Firefly Music Videos - Download Now
POSTED BY: Succatash
UPDATED: Thursday, December 4, 2003 00:31
VIEWED: 56712
PAGE 8 of 22
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And I'm sorry, but this is not between just Nia and Maniac. Everyone who has or had a Firefly vid has been affected. Everyone who wants to see a Firefly vid has been affected because the vids are gone and not coming back. Ever. And, judging by the reaction of the vidding community, there will be no more online, if at all, for fear someone will upload them.
WORD. I'm an active vidder in other fandoms and I love Firefly, and I was planning some Firefly vids, but there's no way in hell I'm putting up them up now.
I can understand some well-meaning fan making a gaffe. Truly. That doesn't mean I wouldn't be angry, but I can understand it. What I can't understand is how these people can be so pigheaded in the face of the reaction they've received.
Let me tell you a story. I run a large tech support team for a very large website. A few weeks ago, some of us played an April Fool's joke. It was pretty elaborate, involved a couple of related websites. And some people were hurt by it. They felt that this prank had eroded their trust in myself and the other people who led them.
Do I understand why they felt that way? No. I really don't. But I still talked to my fellow managers and convinced them to release a formal apology. Because if you hurt someone with your actions, you suck it up and apologise. Otherwise, you're an asshole.
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Originally posted by ManiacNumberOne:Quote:
You should direct your question to Nia and LJC. They reported (along with other's as well, I am now beginning to suspect) to Succatash's ISP that he was hosting copyrighted material. They got him closed down. So it seems they are the ones with the real manacing intent. Worry about them.
Here's a question. Do you think that maybe Suck's website got taken down because he used too much bandwidth with everyone running there to download those vids? That can happen, you know. It happens to newbie vidders all the time until they find a webhost with enough bandwidth allotment. I use over 25G a month myself (or I did, until I removed everything).
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Divide and Conquer, baby.
This is what the Alliance-Fox wants us to do, rip one another apart so we can no long stand against them. Soon they'll have the world brain washed on Reality TV and with us divided we cannot stand against them.
What's life if there is no conspiracy against you?
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Someone above mentioned that fan vids have been around for a long time, although they underestimated just how long that has been.
Vids have been around since the *Sixties*, guys. Since the time of original Trek, Man From UNCLE, Starsky and Hutch, Professionals, and countless other fandoms, fans have spent amazing amounts of time, money, and effort in creating these works of art for fellow fans and for themselves. They started with your basic vcrs, copy-cords, and similar editing equipment, and taught themselves how to edit, how to adjust for rollback, how to create effects, how to time their cuts and action sequences to music, etc. It is only within the last decade that vids have gone digital and have been posted to the net. Maniac, Succatash - Firefly does not have the monopoly on vids, so yes, this issue *does* affect all of fandom.
The issue of distributing vids without the creator's permission is not new either, unfortunately. In the old days, the creator would try to distribute their vids on a person-to-person basis, but in fandom, yes, people want to share. So, fan #1 would dub the tape of vids for fan #2, who might then make a tape for fans 3 and 4, and then you end up with 4th generation tapes somewhere down the line that are of crappy quality and might not have the vidder's original contact info on it anymore. It happened, but at least it was still between fans. No one went and gave the tapes to TPTB, nor did they post them in a public place.
What you've done might've originally been a simple mistake, but you've subsequently proven that not only were you ignorant of the "rules", but you don't care to know, even when others have posted about the legalities, consequences, and basic expectations of courtesy involved. You decide that you're entitled to anything you find on the 'net, regardless of who it belongs to or how these things are done. When you ask where all this "tradition" has come from, you really show how little you seem to know about fandom and its origins.
Vids are indeed art. Ever try to make one? Vidders spend a great deal of their spare time making a quality product for you to enjoy, and often a great deal of money as well, on equipment, source material, and (for online vidders) webspace. They do this because they love the shows from which they vid (the *only* requirement for being a "true fan"), not because they owe it to you. You are not entitled to their work just because you are a fan. With online vids you're getting something for free; this doesn't mean you get to dictate what that something is, how it's presented, or how it's controlled. *That* is what's selfish and arrogant.
Nia, Bonibaru, and several others have tried esplaining things and have been very polite in the face of your tirades. They gave you facts; you responded with cheap insults and dodgy answers. Now you've managed to ruin a large section of fandom, possibly all of online vidding, for everyone. This doesn't just affect your precious Firefly (which I enjoyed, but your histrionics certainly won't draw me, or anyone else, into such a fandom).
Try reading Henry Jenkins' Textual Poachers for some info about old-style vidding. "Fan videos are a source of pride not only to the artists who created them but to the fandom from which they originated, standing as a tangible demonstration of the value derived from endless hours of collecting tapes and watching episodes. What the videos articulate is what the fans have in common: their shared understandings, their mutual interests, their collective fantasies."
Learn a little more about fandom before you try to dictate how it should be run, boys.
Castalia
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Ah. Now I know why it's suddenly so difficult to find Firefly fan-works. Don't really have anything new to add -- what was already said seems to say it all. Just wanted to say that my support -- whatever it's worth -- is with the vidders. I know I couldn't do what you guys do -- I haven't got the skill. Thanks for all your hard work, and it's just sad that it had to come to this. 
-- Joce :(
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You people are so disgusting! Instead of using your artwork to promote Firefly, you are using Firefly to promote your artwork.
Firefly should not be exploited so self-important artists can get recognition for their illegal work.
I want the show back on the air. I want Firefly to have a larger fan base. Fan artwork is a great way to spread the Firefly word. But it's got to be shared.
You "vidders" have screwed up because you are more worried about your fame and personal glory then you are saving Firefly.
And to the assholes who complained to my web host and got my site shut down: You are the most hypocritical of all, true Browncoat traitors. Shame on all of you!
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That sucks
I really enjoyed those
Its too bad some people have to cause a stink when they could just leave well enough alone.
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You know, this whole argument is not about LEAGALITIES. It's about MANNERS.
As I understand it, someone created something (using material created by others, but that doesn't matter, it's still hard work). Someone else took it. The first person asked "Please don't do that." The second person said "Screw you. You suck. I'll do what I want."
Is that about it?
I'm working on a fun little vid set to Dire Straits' "The Bug". Pity no one's gonna see it.
Bill
Arguing on the internet is like winning the special olympics. You may win, but you're still retarded.
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Well, here are my two cents: Anyone who creates fanfic or vids does so out of love for the show. However, once you distribute it on the internet you have lost all control over it.
If it is so important that you get recognition for you work I suggest that you incorperate your name into the work. Even Van Gogh signed his paintings.
If it is important that you remain annonymous, then don't sign it.
As far as your actions regarding shutting down his site, that was rude and uncalled for.
Your main purpose for asking him to C&D hosting your vid was because you feared getting caught making a vid. So then you turn around and hand him in to the same people you are trying to hide from. That is backstabbing plain and simple.
So in conclusion all I can assume is that NEED TO RECOGNIZED, yet FEAR to be CAUGHT. I'm afraid you can't have it both ways.
"Societies are supported by human activity, therefore they are constantly threatened by the human facts of self-intrest and stupidity." --Peter Berger
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With online vids you're getting something for free; this doesn't mean you get to dictate what that something is, how it's presented, or how it's controlled.
Why not?
I am sure that the producers of every show would argue the same thing about fan-art in whatever form.
Do you honestly expect that because you personally have put hours into something it should be treated differently than everything else? It truely seems hypocrytical that you belive your works are entitled to special consideration when they are in fact stolen ideas. You, me, we are thieves. We break a dimond necklace and ruby broach to make a jeweled crown. Does that make the crown ours? No.
We are not entitled to complain about what other people do with it especially when all that person is doing is exhibiting and sharing your "art" with other people.
I think I should remind you of the fan-subbers motto: "For fans, by fans. If you have paid for this, you have been cheated."
There is never an excuse for a fan-artist to get upset over the distribution of thier art.
"Societies are supported by human activity, therefore they are constantly threatened by the human facts of self-intrest and stupidity." --Peter Berger
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