is, you usually get to read and sign it beforehand.
It's something that people normally seem to put up with; I'm just not that passive.
> It's just like a video game liscense to play; you buy the game then have to agree to their terms to play it.
Nailed, right there. You buy, _then_ agree to their terms.
I have this problem with Microsoft as well: you don't get to read the EULA for Windows until after you've booted it up, by which point the license says you've agreed.
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> The point, then, is that you're angry about something you wouldn't have been angry about if presented differently?
Yup. That's pretty much it.
> And, as a result of this, you are going to sue Universal Pictures
Unlikely. As you point out, they have deeper pockets than I do. However, I'd probably stand a chance of winning on the merits.
> Considering you wouldn't have minded otherwise, perhaps writing a letter saying this was handled poorly, in your opinion...
Exactly my next step. I'm working out the response at the moment, and will be faxing it to them.
> If you feel the need to sue, go ahead, but it seems like a whole lot of work without any change likely.
There is that. But as more people start speaking up about what is annoying them, like this, the more that the likes of Universal start to realise they're upsetting the people whose money they're relying on.
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> What would be the damage done to you as the basis for a suit? Do you think that you would deserve compensation for the intelligent comments you make in the Q&A?
Fair question. I'd like to think that my comments are usually intelligent and worthy of remuneration, but since I didn't actually speak into a microphone, I wouldn't get far on that basis.
No, I'd be demanding compensation for the use of my likeness, on the same basis as any actor. If they want to use my face on film, they can pay for it.
> You were handed a notice, if you read it and didn't like it, you could, I'm sure ask for your money back.
Fair call. To be honest, that didn't actually occur to me at the time.
But this still wouldn't help the people who weren't given the notice and therefore didn't know about this, nor those who only read it afterwards.
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As they fully gave you the option to back out, with compensation I'm sure, I really don't see your complaint.
Yes, they could've made it more explicit slightly earlier, but that's about it. As they said "Please speak to the management" not "fuck off and die", I think they just figured most people wouldn't object and didn't worry about alerting you sooner.
Note I'm making the assumption the "consent form" is similar to the posted sign, just more deatiled. If it isn't, then that's odd, and ignore my point.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jacqui:Quote:
in any and all media now known and hereinafter invented in any and all languages in perpetuity throughout the universe
I guess they wanted to be thourough, huh?
Did they really need to add 'the universe'? Seriously? Are there many people going to sue from Mars?
*~*~*
"Your toes are in the sand."
"And your head's up your..."
"Hey!"
Possibly. Have you _seen_ what kind of a litigation culture the USA has, and that is developing here in Australia?
Apparently they're forward-looking in at least one respect...
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> As they fully gave you the option to back out, with compensation I'm sure, I really don't see your complaint.
No mention of compensation. And what about the people who never received one of those letters, or who only read it afterwards? Too late for them to back out.
The "please speak to the management" line doesn't appear here. It was on a sign that somebody else posted a picture of, in the first comment to this post.
They are indeed figuring that nobody will object. We're only consumers, after all...
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What are you winjing for?
It's VIVENDI UNIVERSAL, a big corporation.
You can't possibly be surprised, can you?
When it comes to you vs "the corporation", "the corporation" is treated as a human entity, only moreso. When it comes to The Corporation, you have no rights.
(Take a stroll around their website. See how much shit they own:
http://www.vivendiuniversal.com)
As far as that leagalese stuff, I think it's called "implied consent", no?
Like if you go to a sporting event, look on the back of the parking lot stub and on the back of the ticket stub.
There's a whole bunch of legalese that pretty much says if you come in here, you waive all of your rights. Your car gets broken into? Oh well.
You get hit by a flying ball or player? C'est la vie.
Welcome to the New World Order: They Own You.
(All Hail The Mighty Alliance.)
"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe
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I'm not entirely suprised, but that attitude is exactly why they have this much power: millions of people have given it to them.
I have a reasonable grasp of what they own, yes.
And while the consent was inferred, "implied" is a bit of an ask, and it _definitely_ wasn't granted.
> Welcome to the New World Order: They Own You.
No, they don't. They only own you to the extent that you agree... so how far do they own you?
And, out of curiosity, who are They? Might be me; I work for a multinational megacorporation, though I don't buy their product.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SebastianFelis:
>We're only consumers, after all...
You have so got that right.
And I've gotten to the point that I resent being "pitched" to constantly.
Max Headroom, 1984, Farenheit 451...
"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe
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That kind of retro-active legal covering of one's ass has been going on for awhile here. Probably because it has yet to be challenged in court.
I remember a similar situation back in 1991 at the first Lollapalooza festival. Perry Farrell had grand plans to make a film about his unique touring festiva. There were signs everywhere around the entrance to the fairgrounds stating we spectators could very well be filmed for this project and by entering the grounds we forfeit any claim to our appearance in the piece. If we didn't want to be in it we could leave and forfeit our ticket.
It wasn't completely after-the-fact (we found out about the filming thing on the way IN before the ticket taker) but the stipulation about the film project and our rights never came up at the time of purchasing the ticket.
This type of thing is just what happens in a culture addicted to its lawyers. I'm not sure what the litigiousness is like down in Oz hopefully not as bad as it is here in the States.
I apologize that our rampant lawyerism© has affected you negatively, or at all.
I suspect this kind of manuever in actuality amounts to a legal bluff. My feeling is that if one were to actually challenge their personal appearance in a commercial media project (DVD bonus, indy film, etc.) that Universal (in this case) would have to come up with something more substantial than a retro-active "oh, by the way..." clause at the time of the event in question. I'm not sure you could win royalty payments from the project but a decision could force Universal to blur out your face on the final product. I could see them having to recall unsold DVD sets at the worst (for them).
A decent class action lawsuit could set a precedent and prevent these types of questionable after-the-fact-and-sans-signature type manuevers, however... wouldn't such a suit simply be feeding the legal beast more kibbles and bits again anyway?
mattro
PS: BTW, I do hereby retroactively claim the phrase "rampant lawyerism" © as my own for all future commercial endeavors. By reading this sentence you relinquish all commercial rights to the phrase "rampant lawyerism" ©
So there.
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