War crimes in Afghanistan

POSTED BY: Daikath
UPDATED: Thursday, June 16, 2005 23:00
VIEWED: 4240
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DAIKATH

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 10:50 AM

This is all in dutch but it delivers proof of warcrimes being commited by the Us army in Afghanistan.

Although the program might be dutch it includes quotes by actual Us soldiers in english, subtitled with original speech.

http://www.novatv.nl/index.cfm?cfid=37421873&cftoken=72836271&ln=nl&fu
seaction=videoaudio.details&reportage_id=3506

On the lefthand side of the text piece there click on video.

Watch the video and on 0:08:20 you will hear a US soldier blatantly saying that anyone who works with the Taliban will be killed without a trial or anything.

On 0:08:40 you will hear a Us soldier speaking in english that they don't take prisoners but rather shoot them. All because if they go to Guantanamo Bay they will become mad and the same thing will happen 30 years from now.

Im not trying to be labeled as a leftist, but even the moderate right poeple here have to agree that this goes against the rules we ourselfes have set.

DAIKATH

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:39 AM

No, but the speech in the video on the timeframes I mentioned are in english done by US soldiers only translated into dutch through subtitles.

edit: You knew that but sorry, it was on a dutch current events show.

edit 2: I'll tranlate it tonight when I have the chance, it is mostly about the dutch involvement with it all though (and a reason for not participating would clearly be the violation of those said laws).

CONNORFLYNN

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 12:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Daikath:
No, but the speech in the video on the timeframes I mentioned are in english done by US soldiers only translated into dutch through subtitles.

edit: You knew that but sorry, it was on a dutch current events show.

edit 2: I'll tranlate it tonight when I have the chance, it is mostly about the dutch involvement with it all though (and a reason for not participating would clearly be the violation of those said laws).

Anyone documenting the War Crimes of the opposition? It drives me crazy to have the media continuosly chase a few instances of supposed war crimes by the coalition, yet stay quiet about the atrocities committed by the Taliban and company.

I wish these shitheels would stop going after the troops. War is hell.

Bleh.

DAIKATH

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:22 PM

Two wrongs don't make a right. This is a violation of our own rules we as a society made.

Just because the other side doesn't follow them doesn't mean we shouldt be civilised.

CONNORFLYNN

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:49 PM

I don't disagree with you Daikath about whether or not War Crimes are wrong. What I disagree with is the bullshit propaganda and purposeful attempts to shed Our military in a negative light, while NOT shedding light on the other side.

If someone commits a war crime, they should be held accountable.

However, Pointing out everytime someone on OUR side commits a supposed "war crime" (while conveniently NOT pointing out the other sides atrocities) AND not pointing out everytime someone does something good is BLATANT MANIPULATION of the truth. It is bullshit propaganda. It is inflammatory, negative and non-productive. It also tends to turn people off from listening to any REALLY productive discourse, because they see it for what it is.

SIGMANUNKI

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 4:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:

purposeful attempts to shed Our military in a negative light

This isn't exactly hard. Your military admitts it as shown in the interview(s) therein. This is more a purposeful truth telling. If you don't like the content, then perhaps you should start to do something about getting your military to behave in a proper manner.

Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:

If someone commits a war crime, they should be held accountable.

I don't think anyone here is saying anything to the contrary.

Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:

However, Pointing out everytime someone on OUR side commits a supposed "war crime" (while conveniently NOT pointing out the other sides atrocities) AND not pointing out everytime someone does something good is BLATANT MANIPULATION of the truth.

How is it a "BLATANT MANIPULATION of the truth"?

This isn't something with spin on it. There are actual US soldiers admitting to things.

You'll never get the balance you seek in a news article or what-have-you. You need a full blown documentary. And even then you'll probably need two as both sides have so much content (actually probably a series of documentaries for both sides).

And from where I sit, everytime a bomb goes off or what-have-you in Iraq or Afganistan or ... it hits the news. There is your other side.

Just because they don't present it in every article doesn't mean that that balance doesn't exist. It's just elsewhere. That's called keeping the article on topic.

I could say (following your logic) that everytime a news story covers a suicide bombing or what-not that since the US's war crimes aren't being told in that story that it is a "BLATANT MANIPULATION of the truth" and "bullshit propaganda".

But I don't because the balance is elsewhere.

Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:

It is bullshit propaganda. It is inflammatory, negative and non-productive. It also tends to turn people off from listening to any REALLY productive discourse, because they see it for what it is.

And how is ignoring it productive?

While I lived in the US, since I couldn't work for visa reasons, I decided to compare the different news stations. I noticed that watching BBC World, which was a 1/2 hour program once a day on PBS, I got more information from that then I did from all other stations combined thoughout the week. Those other stations included, local news, CNN, F*x, MSNBC, etc.

That is bullshit propaganda. The media feeding there listeners/watchers what they want to hear and censoring out what doesn't fit with the party line.

If you want people to listen to proper discourse then you should be working to get your "news" stations in the US to actually tell the news and not the spinned, censored BS that they are pumping out now.

You have to go outside of the US to get anything meaningful. That should change.

----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show

HERO

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 4:46 PM

The article, if it says what you claim it says, is not uncommon in this conflict. Some call it journalism, but it is more commonly and accurately known as "pure horseshit".

It is designed to undermine the international war effort by casting unjust accusations on the character and conduct of the American soldiers and the United States government. The ultimate goal is not to support the war on terror, but rather to make sure the US suffers as much political damage as possible in the hopes that US prestige and international influence is replaced on the world stage by more "progessive" forces.

This laudable goal is in turn enthusiatically supported by those who seek a return to more "controlled" forms of government, since "progressives" tend to embrace compromise and appeasement which are the building blocks that a good tyranny needs to survive and prosper. America has proven itself time and again the greatest hinderance to such tyrannical movements, so if they are to reassert themselves, America, or at least American influence, must be removed as an obsticle.

H

DAIKATH

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 4:55 PM

Don't believe me? Read the first post and see that if you click on the video and watch the mentioned times. Then you for youself can see american soldiers THEMSELFES admit to stuff wich are warcrimes.

This entire post is saying nothing about wheter or not the war is bad, just commenting on the way it is fought.

Like I said again, read the first post, see that if you see the article there is an icon on the left hand side wich says video, if you click on it you may see a dutch television programme.

But on the mentioned times you SEE and HEAR US soldiers THEMSELFES admitting to that stuff. I didn't know US soldiers on the battlefield were pure horseshit Hero.

I want the US policing the world and am of opinion the EU should also pay for a decent sized millitary to help along. The world is better for it. But that doesn't give soldiers in the field of battle doing important stuff a licsense to wipe their ass with the Geneva convention.

Still think is horseshit, read my first post and actually watch the video to SEE and HEAR US soldiers in their own language (all you might see is dutch subtitles) saying they do that stuff.

CONNORFLYNN

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:16 PM

Yep..your right Signa:

They are all evil war criminals. Every bomb that drops in an armed conflict is a war crime.. what the f*** was I thinking.

You're right, Spinning/editing every newscast or article to portray ALL American and Coalition soldiers as War criminals isn't propaganda. NEVER showing or doing a newscast on the good that is being done in Iraq and Afghanistan by Coalition forces is being unbiased and uncensored.

Its all untainted unwashed uncleansed unbiased.

I have 3 words for you:

"Here's your sign"

Anyone who has ever been in a war knows, war is brutal on the body and the mind. Noone who actually fights in it ever wins and sure, crimes will be committed, how can they not. To CONSTANTLY say The Troops should be held to higher standard is a F****** joke. Let me stick your ass in a humvee for 2 years and have people shoot at you every day inside and out, who don't wear uniforms, don't speak your language and have a tendency to blow themselves up at inopportune times near you. I'll have you sit by and watch your bunkmates and fellow soldiers die at the hands of the fundamentalist Islamic guerillas. Then ask you NOT to lose your cool EVER. To even claim that it is possible to prevent war crimes from ever occurring in war is to live in a f****** fantasy world.

To take on this bullshit mentality that by watching/reading a one-sided edited/fabricated/spun videocast or article is PROOF of a lack of bias proves what a tool you are.

Can you name on 1 hand ANY Positive news out of Iraq or Afghanistan that the Mainstream media or any of these other World Media have presented,about ANYTHING that the Coalition has done. Any? Not even a little bit? Okies okies..how about just 1 thing? Aw comeon..it's not taht hard or is it?

No because it wouldn't fit their G******* propaganda infected agenda.

It appalls me. I despise it and the self righteous neo-pacifist pinkos who claim that my friends and family are evil and war criminals. I guarantee you, I ever hear someone say that outloud in my presence, they'll be breathing through a goddamned tube for the next 4 months of their lives. Go visit a Veteran Hospital, and tell me they are all war criminals. Go visit the families of the fallen and tell them that the American Military and coalition MIlitary are all war criminals. THATS WHAT THIS SHIT SAYS!!! It's spun that way on purpose.

I don't agree with the reasons behind the war in Iraq, but I won't sit idly by and read or listen to someone slam our troops. You don't like the war, go after my government. Leave my soldiers alone.

God Bless the US and Coalition Troops, may they come home as safe as they can and as soon as they can. To all the haters out there

DAIKATH

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 9:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:
Yep..your right Signa:

Just asking before I comment on your entire post and digging through the Geneva convention for the entire thing. But was your long post just aimed at Sigma or also at me?

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